No, it sounded the same at all sound levels - what you are describing is the first thing that came to mind. With high gain I can comfortably listen at higher loudness levels than with medium gain. Also signal clipping with the dac pot at 1/4?
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Hypex Nilai500DIY Amplifier Review
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
Killingbeans
Major Contributor
Doesn't make much sense, true. But it's the only thing I can think of that makes just a little bit. Other than that, I'm stumped.
HoweSound
Active Member
I have The DIY Nilai stereo amp. Mine was assembled by Deer Creek Audio. It is set to mid gain and I'm using a Schiit Freya S pre-amp. The performance is excellent - no symptoms such as you describe. Subjectively, the two things that struck me with the new amp: clarity and energy, my old setup, with less than half the wattage, seemed "muddy' by comparison. I have to wonder if you have a defect, or an assembly error.Just assembled mine yesterday.
The sound quality with the default "mid gain" setting was quite dark (like underwater), high notes sounded muted and bass sounded less clear
I changed the gain to high and the sound is now brighter.
There previous amp (Crown XLS2500) had variable gain pots on the front and there was a similar effect there too.
My sound path is the following: Pioneer U-05 DAC -> 2X Nilai -> Magnepan 1.7i , xlr interconnects
Can anyone answer why this happens? Why does sound change with amp gain?
P.S. The Crown also sounded great btw albeit only through the speakon connectors not the binding posts, I will have to keep listening now to justify the price difference
Yes, mine is the same, nothing like the "underwater" comments from Makis, nothing at all.
Rob Fens
Member
Hallo Makis,Just assembled mine yesterday.
The sound quality with the default "mid gain" setting was quite dark (like underwater), high notes sounded muted and bass sounded less clear
I changed the gain to high and the sound is now brighter.
There previous amp (Crown XLS2500) had variable gain pots on the front and there was a similar effect there too.
My sound path is the following: Pioneer U-05 DAC -> 2X Nilai -> Magnepan 1.7i , xlr interconnects
Can anyone answer why this happens? Why does sound change with amp gain?
P.S. The Crown also sounded great btw albeit only through the speakon connectors not the binding posts, I will have to keep listening now to justify the price difference
"If the Crown had a similar effect too" (see red marked text), i guess it is useless to investigate the Nilai only, i would investigate the effect of the Fletcher Munson curve and think in that direction, since it is about relative sensitivity of the ear related to frequency and level. I guess Killingbeans hinted in that direction too when he mentioned "contour".
Succes,
Rob.
Hi guys !
To do a tweak on a Nilai stereo kit, I need some technical informations about the case. It would be nice if some owner of Nilai kit can help me. Datas are quitte easy and fast to gather. My questions are in this post : https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hypex-nilai-stereo-mono-kits-cases.48769/
Thanks !
To do a tweak on a Nilai stereo kit, I need some technical informations about the case. It would be nice if some owner of Nilai kit can help me. Datas are quitte easy and fast to gather. My questions are in this post : https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hypex-nilai-stereo-mono-kits-cases.48769/
Thanks !
Interesting question: differences between Class D/Hypex implementation and Audiophonics implementation of Nilai.
By the way, RME ADI 2/4 Pro SE drives the DIY monoblocks beautifully, as expected.
Ro808
Member
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2017
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- 83
Just assembled mine yesterday.
The sound quality with the default "mid gain" setting was quite dark (like underwater), high notes sounded muted and bass sounded less clear
I changed the gain to high and the sound is now brighter.
There previous amp (Crown XLS2500) had variable gain pots on the front and there was a similar effect there too.
My sound path is the following: Pioneer U-05 DAC -> 2X Nilai -> Magnepan 1.7i , xlr interconnects
Can anyone answer why this happens? Why does sound change with amp gain?
P.S. The Crown also sounded great btw albeit only through the speakon connectors not the binding posts, I will have to keep listening now to justify the price difference
The impedance of the Magnepan 1.7 drops below 2 ohms above 10 Khz, which can be 'problematic'. This may also be the case for the 1.7i.
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This is the type of speaker profile that the Crown XLS series handles without trouble.... (best left unbridged though)
The Nilai500 is also rated down to 2 ohm, however, it may potentially be power supply constrained, depending on the PSU it is paired with... mind you the HF 2ohm area, should not be drawing much power at any reasonable volume level - but yeah this is the kind of speaker that demonstrates the difference between differing amp designs!
This is right on the limit of the Nilai's rated specs... whereas the Crowns are rated/specced down to 1 ohm.
Within rated envelope, there should be no frequency response variation... should....
But yes - a speaker that drops down to 2ohm like this (or like my Gallo's at 1.6 Ohm) - will test the amp! (and different amps do misbehave differently when at their limits)
Yours and Ro808's answers make perfect sense, I am a bit surprised as the previous Magnepans (1.6) sounded ok with a 100W Yamaha AV, an old 70W Cambridge Audio and the XLS 2500. They did not sound ok with an XLS 1502 though at any gain. Is this a "class D" thing?
