Trinnov Altitude 16 Review (AV Processor)

[Fidji]

Yes, after a DBA or Multi Sub the critical range is from the XO to your subs till Schroeder. In my setup it is like this. I have 4 subs optimzied by MSO. Very good response and seat to seat consistency to about 120Hz and till 200Hz still better than my fronts. XO is at 120Hz therefore. Active absorbing via MIMO till 200Hz would be very helpful here since I cannot stick so much passive absorbtion to solve the problems from 120-200Hz.

Maybe slight off topic (no idea about you channel status) - I used MSO/Flex with great results.
Now I get even better with combination of Trinnov 4 way cross over. I just measure each sub individually in REW, cut the first mode around 30Hz, use BM delay proposed by Trinnov - and get very good results for MLP.

sounds more defined than MSO. YMMV

 

[hmt]

That could also work good. Actually in the moment I use 5.1.4 in the trinnov whereas the MiniDSP 2X4HD controls my 4 subs that are optimized by MSO.

 

[Fidji]

One thing to consider- XLR to RCA can be a problem, lot of people report it and even this Neutrik transformer has mixed success. (Mine subs are now all XLR, but I had one RCA only and it Was working onoy with rca output of Alt32.

i have my 4 subs front spaced approx 80 cm, trying to emulate Neumann Planar Wave and 2 subs in rear corners,

 

[hmt]

I circumvent this problem via the digital out on the A16. The minidsp is hooked up via optical out. For testing purposes I also have an XLR to RCA adapter where I disconnected pin 1 by myself. Also worked.

 

[Fidji]

This is how it looks - just employing 4 way crossover and PEQ at around 30Hz - S1 purplee line. My front subs are set at -12 db gain and rears at -9dB (scale -24 +6) so endless headroom on the sub side.

 

[hmt]

The most interesting measure is however how the sum of the subs look like.

 

[Fidji]

The most interesting measure is however how the sum of the subs look like.

Yes, this is S1 - four subs together.

S2&S3 are used only for Bass Management of Wides, Surrounds, Rear surrounds and Ltm and Rtr, split into 2 zones.
S1 handles LFE, C, and 3 Front Heigjts.

 

[Adi777]

I have 24CH(+4) Alt32 9.6.7 I plan to add 2 more subs for Magic Bass.

Have you some pictures of your system on ASR?

 

[Fidji]

Trinnov | Trinnov to release a major software update for the Altitude

Trinnov will release a major software update for the Altitude platform bringing significant improvements to the acclaimed Optimizer technology

www.trinnov.com

in case somebody would miss this information.

done some recalibration- love individual excursion curve. This was really missing.

 

[hwest]

Trinnov | Trinnov to release a major software update for the Altitude

Trinnov will release a major software update for the Altitude platform bringing significant improvements to the acclaimed Optimizer technology

www.trinnov.com

in case somebody would miss this information.

done some recalibration- love individual excursion curve. This was really missing.

Realistically to get things the way you want them how much time do you have to spend on tweaking their optimizer, I understand one could spend a lifetime in there I'm a fan of Trinnov (of course who isn't).

 

[sarumbear]

Realistically to get things the way you want them how much time do you have to spend on tweaking their optimizer, I understand one could spend a lifetime in there I'm a fan of Trinnov (of course who isn't).

There are lots of pre-sets. You do not have to tweak them to benefit from what the device offers.

 

[Fidji]

Realistically to get things the way you want them how much time do you have to spend on tweaking their optimizer, I understand one could spend a lifetime in there I'm a fan of Trinnov (of course who isn't).

It is equal part of the hobby - I usually spend one afternoon once in 1-2 months re-calibrating, after I do some changes to the whole system. Enjoying the process.

And yes, level of customization TRINNOV offers is just out of this world. Just as an example - there are 7 (seven] different parameters, that influence such simple thing, that is "level alignment" of the speakers.

I would like to hear works of some legendary calibrators, where people say, it brings whole setup to the diff level, after they spend 2 days tweaking your system.

 

[Bugal1998]

Realistically to get things the way you want them how much time do you have to spend on tweaking their optimizer, I understand one could spend a lifetime in there I'm a fan of Trinnov (of course who isn't).

I can’t answer your question directly… but other than maybe the initial learning curve, it takes no longer than any other system to get good results. The difference is you have the potential to take things even farther with Trinnov if you’re so inclined.

I just wish I understood the use of the more advanced settings… does anyone know of a detailed and comprehensive guide with explanations of how and when to use all the advanced settings?

