GR Research B24 AC Cable Review Follow up [Entertainment]

[Sonny1]

Hello everybody…

Another excellent Johnny Amir, as expected. I feel a little sorry for DR but he brought this upon himself. Glad Amir responded because the comments in the first GR video (the response) were a little nuts. People swearing they could hear a difference but never actually doing a DBT. Not even close to doing one. I knew how this would end but had to see it.

I’d be angry if I shelled out hundreds on this cable but I would consider it a lesson learned. Many of the guys responded with denial or they simply attacked Amir’s testing. We all respond differently when we are told we are wrong. I enjoy watching the guys who simply say, “no, you are wrong” without providing any evidence. It’s fun to watch.

 

[Ken1951]

saying that the improvement of sound quality and listening experience that he´s selling is absolutely unmeasureable, but also claiming that it is easily and clearly detectable and recognisable in music listening.

I realize I know nothing. But this is complete and utter B.S. If it's truly unmeasurable you're not going to be able to detect/discern/recognize/hear it. This statement alone says everything one needs to know about the person saying it.

 

[wwenze]

Maybe partner up with another generic YouTube channel that is all about trying weird products and testing whether they work or don't work

 

[amirm]

Did you try to ask him if he would be open to comparation of his products with the cheapest alternatives with properly done blind listening tests, in environment of his own choice, even with his own crowd?

Countless people asked him in the comments of his video. His answer was the same and what I quoted in my video: "I have done hundreds of blind tests. It is easy!"

When I try to communicate with him privately, he is very insulting and rude. He tells me my reviews are a joke, etc.

I think what we ultimately dealing with is a salesman thinking he has a ton of power online. This is why he appeals to them in video rather than contacting me in response to my review as proper manufacturers do.

 

[Chrispy]

yes, indeed, it looks like "English humor"!

https://www.thomann.de/fr/sommer_cable_eclipse_spq240_mkii.htm#bewertung
4.77 euros per meter (with VAT), who says it better! and who to show me that cables 10, 50, 100, 1000 times more expensive have a better price/quality ratio? or improve the sound reproduction in some way? the only "technical" thing that I can still understand is for example a resistance perhaps a little higher than that at EMI with, for example, the Canare starquad... but I also have canare and they are unfortunately rather stiff in comparison.

I'd consider 4.77 EUR/m to be quite expensive and likely not worth it. I've never had an in-home EMI/RFI issue of note, while certainly the star quad wire is nice, it isn't particularly needed otoh. Or is this more english humor, which I assume is just a bit better than german humor?

 

[HoweSound]

As some of you requested, here is my response to Danny's contentions regarding my review of GR Research B24 AC cable.

If you have not seen it, here is my original video review:

And Danny's reply video:

If you have not already, please go to my youtube page and subscribe. It won't make me any money but will work to improve our influence in youtube world: https://www.youtube.com/@AudioScienceReview

Thank you Amir, you are more than patient with this exasperating nonsense. Unfortunately the target will always move when the previous fallacy is disproved.

 

[Cbdb2]

First dof all, hats off for your fight against clearly fraudulent snake oil salesmen!
The part where the guy is defending his livelihood saying that the improvement of sound quality and listening experience that he´s selling is absolutely unmeasureable, but also claiming that it is easily and clearly detectable and recognisable in music listening. Did you try to ask him if he would be open to comparation of his products with the cheapest alternatives with properly done blind listening tests, in environment of his own choice, even with his own crowd? If yes, he wouldn´t perhaps mind that somebody will take care of the scientific part to ensure that it is done right?

Ill bet real money he would not go for it because he knows he and his flunkies would not hear any difference. Because there is no difference.

 

[Cbdb2]

Countless people asked him in the comments of his video. His answer was the same and what I quoted in my video: "I have done hundreds of blind tests. It is easy!"

When I try to communicate with him privately, he is very insulting and rude. He tells me my reviews are a joke, etc.

I think what we ultimately dealing with is a salesman thinking he has a ton of power online. This is why he appeals to them in video rather than contacting me in response to my review as proper manufacturers do.

So we can add asshole and coward to his resume.

 

[KenA]

Boys, boys, boys. I’m very excited! First, note, long time listener first time poster.

It ain’t the cable boys, it’s the wall power point! Yes, it’s that piece of cheap crappy plastic on the wall that you plug your $500/$4 cable into! Just look at it, it’s garbage! Probably made in china out of recycled milk bottles!

But don’t panic men, I have the answer! I have done this, so take my word, because….. well… just because okay?

Plug your cable in, switch on, switch off, unplug. Repeat 2000 times. Done. No, no, don’t laugh, no questions, just do it friends!

It was like… like… on my god I can’t described it, I can’t find the words. For ASR members the best description I can give that you would understand is… like switching from a PS Audio product to a Topping.

(sigh), my life is now content.

*Please PM me for account details for any donations*

 

[wemist01]

I'm really looking forward to my hair looking better once my hair dryer reaches 200 hours of burn-in.
Someone find me a single article showing that burn-in isn't a myth in any circumstance. I swear I remember one that made very modest claims about the results of burn-in, but I can't remember if it related to speakers, headphones, cables or what. We know it wasn't cables...

 

[DudleyDuoflush]

Apologies if this has been said by others but if this cable doesn't have a safety certification you shouldn't buy it. Doesn't matter how it performs or what it does.

I can think of 3 possibilities why it isn't certified

1. He can't be bothered to get it tested.
2. He doesn't get it tested because he knows the cable will fail.
3. He's had it tested and it failed.

None of these reasons are good enough for a power cable. Steer clear.

 

[tonybarrett]

Countless people asked him in the comments of his video. His answer was the same and what I quoted in my video: "I have done hundreds of blind tests. It is easy!"

