GR Research B24 AC Cord Review

[balletboy]

I'm a lawyer, and I used to do a lot of defense of manufacturers in product liability claims.

Certification isn't required for some sales (depends on how and where the company is selling). And certification won't shield a company from liability.

With that said, we used to give clients the following advice:

1. If you sell enough stuff, and if it can presents any potential hazard, you'll eventually be sued. It doesn't even have to be for your product. We defended a bunch of fire cases where the fire started somewhere else. But our client's product was nearby, so that would be a target. (Often, the fires started in damaged extension cords. But it's often impossible to identify the manufacturer or seller of the cord, so plaintiffs' lawyers will sue someone with an identifiable product that's plugged into the extension cord.)

2. If you're sued, you need to be able to show that you (a) identified potential risks and (b) tried to design out any such risks. If you can't eliminate the risk by using an alternate design, then you guard against the risk. Finally, you warn about the risk, using appropriate warnings (where needed, when needed, etc.). We used to say that companies needed to create a "safety story." You don't want to create your safety story after the fact. Do it beforehand, and document it thoroughly.

In regard to these cables, I'm a bit concerned by the overlength ground pin. It seems possible that a user could insert the plug partway, resulting in a high-resistance connection at one of the other pins. And that could cause overheating and a subsequent fire.

If you look at outlets in enough houses, you'll see some that are a bit scorched, generally as a result of a high-resistance connection caused by partial insertion of a plug. (Sometimes the scorching is caused by a high-resistance connection in the male end of the cord.) And that's why, if your outlet starts feeling a bit sloppy, you should replace it.

(That sounds a bit . . . well . . .)

In the UK if you don't get certification for all electrical installations, commercial or domestic, good luck with your insurers. I also do product liability and fire claims, I've had $100m losses from a badly installed lightbulb. We had 43 lawyers/insurers in the room for the mediation. I also do work relating to Dangerous Substances and Explosive Atmosphere Regulations, where operators have to get detailed reports of every potential risk. The earliest risk I was involved with was a capsized oil rig with 138 lives lost. I did a Supreme Court case where the issue was steel certification of handlebars, which snapped and brain-injured my client, they met Japanese standards but not UK standards.

Broadly, the Supreme Court decided that the UK distributor is responsible, not the retailer. So if you buy a Topping amp on eBay delivered from China (which is how they do it) and it burns your house down, your are screwed. If they had a UK distributor, you could sue them.

What I've found is that if a UK distributor knows they have a product issue, they indemnify their dealers and tell them to screw their customers for as much as possible. So, for example, they will tell their customer "it's out of warranty, the cost is £2,000, but as an act of goodwill we'll fix it for you for £1,500". The dealer will have a happy customer and get the balance of £500 from the distributor. I've had this personally 3 or 4 times, went straight to the distributor on a few occasions (with Honda and Apple) about £4,000 of work cost me £0 and recently got a product upgrade at a 50% discount.

All of which is fine, but it is perfectly legal to sell a DIY cable kit. It will, however, have detailed wiring and safety instructions, so if you do a DIY cable and burn your house down, it's your own fault.

So in the UK product certification is not really what counts, it is much more important to know that the product is from a UK manufacturer or UK distributor. So buying a product shipped direct from China by the manufacturer offers no comfort at all.

 

[Doodski]

I also do product liability and fire claims, I've had $100m losses from a badly installed lightbulb. We had 43 lawyers/insurers in the room for the mediation. I also do work relating to Dangerous Substances and Explosive Atmosphere Regulations, where operators have to get detailed reports of every potential risk. The earliest risk I was involved with was a capsized oil rig with 138 lives lost. I did a Supreme Court case where the issue was steel certification of handlebars, which snapped and brain-injured my client, they met Japanese standards but not UK standards.

That's some very serious stuff. What kind of education do you need for that sort of work. Like maybe a Bachelor of Science Degree plus your law degree?

 

[EarlessOldMan]

In the UK if you don't get certification for all electrical installations, commercial or domestic, good luck with your insurers. I also do product liability and fire claims, I've had $100m losses from a badly installed lightbulb. We had 43 lawyers/insurers in the room for the mediation. I also do work relating to Dangerous Substances and Explosive Atmosphere Regulations, where operators have to get detailed reports of every potential risk. The earliest risk I was involved with was a capsized oil rig with 138 lives lost. I did a Supreme Court case where the issue was steel certification of handlebars, which snapped and brain-injured my client, they met Japanese standards but not UK standards.

Broadly, the Supreme Court decided that the UK distributor is responsible, not the retailer. So if you buy a Topping amp on eBay delivered from China (which is how they do it) and it burns your house down, your are screwed. If they had a UK distributor, you could sue them.

What I've found is that if a UK distributor knows they have a product issue, they indemnify their dealers and tell them to screw their customers for as much as possible. So, for example, they will tell their customer "it's out of warranty, the cost is £2,000, but as an act of goodwill we'll fix it for you for £1,500". The dealer will have a happy customer and get the balance of £500 from the distributor. I've had this personally 3 or 4 times, went straight to the distributor on a few occasions (with Honda and Apple) about £4,000 of work cost me £0 and recently got a product upgrade at a 50% discount.