I would like to hear works of some legendary calibrators, where people say, it brings whole setup to the diff level, after they spend 2 days tweaking your system.

Same! I have managed to get my system sounding amazingly good (IMO), but if it can be better I would gladly pay for a pro to work their magic. But it would be disappointing to spend thousands on one of these legendary calibrators and see no improvement, or worse, not like the results.

 

[Mr. Widget]

But it would be disappointing to spend thousands on one of these legendary calibrators and see no improvement, or worse, not like the results.

Yes it would.
I think the likelihood of that depends on how careful you did the task yourself and what your expectations are.

If you spent weeks or months carefully viewing and listening to a wide variety of content and making subtle adjustments along the way you could get the room extremely close to what they can do in a day or two. However, if you have a preference for booming over powering bass or some other unique room curve, then you probably would not like the results of the best calibration and should save the money.

 

[Fidji]

I can’t answer your question directly… but other than maybe the initial learning curve, it takes no longer than any other system to get good results. The difference is you have the potential to take things even farther with Trinnov if you’re so inclined.

I just wish I understood the use of the more advanced settings… does anyone know of a detailed and comprehensive guide with explanations of how and when to use all the advanced settings?



Same! I have managed to get my system sounding amazingly good (IMO), but if it can be better I would gladly pay for a pro to work their magic. But it would be disappointing to spend thousands on one of these legendary calibrators and see no improvement, or worse, not like the results.

Trinnov guides are very descriptive, but less informative. Anyway if you have some experience with REW and e.g Audyssey MulteqX app, MiniDsp or similar, it is much easier.
I currently use MiniDsp Flexx2 for +4 duty, not because of channel count, but because I use MSO calculated All Pass Filters to get best multi-sub alignment, leaving PEQ duty to Trinnov

Here is my stereo preset - aligned with Trinnov support [I have electrostats, so some setting might be specific]
Main: 8cycles, 1/6 octave
Advanced:

Excusion curve:

I also use PEQ Pre-Calibration on my L-R-C and subs in order to cut first mode freq. at around 29Hz [measured by REW and REW filters applied - this is one of th tricks, that hel me stay within +- 6dB range]

 

[Bugal1998]

Yes it would.
I think the likelihood of that depends on how careful you did the task yourself and what your expectations are.

If you spent weeks or months carefully viewing and listening to a wide variety of content and making subtle adjustments along the way you could get the room extremely close to what they can do in a day or two. However, if you have a preference for booming over powering bass or some other unique room curve, then you probably would not like the results of the best calibration and should save the money.

Starting with the average Harman listener preference curve as a baseline, and then weeks and months fine tuning based on a wide variety of recordings is exactly what I've been doing.

A bit of tweaking based on the speaker's anechoic dispersion traits, fine tuning the crossover setting to smooth the sub-to-Mains integration, and a bit of tweaking of the target curve between 40hz and 150hz has me pretty happy.

Spaciousness and envelopment in the room is the best I've ever experienced, but I'd love even more (wouldn't we all!) if some of the advanced settings could get me there.

 

[DonH56]

I am pretty sure that my system is "over-tweaked" now, with too many hi-resolution filters to get the response flatter (for one seat) than it really needs to be, and I am not convinced I have the subs integrated optimally. I have played with the Optimizer a few times but the last couple of years has been crazy so I never got enough time to really piddle and dial it in like I have previous systems. It sounds very good to me now, unlike some earlier AVR/AVPs, so I have not had a strong rationale to spend the time.

I tried to arrange a calibrator but we kept missing dates (he was busy, I was busy, ultimately never happened but I am still hopeful). Partly due to COVID and partly due to finances, my plan was (and is) to hook up with a guy who will do it remotely. Basically a day of calls and/or WebEx (or whatever) while he manipulates my system from afar with me on-site to do HW manipulations as needed (microphone setups, rebooting the processor, etc.) That gets the cost down considerably, though you miss local interaction with the calibrator, and it requires a day of my time vs. letting him just have at it and coming back when it's done. But I am excited about the prospect of working with him -- if and when! Since acoustics is not my day job I am really looking forward to hearing his insights.

 

[Mr. Widget]

I am pretty sure that my system is "over-tweaked" now, with too many hi-resolution filters to get the response flatter (for one seat) than it really needs to be, and I am not convinced I have the subs integrated optimally. I have played with the Optimizer a few times but the last couple of years has been crazy so I never got enough time to really piddle and dial it in like I have previous systems. It sounds very good to me now, unlike some earlier AVR/AVPs, so I have not had a strong rationale to spend the time.

