Schiit Vidar 2 Stereo Amplifier Review

[Count Dacula]

As long as you have the components grouped together, you can look at it as an average failure rate at X duration or capacity. Binding posts fail less often than power supplies, but if you ran a few gigawats thru them....

Just like each mechanical part is engineered for a lifespan and price point, each electronic part is similarly constructed. There is a congruity between these two systems. I'll stand by my analogy in the narrow way it serves my point. Just like the top fuel methanol dragster requires a rebuild after mere seconds of operation, an old chug-a-lug V8 or diesel can run for very extended times. Why this correlation of power consumption and efficiency to longevity wouldn't apply to electronic systems escapes me.

https://www.lisungroup.com/news/tec...dity-on-electronic-component-reliability.html

Electronic components are sensitive to temperature changes, which may reduce their longevity and efficiency. Let’s take a closer look at how temperature affects the operation of various electrical parts:

Thermal Expansion and Contraction: Temperature fluctuations that occur during operation put electronic components at danger of thermal expansion and contraction. It is possible for cyclic stress to cause mechanical fatigue, which may then lead to taking this joints, broken wire bonds, and delamination. When these processes are accelerated up by heat, there is a greater likelihood that individual components may fail.

On this linear scale, we can clearly see the strong sensitivity to temperature. By increasing the device temperature by just 10°C, we have reduced the lifetime by over 2x. You may have heard a rule of thumb along the lines of a 50% lifetime decrease for each 10°C increase in channel temperature; that seems consistent with this formulation at this point in the Arrhenius curve. Even more significant, by increasing the temperature by 25°C from 225°C to 250°C, the lifetime dropped by almost an order of magnitude. This is equivalent to going from a ≈500 year lifetime to a ≈50 year lifetime on these devices, which will make operators of this device very happy if the lifetime ranges are a few times longer than a standard technology cycle.

Device Reliability - How Temperature Affects Mean Time to Failure

There are a variety of factors that go into device reliability, but often underappreciated is the thermal contribution.

jetcool.com

 

[Spitfire93]

Please enlighten us, amplifiers and sound, how exactly is this connection? I prefer to listen to music and not to amplifiers..

If you think all the amplifier sound the same and there is no connection between how they measure and the sound that's coming out than what is the point of being here, what is the point of this forum ...

 

[dlaloum]

If you think all the amplifier sound the same and there is no connection between how they measure and the sound that's coming out than what is the point of being here, what is the point of this forum ...

Wherever the distortions and noise (which profiles are individual to each amp design) are below the threshold of audibility (which is circa 60db...!) - the amps are designed for a flat frequency response, and the amps are working within their performance envelope (rated power, speaker load, etc..) - multiple blind tests have shown all amplifiers to sound alike.

The contraints of that defining sentence are pretty clear.

I have had two amplifiers sound different - but that is on speakers with impedance that drops down to 1.6ohm.... and a heck of a lot of amps don't like that! (as per the top sentence - those amps that get "unhappy" are the ones working outside of their design performance envelope)

On my other pair of speakers - a far more benign 8ohm nominal load (with lowest impedance still above 4ohm) - all the amplifiers sounded alike.

So yeah - there are situations in which amplifiers can sound different.
But for most people, with most speakers, all amplifiers do indeed sound alike.

 

[Ajax]

It is a little sad that our society has come to accept such short lifespans from items, especially ones that contain elements that are harmful and likely won't be disposed of properly. Often the 'improvements' aren't needed or even audible for most people.

People in the real world, where they aren't chasing performance stats or watching reviews touting how much better each new product is, tend to buy once and not think about it again until the item breaks. For most of the population, audio components aren't a hobby; they are an appliance. Hit the power button, music comes out and we are good.
My only family member that replaced an audio component in the last 30 years was one where it died. Nothing else has entered a landfill, nothing has been shipped around the globe or even driven up to their door in that time.

Hi nTa240,

I think you may have mis interpreted my comment, which was in response to a suggestion that as class "D" technology was relatively new it had not stood the text of time from a performance point of view, such as A/B amplification.