I doubt it is a "class D" thing - there may have been gain matching issues between pre and power... the XLS can drive 1ohm without trouble, so the speaker impedance shouldn't be the issue either.
With these kind of issues, it may be worthwhile trying the differing inputs on the XLS, both the XLR and the RCA - they have differing circuits behind them with differing gain, and the issues sound like more of a gain matching problem rather than a speaker/amp issue.
Just guessing - but it might point to an avenue of further testing... with my XLS, it is the earlier series, and all inputs go through the same circuit, so there is no real difference... - and I have not experienced the issue you describe.
Which input did you use on the XLS?
I used the XLR inputs , same as with the Nilais.
The whole point was and still is to avoid the "change cables and the sound changes" issue with the RCA inputs in general.
I understand ... but with the XLS series 2 - the XLR and RCA inputs run through different circuits, so there may indeed be different sound through the different circuit. (whether due to gain matching, or other aspects)
With the Nilai, it will be up to the input circuit, and with those kits I believe there are different "buffer board" options?
I would like to share my own listening experience on my recent purchase of Nilai500DIY mono kit.
The Nilai500DIY mono block kit produces sound quality that far surpasses expectations for a class D amplifier. From the first listen before burn-in, I was stunned by the incredibly clear highs, textured lows, and ability to hear fine details like piano hammers striking strings.
After assembly and burn-in, the amp reveals even more nuanced and smooth treble along with tight, palpable bass. On piano tracks, the realistic resonance as hammers hit strings sounds almost like being in the room. Vocals shine with texture and body.
Compared to my Musical Fidelity m5si, this DIY kit amp provides substantially more detail and dimension across frequencies. I can discern intricate background elements in recordings I never noticed before.
For the price, the Nilai500DIY delivers absolutely astonishing transparency and musicality. It offers an easy, rewarding DIY build experience with performance exceeding amps costing many times more. The vivid immediacy and expansive soundstage have transformed my listening experience. This is a true audiophile-grade amp masquerading as a budget kit.
I am really happy and enjoy listening to my system with Nilai500DIY mono kit.
The Nilai500DIY mono block kit produces sound quality that far surpasses expectations for a class D amplifier. From the first listen before burn-in, I was stunned by the incredibly clear highs, textured lows, and ability to hear fine details like piano hammers striking strings.
After assembly and burn-in, the amp reveals even more nuanced and smooth treble along with tight, palpable bass. On piano tracks, the realistic resonance as hammers hit strings sounds almost like being in the room. Vocals shine with texture and body.
Compared to my Musical Fidelity m5si, this DIY kit amp provides substantially more detail and dimension across frequencies. I can discern intricate background elements in recordings I never noticed before.
For the price, the Nilai500DIY delivers absolutely astonishing transparency and musicality. It offers an easy, rewarding DIY build experience with performance exceeding amps costing many times more. The vivid immediacy and expansive soundstage have transformed my listening experience. This is a true audiophile-grade amp masquerading as a budget kit.
I am really happy and enjoy listening to my system with Nilai500DIY mono kit.
I am glad that you are enjoying your kit and that it brings you pleasure. Your subjective impressions have been noted.
I could not agree more with rq1111. I have been listening to music for more than 30 years, the last three of them using a system based on a pair of Klipsch Forte III. The other two components were the RME adi-2 dac and my old Naim Nait 5i. Since the first day I bought my speakers (on 2019) and listened to them ,my impression was that there was something like an "electric" coloring along with too much uncontrolled low frequencies and had attributed those characteristics to the speakers. Recently I decided to replace the oldest part of the chain. The available budget for the upgrade of the old Naim was limited, so I started reading about class D amps and recently I decided to buy the Nilai stereo kit hoping that my speakers needed a powerful amp to control the 12'' woofer. The result is absolutely a revelation. I have been listening (at mid and low gain) for about a week now and the transformation of the forte's is beyond imagination. Completely different (neutral) tonality, details in high frequencies I had never heard before and absolutely controlled lows. Have no doubt that the performance of this amp is nothing but spectacular, I just hope that it will turn out to be reliable and last for many years.
Has this forum become yet another subjectivist gathering place? What happened to the "Science" part?
Rob Fens
Member
Hallo RQ1111 and Julf,
I understand and agree with the comments of both of you.
At RQ1111:
Right, i also feel the Nilai is a great piece of equipment, but..
At Julf:
Agree with you about the scientific approach; How about this forum, is there space in this forum for subjectiv comments?
The majority of High Fi forums is subjectiv, please keep this one clean.
Now my question:
Is there a way to link the results of the measurements (objectiv) to the aural experiences (subjectiv)? In the end it is all about the personal experience when listening.
I do not know of any hifi enthousiast whose pleasure only consists of testing hifi equipment, most of them only listen and some also measure. I am looking for the relationship between data and listening experience. I guess we will have to accept some subjectiveness. But we should stay aware of Julfs' warning.
Best regards,
Rob.
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