From my experience, less is usually better. I am not sure if it is due to DSP induced phase shifts or due to something else, but in every system that I have heard or have been personally involved with, if you keep working the curves past a point it gets progressively less "natural" sounding.

I tried to arrange a calibrator but we kept missing dates (he was busy, I was busy, ultimately never happened but I am still hopeful). Partly due to COVID and partly due to finances, my plan was (and is) to hook up with a guy who will do it remotely. Basically a day of calls and/or WebEx (or whatever) while he manipulates my system from afar with me on-site to do HW manipulations as needed (microphone setups, rebooting the processor, etc.) That gets the cost down considerably, though you miss local interaction with the calibrator, and it requires a day of my time vs. letting him just have at it and coming back when it's done. But I am excited about the prospect of working with him -- if and when! Since acoustics is not my day job I am really looking forward to hearing his insights.

I'm sure this can be helpful, but every calibration where we hire an outside calibrator or if we are performing the calibration ourselves, there is always some degree of subjective evaluation in concert with the measurements from the mic feeds. With the calibrator being remote, you won't get his vast experience from his having heard many other rooms.

 

[Fidji]

I am pretty sure that my system is "over-tweaked" now, with too many hi-resolution filters to get the response flatter (for one seat) than it really needs to be, and I am not convinced I have the subs integrated optimally. I have played with the Optimizer a few times but the last couple of years has been crazy so I never got enough time to really piddle and dial it in like I have previous systems. It sounds very good to me now, unlike some earlier AVR/AVPs, so I have not had a strong rationale to spend the time.

I tried to arrange a calibrator but we kept missing dates (he was busy, I was busy, ultimately never happened but I am still hopeful). Partly due to COVID and partly due to finances, my plan was (and is) to hook up with a guy who will do it remotely. Basically a day of calls and/or WebEx (or whatever) while he manipulates my system from afar with me on-site to do HW manipulations as needed (microphone setups, rebooting the processor, etc.) That gets the cost down considerably, though you miss local interaction with the calibrator, and it requires a day of my time vs. letting him just have at it and coming back when it's done. But I am excited about the prospect of working with him -- if and when! Since acoustics is not my day job I am really looking forward to hearing his insights.

If I understood some of the discussions on calibrators correctly, big part of their knowledge is in knowing what and how to measure and they usually use things like Smaart suite etc. I still remember trying to buy my acoustic treatment "scientifically" during corona, when I was dragging sub around the room to take approx. 50 measurements in REW and then couple of sweeps for mains. This was all needed just to properly assess how many treatments would be needed ....

Curious how this remote process would work. I can hear differences between different calibrations - as I started to do multi-point measurements [up to 15 for 2 listening positions] and it improved overall experience quite dramatically. [I have 2 sets of presets - one for "solo" and one for "romantic" with different weights for each measurement group]

 

[DonH56]

From my experience, less is usually better. I am not sure if it is due to DSP induced phase shifts or due to something else, but in every system that I have heard or have been personally involved with, if you keep working the curves past a point it gets progressively less "natural" sounding.


I'm sure this can be helpful, but every calibration where we hire an outside calibrator or if we are performing the calibration ourselves, there is always some degree of subjective evaluation in concert with the measurements from the mic feeds. With the calibrator being remote, you won't get his vast experience from his having heard many other rooms.

Both good points. In-person is undoubtedly best, but costs thousands more, and at the time COVID travel restrictions were in full play. If and when I try to hook up again my dealer and a couple of other locals may try to get him out for several days and pool travel costs. TBD.

If I understood some of the discussions on calibrators correctly, big part of their knowledge is in knowing what and how to measure and they usually use things like Smaart suite etc. I still remember trying to buy my acoustic treatment "scientifically" during corona, when I was dragging sub around the room to take approx. 50 measurements in REW and then couple of sweeps for mains. This was all needed just to properly assess how many treatments would be needed ....

I've a couple of measurement systems but am not sure what he would do. We discussed it but frankly I've forgotten the plan for "external" measurements, if any.

Curious how this remote process would work. I can hear differences between different calibrations - as I started to do multi-point measurements [up to 15 for 2 listening positions] and it improved overall experience quite dramatically. [I have 2 sets of presets - one for "solo" and one for "romantic" with different weights for each measurement group]

He'd run the tools and do the cal with me helping and listening. The plan was (is) to set up a number of presets to choose from, giving me time to decide which I like best, then potentially dial it in later in a separate session.

Given it's a couple of years later, in-person is a better option, but I have to watch finances a bit more closely now. I haven't really thought about this again, need to cogitate.