When I try to communicate with him privately, he is very insulting and rude. He tells me my reviews are a joke, etc.

I think what we ultimately dealing with is a salesman thinking he has a ton of power online. This is why he appeals to them in video rather than contacting me in response to my review as proper manufacturers do.

Former journalist here, fwiw. It can be difficult to counter misinformation without accidentally amplifying the misinfo (to state the obvious at this point in history) and there’s a large literature on this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth_sandwich

 

[DanTheMan]

Checkmate?

Danny doesn’t give up. He’s lost MANY arguments online over the years. When it happens within his “circle”, he just kicks the dissident off. He’s been asked for evidence for at least a decade and produced none. He sure makes condescension sound nice and even noble. He’s really “helping” us all, not just @amirm. That’s his gift. He has a couple other gifts: he knows how to design crossovers and can make really terrible speaker designs sound good with passive components. He’s also apparently quite an athlete, exceptionally competitive, and he can sell things for a lot of money that all available evidence refutes their efficacy... just pray his power cables don’t cause anyone’s house to burn down. I gave up years ago dispelling his magic potions and asking for proof of his claims. I’m sure he believes in what he sells as do his followers FWIW. Belief is more powerful than facts and is an incredible motivator as history has shown us.

 

[DanTheMan]

Countless people asked him in the comments of his video. His answer was the same and what I quoted in my video: "I have done hundreds of blind tests. It is easy!"

When I try to communicate with him privately, he is very insulting and rude. He tells me my reviews are a joke, etc.

I think what we ultimately dealing with is a salesman thinking he has a ton of power online. This is why he appeals to them in video rather than contacting me in response to my review as proper manufacturers do.

I have had this same experience with him in private. He was actually even “oilier” online back then, and definitely a snake in private.

Your response wasn’t the least bit off putting to me FWIW. The little jabs were minor in comparison. The facts were restated, the lack of evidence has been on him for a long, long time and his unwillingness to provide any is really a statement about what he’s doing and who he actually is. He boasts on and on about his accomplishments in reviews, hearing abilities, and/or competitions no one has ever heard of and yet when asked for proof of his product‘s efficacy, he turns to more boasting and condescension. When you think about your accomplishments in life vs. his and yet I’ve never heard you boast about them. You could easily go down the same path, but it would destroy the integrity of your point of view and what you are trying to do. Anyway, I appreciate the video and the effort and time you took to make it. Your position and conduct is sound.

 

[audiofooled]

I agree that it’s good that Amir responded to the content of Danny’s video, but it would have been stronger if he would have refrained from any sarcasm.

I think there's nothing wrong in using sarcasm when you're trying to make a specific point, especially when for the opposing argument it is used a lot and rather pointless.

In his recent attempts of so called "challenges", Danny is once again trying to make a point that has no basis in fact. I hate that snake oil salesmen in general are taking advantage of people's uncertainty and make them "hear" something which wouldn't be a problem or even heard otherwise.

Here's how you can use sarcasm in a polite manner and still make a valid point:

So, did you hear it? Or, do you actually hear something without knowing what to listen for? Now that I changed the cable, do you hear it clearly?
Creating a problem where there isn't any and offering an expensive solution that doesn't work except possibly in someone's head is foul play and it has to stop.

@amirm is providing an extremely valuable service for free. If he didn't respond then perhaps some other T-shirts would have emerged depicting Danny is winning the battle...

 

[tonybarrett]

Belief is more powerful than facts and is an incredible motivator as history has shown us.

“Never bring statistics to a story fight”

 

[Endibol]

I think there's nothing wrong in using sarcasm when you're trying to make a specific point, especially when for the opposing argument it is used a lot and rather pointless.

In his recent attempts of so called "challenges", Danny is once again trying to make a point that has no basis in fact. I hate that snake oil salesmen in general are taking advantage of people's uncertainty and make them "hear" something which wouldn't be a problem or even heard otherwise.

Here's how you can use sarcasm in a polite manner and still make a valid point:

So, did you hear it? Or, do you actually hear something without knowing what to listen for? Now that I changed the cable, do you hear it clearly?
Creating a problem where there isn't any and offering an expensive solution that doesn't work except possibly in someone's head is foul play and it has to stop.

@amirm is providing an extremely valuable service for free. If he didn't respond then perhaps some other T-shirts would have emerged depicting Danny is winning the battle...

I agree that sarcasm can be entertaining, like in the example above. However, sarcasm directed at a particular person in a debate doesn't strengthen the objective message in my opinion.

 

[audiofooled]

I agree that sarcasm can be entertaining, like in the example above. However, sarcasm directed at a particular person in a debate doesn't strengthen the objective message in my opinion.

I agree with what you're saying, in general yes, but in this case I think it was merely a proportionate response.

 

[fpitas]

Apologies if this has been said by others but if this cable doesn't have a safety certification you shouldn't buy it. Doesn't matter how it performs or what it does.

I can think of 3 possibilities why it isn't certified

1. He can't be bothered to get it tested.
2. He doesn't get it tested because he knows the cable will fail.
3. He's had it tested and it failed.

None of these reasons are good enough for a power cable. Steer clear.

A lot of the "high end" cables have no certification. Frankly, why should their makers bother? They won't make a dollar more. And yes, most will likely fail.

 

[Red_Red]

I'd consider 4.77 EUR/m to be quite expensive and likely not worth it. I've never had an in-home EMI/RFI issue of note, while certainly the star quad wire is nice, it isn't particularly needed otoh. Or is this more english humor, which I assume is just a bit better than german humor?

you must have read my post a little too quickly and the description of the cables for which I gave the link because its last ones are not starquad...(certainly they have the internal configuration but only one of the 2 internal mini cables has copper strands for special applications). but in any case they are very flexible as I wished and as announced and it is not so common.