SVS SB-2000 Pro vs SB-3000 Subwoofer Review

[Kachda]

Awesome, now I’ll wait for the black friday sale.

 

[hardisj]

Hi Erin,

Did you check with how your numbers compare with SVS's internal measurements?

Nope. I don't run my stuff by anyone before publishing reviews. I trust my data more than I trust anyone else's. Maybe that sounds egotistical; it's not meant to be. It's just that I tested with a different mic and on different days and had (roughly) the exact same results each time.

 

[Steve81]

Nope. I don't run my stuff by anyone before publishing reviews. I trust my data more than I trust anyone else's. Maybe that sounds egotistical; it's not meant to be. It's just that I tested with a different mic and on different days and had (roughly) the exact same results each time.

I understand that, but since you questioned the results yourself, I figured it doesn't hurt to have a reference point from SVS themselves after the fact. I'm not going to question your methodology / experience since I've been following you since medleys musings. OTOH, something does seem amiss when checking SPL/Frequency versus volume displacement. While there is margin for error given the variability of air density (temp, elevation, humidity), the SB-2000 Pro reaching 106dB peak @ 20Hz @ 2m on your CEA-2010B chart corresponds to a >100mm peak to peak throw (assuming an Sd of ~500 sq cm) by my reckoning.

 

[Sancus]

Hi Erin,

Did you check with how your numbers compare with SVS's internal measurements?

Buried in the Audioholics review they state: "Indeed, SVS told us our results are within 1 dB of theirs at all frequencies for both subs except for the 16 Hz measurement of the PB-3000 where they did see a couple of dB more than what we recorded." (review tested pb and sb versions)

This has thrown a spanner into my thought process because I've been considering whether I wanted a pair of Arendal 1723 2S or PSA S1512 subs, and based on this review the SB-3000 likely beats both of them while being smaller in all dimensions. The Arendal has TWO 13.8" drivers, also...

 

[MZKM]

Wait... the SVS SB-3000 has a 20hz 106.5dB CEA-2010(2m peak)?!!? Isn't that like... an absurdly high number for the size of that sealed sub? It's only 3dB less than the MUCH larger, ported Monoprice THX 12(THX EQ) @ 109.3dB.

Audioholics reported the SVS SB-3000 2m RMS as 93.6 which would be 96.6 2m peak, no? They reported the Monolith 12 at a comparable 106dB(which would convert to 109dB peak).

Yeah, and this reviewer found 95.5dB (RMS?, so 101dB Peak) at 20Hz for the SB-4000.
https://hometheaterreview.com/svs-sb-4000-subwoofer/

Maybe Erin just needs to get all of these to measure to analyze what’s going on
As no way the Rythmik F18 has pretty much less output across the board.

Even for the PB2000 Pro Erin got 2-3dB higher than Audioholics.

If only life were simple and we could have super consistent results from different sources.

__________
EDIT: From the Audioholics review of the SB3000:

The temperature was recorded at 43 degrees with 58% humidity.

Ok, that may explain why they got reduced low end.

 

[McFly]

Erin is using ground plane measurements, aren’t these readings 6db higher due to mirror effect or some such thing?

 

[sweetchaos]

Yeah, and this reviewer found 95.5dB (RMS?, so 101dB Peak) at 20Hz for the SB-4000.
https://hometheaterreview.com/svs-sb-4000-subwoofer/

My assumption is that data is shown in 2m RMS SPL, but I've messaged them using the 'contact us' page to find out exactly.

 

[Sancus]

From the Audioholics review of the SB3000:

Ok, that may explain why they got reduced low end.

That wouldn't explain why SVS confirmed their numbers though, if they are wrong. If anything, SVS would have an incentive to correct them higher.

 

[Jukebox]

Great review, @hardisj . An noteworthy hiss? I have a pair of SB-2000 notPro, and both emit an audible "shhhhhhhhhhhh..." at a listening distance of ~8'. SVS support told me it is normal, but I can hear it clearly during quiet passages, which causes me to listen to music without subs most of the time.

I have 2X SB3000 and both have audible hiss; Doesn't batter me that much from the listening position.

 

[Steve Dallas]

I have 2X SB3000 and both have audible hiss; Doesn't batter me that much from the listening position.

Interesting!

I have 3 SB2000's in a decently soundproofed and extensively treated media room and they are dead silent, completely inaudible @~50% gain even with your ear inches from the woofer. How high do you have the gain? Sounds like a ground loop issue between your system and the sub, fault or loose termination on your cable, or a faulty amp. Ground loop and faulty connector noise is indeed a common complaint with subs, but pretty easy to diagnose. They make both an in-line filter for the sub's RCA feed (Bluejean cable sold one last I saw), as well as a wall outlet filter (one product I'm aware of is the EBtech HUM-X). I had to use a HUM X on my old MFW-15, it definitely works, your issue may be different though. If a new cable, line filter, or plug filter don't work, I'd guess it's the sub's amp that's borked.

My gain control is set to ~25%. It is a small room.

I must admit that I have done nothing to troubleshoot the issue. I don't hear it during movies, and my main speakers reach the high 20Hz region in-room, which is low enough for the genres of music I listen to, so I don't feel the need to use subs for music. Distortion is not a thing in a room that small, so relieving the 6.5 woofers of stress is not terribly beneficial. Both subs have the same amount of noise.

I may have time to play around with them tonight. The quick and easy test would be to disconnect the RCA cables and see if it goes away.

The AVR does not utilize a ground pin. The amp already has its ground lifted with a Hum-X. I suppose it is possible there is a ground loop between the subs themselves. But ground loops usually sound different than constant white noise, which is what I hear.