All of which is fine, but it is perfectly legal to sell a DIY cable kit. It will, however, have detailed wiring and safety instructions, so if you do a DIY cable and burn your house down, it's your own fault.

So in the UK product certification is not really what counts, it is much more important to know that the product is from a UK manufacturer or UK distributor. So buying a product shipped direct from China by the manufacturer offers no comfort at all.

In all of the U.S. jurisdictions in which I've practiced, a plaintiff can typically sue anyone in the chain of distribution. A retailer or distributor may be able to erect an "innocent seller" defense. But a plaintiff can sometimes get around that defense if the manufacturer can't be joined as a defendant (e.g., lack of personal jurisdiction, or the manufacturer is simply defunct). If the manufacturer can be sued, then the downstream sellers can sometimes obtain dismissal.

I was involved in a $160 million (claimed) loss involving a fire on a vessel. Our client resolved that matter. Our product cost a few cents.

I worked on a case involving a U.S. retailer of bicycles manufactured in Taiwan. Brakes failed catastrophically (front wheel seized up at speed); rider suffered a TBI. Fun times . . .

 

[EarlessOldMan]

That's some very serious stuff. What kind of education do you need for that sort of work. Like maybe a Bachelor of Science Degree plus your law degree?

Ha! I practice in the U.S. I have bachelor's and master's degrees in English (along with my J.D.).

It may be different in England. But I worked on a $1 billion claim out of Canada, and our Canadian counsel just had a law degree.

Here's a video of part of that incident:

 

[EarlessOldMan]

Ha! I practice in the U.S. I have bachelor's and master's degrees in English (along with my J.D.).

It may be different in England. But I worked on a $1 billion claim out of Canada, and our Canadian counsel just had a law degree.

Here's a video of part of that incident:

I also worked on a lawsuit brought after this incident in Jacksonville, Florida. I think that four people died in that one.

 

[Doodski]

Ha! I practice in the U.S. I have bachelor's and master's degrees in English (along with my J.D.).

It may be different in England. But I worked on a $1 billion claim out of Canada, and our Canadian counsel just had a law degree.

Here's a video of part of that incident:

Wowzer! That was beaucoup BTUs in a small amount of time. Horrible. Well I imagine the law degree education must be very comprehensive to enable you to be responsible for such stuff.

 

[EarlessOldMan]

Wowzer! That was beaucoup BTUs in a small amount of time. Horrible. Well I imagine the law degree education must be very comprehensive to enable you to be responsible for such stuff.

We always worked with qualified experts (including engineers in-house at our clients).

And in every case in which I represented a defendant, my understanding of the product and its role in the incident was vastly superior to that of counsel for the plaintiff or plaintiffs.

It got to the point that the client sometimes sent me alone to a site investigation. I was familiar with the products and the typical explosion/fire scenarios. I didn't attend solo if there was any significant risk that our client would be sued. But if it looked pretty straightforward, I was the guy from the client (although outside counsel) talking with the other lawyers and the experts about the findings at the site.

Some of the experts for plaintiffs' lawyers got to know me pretty well and would ask me what I thought. It was kind of amusing. But my background on these matters kept my client out of some lawsuits.

I'm in a storytelling mood . . .

I attended a product inspection arising out of a fire that was allegedly started by the overheating of a commercial carpet extractor used by an auto detailing shop. The theory was that our client's thermostats had failed and allowed the heating element in the tank of the extractor to overheat, thus leading to the fire.

We got to the inspection, and I looked inside the tank. The upper part of the tank was heavily sooted and had streaks of molten plastic running down it. But the bottom three or so inches of the tank--including the heating element--were almost pristine. It was clear that the tank had held water in it through the great bulk of the fire. Water remains water until it hits about 212F. Had the heating element kept running because of thermostat failure, the element would have boiled away all the water in the tank before overheating.

I pointed it out to our expert, who was an electrical engineer, not a fire origin-and-cause expert. Then I started telling all the other lawyers about it. And then I just stood by the tank and said, "Heck, this clearly didn't boil dry. I don't know why you folks think that our product had anything to with the fire."

Never got sued.

 

[Doodski]

We always worked with qualified experts (including engineers in-house at our clients).

And in every case in which I represented a defendant, my understanding of the product and its role in the incident was vastly superior to that of counsel for the plaintiff or plaintiffs.

It got to the point that the client sometimes sent me alone to a site investigation. I was familiar with the products and the typical explosion/fire scenarios. I didn't attend solo if there was any significant risk that our client would be sued. But if it looked pretty straightforward, I was the guy from the client (although outside counsel) talking with the other lawyers and the experts about the findings at the site.

Some of the experts for plaintiffs' lawyers got to know me pretty well and would ask me what I thought. It was kind of amusing. But my background on these matters kept my client out of some lawsuits.