I do not turn over my audio gear (or any other item ... my cars are over 10 years old), because as a surfer and a sailor I have always been an environmentalist in the true sense for over 50 years ..... I like to buy quality and hold.

 

[Rottmannash]

Will do. Thanks. I was not aware of this topic on ASR.

Hint-it's all anecdotal evidence.

 

[MacClintock]

If you think all the amplifier sound the same and there is no connection between how they measure and the sound that's coming out than what is the point of being here, what is the point of this forum ...

The answer has already been given in post #223 above, just adding that I like to know, how an amp at which price point measures. I was stunned to see the measurements of the Benchmark AHB2 and enjoy audio and scientific informations. Why are you here? Looking for “amplifier sound”? I guess if any of us is wrong here, it is you.

 

[DSJR]

Hehe, I heard Kii Threes with Hypex amps inside I believe) and found them actually 'sweet' toned rather than the glassy edge I'd imagined class D having (pre-conceived thoughts in the back of my mind). I was given a late 90's Technics micro system and this also appears to have a switching amp of some sort, albeit very low power (and in my ignorance, I don't understand the chip labelled 'power amp' and output devices labelled as 'regulators' in the service manual (HD70 and more or less identical HD81). It *sounds* absolutely fine unless pushed beyond its modest limits, when it soon hardens up unpleasantly)

 

[dzerig]

For what does it use the 1-2W, if you still have to switch it on manually? What happened to the idea of just switching off?

Presumably standby to on is faster than the extended off to on Amir cited.

The on off switch is in the rear, as usual to find your Schiit.

I wonder what Schiit could do if they went the Heresy route for speaker amps they way they did with the headphone amp

Jason has said they have tried class D and did not like how it sounded. Also tried Gannet or some such thing. Better but didn't really add anything to existing competition, so they passed.

Jason likes to tinker. Something will pop up before too long I guess.

 

[Toroid]

Yeah, Schiit is going to lose a lot of business to affordable class D hi-fi. (Heck, I was going to buy a Vidar 2 before all the great reviews of the Fosi v3 monos and I decided to put my kickstarter order in instead). Sooner or later they will need to come out with a great measuring, powerful class D to complete.

 

[AdamG]

Schiit is going to lose a lot of business to hi-fi.

Hi Toroid,

We know that you don’t mean this in a derogatory manner towards Chinese people. We have a Forum specific Policy to avoid this description. Therefore, we kindly request our Members avoid using this terminology “Chi-fi” as it can have negative connotations for such companies and individuals.

Thank you for your cooperation and understanding in this regard.

 

[Prince Valiant]

Yeah, Schiit is going to lose a lot of business to hi-fi. (Heck, I was going to buy a Vidar 2 before all the great reviews of the Fosi v3 monos and I decided to put my kickstarter order in instead). Sooner or later they will need to come out with a great measuring, powerful class D to complete.

Why would they need to push a class D amp out? Another generational progression like v1 to v2 and there wouldn't be anything to worry about aside from power and additional features (price notwithstanding).

 

[Toroid]

Hi Toroid,

We know that you don’t mean this in a derogatory manner towards Chinese people. We have a Forum specific Policy to avoid this description. Therefore, we kindly request our Members avoid using this terminology “hi-fi” as it can have negative connotations for such companies and individuals.

Thank you for your cooperation and understanding in this regard.

Definitely did not mean to be offensive. Sorry about that (did not know that had negative connotations) I can delete the post if that makes sense. Let me know.

 

[Trudius]

Yeah, Schiit is going to lose a lot of business to hi-fi. (Heck, I was going to buy a Vidar 2 before all the great reviews of the Fosi v3 monos and I decided to put my kickstarter order in instead). Sooner or later they will need to come out with a great measuring, powerful class D to complete.

The problem is that the great measuring, powerful class D amplifiers that you allude, that are also reliable and yield good measuring results (including IMD) across the board are in the price range of the Vidar, not the Aiyima, Fosi, SMSL types.