I will play with things and report back.

[Another idea I have is to grind up a PS Audio Noise Harvester, make a paste from its powder, and wipe it on the contacts of all connections as a Contact Enhancer(tm). That should work!]

 

[righthookmike]

I've put in a lot of time researching plans to build a set of subs for music. It seems kind of pointless if these are available for pretty much less than the cost of materials... What would be the weakness of these subs?

 

[Steve Dallas]

Awesome, now I’ll wait for the black friday sale.

If you live in the US, call these guys and ask them about an "open box" purchase. They sold me a pair for under $1000 shipped. They arrived new and unopened. A friend of mine did the same a few months after I did and received the same result.

https://www.iq-av.com/product/svs-r...00-pro-subwoofer-sb-2000-pro-black-ash-345850

 

[More Dynamics Please]

As I recall @amirm's measurement of the Rythmik L12 seemed in line with expectations which would suggest that the Klippel itself is not an issue when measuring subs. @hardisj's Klippel measurements for the SVS subs could be confirmed if also measured on @amirm's Klippel.

 

[Ron Texas]

@hardisj were you rolling off or delaying your mains? If so, how did you do it? I ask because SVS told me the latency of these Subs is 6 ms. That's more than most because of the DSP. As for rolling off the mains, it's a must with mini monitors, but seems to be a matter of taste with full range mains.

 

[hardisj]

As I recall @amirm's measurement of the Rythmik L12 seemed in line with expectations which would suggest that the Klippel itself is not an issue when measuring subs. @hardisj's Klippel measurements for the SVS subs could be confirmed if also measured on @amirm's Klippel.

Amir doesn’t do CEA-2010 testing.

So far, this is the only test I’ve had that made me scratch my head. But as I said, I tested 3 times and also compared against a different mic.

As was mentioned above, AH tested at a low temperature. 43 degrees F. That alone is cause for concern. I wasn’t aware of this until it was called out above. But I am honestly surprised James tested with it in that weather. Anyone who tests speakers knows this is a major issue. In fact, it was a major cause for concern with one of Amir’s tests of another speaker early on. Testing LF in cold weather is a no-no. That is why I purposely waited two months for the weather to get warm here before I tested these subwoofers. I’m not targeting James. I like the guy and I appreciate his work. But to me, that’s cause for concern with the data.

Here is a thread discussing the impact of temperature, where Amir had to measure a speaker multiple times and ultimately realized the cold weather was the culprit.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...eumann-kh80-dsp-monitor-measurements-3.14637/

But here is the graph that says it all:

And, remember, I noted that my data matched AH above about 40Hz (recalling from memory) which I thought was odd? Well, now we know why it was only the LF that was different.


So, if someone said "hey, I've got two tests: one conducted in cold temps and another conducted in warm temps. One set has a lower SPL than the other. Which one was it?" Well, logic would indicate the cold temp test was lower in SPL. Yet, here we are...

 

[hardisj]

@hardisj were you rolling off or delaying your mains? If so, how did you do it? I ask because SVS told me the latency of these Subs is 6 ms. That's more than most because of the DSP. As for rolling off the mains, it's a must with mini monitors, but seems to be a matter of taste with full range mains.

I used the Parasound INT 200 which has a crossover filter built in. For delay, I used the SVS app to match the mains as best I could, matching the phase rotation at the crossover point.

 

[MZKM]

So far, this is the only test I’ve had that made me scratch my head.

Again, not questioning the data, but by looking at your measurements of each, it does seems very odd that the SB-2000 Pro is louder than PB-2000 Pro at 25Hz & 31.5Hz in 2010-A and for 2010-B the SB-2000 Pro ties or is louder than the PB-2000 Pro at every frequency!

So, there is really no reason to spend the extra $100 on the PB-2000 Pro?

 

[phoenixdogfan]

I have 3 SB2000's in a decently soundproofed and extensively treated media room and they are dead silent, completely inaudible @~50% gain even with your ear inches from the woofer. How high do you have the gain? Sounds like a ground loop issue between your system and the sub, fault or loose termination on your cable, or a faulty amp. Ground loop and faulty connector noise is indeed a common complaint with subs, but pretty easy to diagnose. They make both an in-line filter for the sub's RCA feed (Bluejean cable sold one last I saw), as well as a wall outlet filter (one product I'm aware of is the EBtech HUM-X). I had to use a HUM X on my old MFW-15, it definitely works, your issue may be different though. If a new cable, line filter, or plug filter don't work, I'd guess it's the sub's amp that's borked.

I've had the OG SB2000 for three years and never heard any hiss. I'm in a 12 x 12 bedroom, and it's more than adequate for all my bass needs. I'm sure there are deals to be had on the original model, and it has everything the Pro has except the DSP. If you've already rolled your own on the DSP. (I have a miniDSP unit and DL 3) then SVS's DSP is superfluous, and maybe a pair of the OGs could be found on close out for $1k or less.

 

[Matt0305]

No hiss on my PC-2000 Pro. Completely silent when not in use, at least to my ears.

 

[Kachda]

If you live in the US, call these guys and ask them about an "open box" purchase. They sold me a pair for under $1000 shipped. They arrived new and unopened. A friend of mine did the same a few months after I did and received the same result.

https://www.iq-av.com/product/svs-r...00-pro-subwoofer-sb-2000-pro-black-ash-345850

Thanks for the tip. In 2020 SVS dropped the price of SB2000 by $200. My current apartment is quite small and don't really have a great location to put a sub. I will move out in August and try to find a place with a better layout, so I can wait for a few months.