I'm in a storytelling mood . . .

I attended a product inspection arising out of a fire that was allegedly started by the overheating of a commercial carpet extractor used by an auto detailing shop. The theory was that our client's thermostats had failed and allowed the heating element in the tank of the extractor to overheat, thus leading to the fire.

We got to the inspection, and I looked inside the tank. The upper part of the tank was heavily sooted and had streaks of molten plastic running down it. But the bottom three or so inches of the tank--including the heating element--were almost pristine. It was clear that the tank had held water in it through the great bulk of the fire. Water remains water until it hits about 212F. Had the heating element kept running because of thermostat failure, the element would have boiled away all the water in the tank before overheating.

I pointed it out to our expert, who was an electrical engineer, not a fire origin-and-cause expert. Then I started telling all the other lawyers about it. And then I just stood by the tank and said, "Heck, this clearly didn't boil dry. I don't know why you folks think that our product had anything to with the fire."

Never got sued.

I imagine you get a broad range of study and self education doing what you do. It would be very interesting to do I think.

 

[Billy Budapest]

Be cautious:

The hospital grade plugs are thicker material to reach a minimum pull out force of 12 pounds, if I recall correctly. The hospital grade plugs may damage your existing domestic receptacles.

You could also upgrade the existing receptacle.

The hospital grade plug was cheaper than the standard! That’s the only reason why I bought them.

 

[wwenze]

The index shows ASR has not recommended any cable for 4 years and nothing more than $20. So it is all rather predicable. Maybe ASR should come clean and state that cables do not make a difference, never will, and just recommend using the cable in the box with the product or something from Amazon Basics.

But... we need to always keep an open mind... and always believe there is one "true" product that makes a difference and the others are all not "true" products...

 

[Angsty]

The index shows ASR has not recommended any cable for 4 years and nothing more than $20. So it is all rather predicable. Maybe ASR should come clean and state that cables do not make a difference, never will, and just recommend using the cable in the box with the product or something from Amazon Basics.

To have integrity, ASR needs to test claims versus discarding them on the basis of bias from prior tests.

That said, 100+ years of the electrical engineering body of knowledge would tell you that most of these claims are bogus.

 

[Doodski]

At a previous company I worked for, apparently during a customer installation the 3-phase was not wired correctly and that sent 415V instead of 230V to all the LED lamps that were installed.

And the kind of education that was involved for the people that did the installation... let's just say, below median income.

That's downright danger zone. I've taken ~three zapz from 240VAC and that was no joyride. 415VAC would possibly kill somebody. That's why the qualifications here for electricians is 4 years of apprenticeship and some serious studies that are not vocational in nature. The electrical code is very clear and inspections combined with enforcement is very strict too.

 

[Sonny1]

@amirm are you going to do a video of this one? I’m a fan of your written and video reviews but enjoy the comments on the YouTube videos. It’s interesting to see how many people appreciate your objective measurements and no hype style. I also look forward to Danny having a meltdown over this one. Good work!

 

[Doodski]

@amirm are you going to do a video of this one? I’m a fan of your written and video reviews but enjoy the comments on the YouTube videos. It’s interesting to see how many people appreciate your objective measurements and no hype style. I also look forward to Danny having a meltdown over this one. Good work!

hahaha. The video review is up now! Minutes from your post.

GR Research B24 AC Cable Review: Does it Make an Audible Difference?

Follow up video to my text review of GR Research B24 AC power cord review. I play the clips at hand and show the difference (or lack thereof) with this cable vs generic cheap AC cable: Kind credit to band Radical Face Missing Film album for free license for non-commercial use. Please see...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Sonny1]

hahaha. The video review is up now! Minutes from your post.

GR Research B24 AC Cable Review: Does it Make an Audible Difference?

Follow up video to my text review of GR Research B24 AC power cord review. I play the clips at hand and show the difference (or lack thereof) with this cable vs generic cheap AC cable: Kind credit to band Radical Face Missing Film album for free license for non-commercial use. Please see...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Five minutes after my post? That’s what I call service! Nice.

 

[amirm]

@amirm are you going to do a video of this one? I’m a fan of your written and video reviews but enjoy the comments on the YouTube videos. It’s interesting to see how many people appreciate your objective measurements and no hype style. I also look forward to Danny having a meltdown over this one. Good work!

Thanks. Just post it.

 

[Andysu]

what ! $349 ? did you get the 30 day money back satisfactory rights ? what !

 

[amirm]

what ! $349 ? did you get the 30 day money back satisfactory rights ? what !

Yes but as I explain in the video, I am on the hook for shipping both ways and credit card fees. So I will be out close to $100 if I return it.

 

[Andysu]

Yes but as I explain in the video, I am on the hook for shipping both ways and credit card fees. So I will be out close to $100 if I return it.

yeah , that wow copper golden ends are scratched and has lost most of the bs marketing value . maybe sell the cable to porn hub . they could use it as a sex toy lol . what ! lol

 

[Art of sound]

Topping P50 review?