 

[Joe Smith]

Yeah, Schiit is going to lose a lot of business to affordable class D hi-fi. (Heck, I was going to buy a Vidar 2 before all the great reviews of the Fosi v3 monos and I decided to put my kickstarter order in instead). Sooner or later they will need to come out with a great measuring, powerful class D to complete.

Based on past replies from them, there's no Schiit interest in Class D. I personally feel they are missing business in the $400-600 amp price segment, perhaps they will again offer something in that range. A lot of the recent Schiit products don't float my boat - the mini-amps are not price competitive with the Chinese class D amps, and the speaker amps are OK but a little over-priced or under-featured. And they took away the one product I was interested in buying, a solid state preamp. The turntable flopped/ended and their CD transport is full-featured but at a very high cost. I love my Modi and Magni 3 products, but a lot of their product line shoots low or high from where my needs are.

 

[bboris77]

Based on past replies from them, there's no Schiit interest in Class D. I personally feel they are missing business in the $400-600 amp price segment, perhaps they will again offer something in that range. A lot of the recent Schiit products don't float my boat - the mini-amps are not price competitive with the Chinese class D amps, and the speaker amps are OK but a little over-priced or under-featured. And they took away the one product I was interested in buying, a solid state preamp. The turntable flopped/ended and their CD transport is full-featured but at a very high cost. I love my Modi and Magni 3 products, but a lot of their product line shoots low or high from where my needs are.

My opinion of their post-2020 products completely aligns with yours, and after having purchased more than 10 of their earlier products, I haven't bought one since COVID. I am very convinced that they would make a Class D speaker amplifier if they could make money on it. I think that the whole schtick about their distrust towards Class D is a part of their masterful marketing machine designed to drum up demand for their Class A/B speaker amps as well as their discrete A/B headphone amps. Make no mistake, I like Schiit in general and I also love my Magni 3, but I have absolutely no reservations buying audio equipment designed by Chinese companies and made in China. Part of this is the fact that I am in Canada, and shipping costs of heavier items like Vidar 2 are very prohibitive initially as well as in case of potential repairs.

 

[wwenze]

Audio electronics have long been luxury goods anyway. The Fosi v3 would be a Prius, the internal amps in monitor speakers would be industrial trucks, Hypex amps are Ferrari and Schiit Vidar 2 is American muscle

 

[amirm]

Power amplifiers are the least reliable components in audio systems due to high voltages, power and heat involved. I have repaired hundreds of class AB amplifiers so they absolutely fail. There should be no automatic assumption that they are better in reliability. They are however much easier to repair.

 

[wwenze]

Met a speaker with a broken LM3886. Junked it and connected it to an external class D mini amp.

High cost of living and high wages ftw.

 

[Count Dacula]

Audio electronics have long been luxury goods anyway. The Fosi v3 would be a Prius, the internal amps in monitor speakers would be industrial trucks, Hypex amps are Ferrari and Schiit Vidar 2 is American muscle

I used to think of my old 1990s system as; techy Japanese CDP, frail and peevish British speakers and American heavy industry semi-conductor amplifier. All conforming to their respective stereotypes. What ever happened to RussSound?

lol, again with H&SS, you find different industrial ethos embedded in different countries WWII war production. I see it in their cars now too. Lightweight Japanese fighters with high performance and low pilot safety, designs provided by the Luftwaffe. Overly complex and high maintenance German tanks with limited production numbers, verses swarms of cheap American "muscle" in "Tommy Cookers" aka the Sherman tank, fast thru design and fast production/deployment in quantity. Like Stalin said, quantity has a quality all of it's own. That's where we are with D Class amps, someplace between the Japanese and Soviet models.

 

[dzerig]

@amirm - same question as last time. 1 Vidar 2, or 2 Outlaw Audio 2220s?

Sadly, Vidar 2 is not in my future. I need the long runs to attach XLR cables and Vidar 2 monoblocks is too hot for my region.

I'm using Gjallerhorn via XLR in mono for my setup at this time. 30 watts is plenty for my speakers and room!

If you need long cable runs, go with the 2220s. I think they look close.