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Neumann KH120 II Monitor Review

Rate this monitor speaker:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 3 0.6%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 3 0.6%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 37 7.9%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 428 90.9%

  • Total voters
    471
So I got my pair of KH 120 II and almost had a heart attack. That's because my parents brought them from Europe in their luggage (and complained a lot, as these are not exactly small or light), and once I set them up at the office at home, the left one had a strange noise coming out of the tweeter. I thought it was a ground loop, so lifted the ground through the switch and nothing. I disconnected the XLR and still the noise was coming out of the tweeter with the speaker idle. I even swapped power cords and nothing.

I don't know if warranty was going to cover a defective unit in another country, it was a risk I took when I decided to buy it, but I was not expecting to use it so soon...

Then I saw behind this speaker and there it was: my Wi-Fi router on the table, a TP-Link Deco. I moved it some 20 cm to the side, right behind the monitor and between both speakers, and instant relief: the noise was 100% gone.

Funny thing is that the former KH 80 DSP in the same spot never had any issues. So I guess the 120s are more sensitive to Wi-Fi interference?

Anyway I listened to them and compared to my 80s. How do they differ? On paper the tweeter of the 120s are a tiny little more linear, and the dispersion very similar (that is, excellent). The elephant in the room is the bass extension: 53 x 41 Hz in -6dB makes a big difference. Still no extension to subbass territory, but nonetheless a healthy bass comes from the speakers. Also they sound less strained when playing medium-loud, naturally and expected.

So my 80s are going up for sale locally soon, and I will always remember the scare those 120s gave me lol. :)

Since a post is worthless without pictures here is one. The 80s are covered on the right.

View attachment 377395
congrats
 
For the price difference between both, I think a KH 120 II + sub plays louder and deeper than the KH 150 alone. But then of course the KH 150 + sub would play even louder, but at a price $$.
If listened nearfield to midfield I personally would opt for the very slightly better directivity of KH120II and full range of adding a sub with MA-1, it usually should be loud enough for sensible distance and volume anyway, and cash is king above that
 
If listened nearfield to midfield I personally would opt for the very slightly better directivity of KH120II and full range of adding a sub with MA-1, it usually should be loud enough for sensible distance and volume anyway, and cash is king above that
I'll use it for music listening (not mixing), would that be ok? (I don't think I'd go over 90db)
 
I'll use it for music listening (not mixing), would that be ok? (I don't think I'd go over 90db)
personally I think it's perfectly ok, I am using a 8030C+7040A combo in nearfield and I always keep the sensitivity at lowest and then a passive pre amp to make the volume at ~40% with <4V XLR output in my holo spring 2 dac to listen to music at ~1m distance. and still find it kind of loud to my liking. so the KH120 should only do better. IMO if you go over 90db average you have your hearing to worry more than the speakers you use
 
personally I think it's perfectly ok, I am using a 8030C+7040A combo in nearfield and I always keep the sensitivity at lowest and then a passive pre amp to make the volume at ~40% with <4V XLR output in my holo spring 2 dac to listen to music at ~1m distance. and still find it kind of loud to my liking. so the KH120 should only do better. IMO if you go over 90db average you have your hearing to worry more than the speakers you use
Thanks a lot, I just wanted to make sure cause with these professional monitors I am not always sure when the comments refer to sound mixing/editing and when they refer to hifi listening
 
Thanks a lot, I just wanted to make sure cause with these professional monitors I am not always sure when the comments refer to sound mixing/editing and when they refer to hifi listening
IMO a transparent (neutral) speaker is the best to do hifi also as by defition it gives you the most "true" sound, you can always temper witht EQ profiles but if the speaker have it's strong flavor in directivity, you can't. and sure, the small monitors arn't for you to go party level at a 500 square foot living room. and usually those tools don't look as exciting/tasteful for enjoyment.
 
Would you happen to know how the KH 120 II compare to the previous KH 120 A? The latter can be found for a better price
 
I had the same error on both speakers : MA1 flash the firmware, reboot the speaker but doesn't detect when the speaker the online again. The only option is to kill MA1 and restart the process to update the other monitor, it's a shame but it's harmless.
Hi

Had the same issue or almost the same: after the MA-1 win10/11 app updated itself, the fw update was claimed for both left and right. Fw 1.1.1.10 to 1.1.1.11 I guess. Didn't receive the same as yours messages BUT the "cannot self-restart" one. After that one is semi-bricked OR bricked (as the MA-1 could see it and identify it as left or right, but NO SOUND AT ALL via any SPDIF or XLR-input.
What a h*ll is going on, @Neumann??

The other one 120 ii works fine, although I got the same semi-error as the other one's (bricked/semi-bricked, even after several restarts and failed attempts to reset it according to the manual)

Is there anyone else trying to update to 11's kg 120ii firmware?

How can a well crafted product behave like that? Is there windows version of app in charge with my bad luck? Or Mac's, too?

Thanks for any good input
 
If you don't update the firmware and don't use the MA-1, is there a chance for less problems with turning on ?
 
If you don't update the firmware and don't use the MA-1, is there a chance for less problems with turning on ?
"Network" or "local" controlled, same issue/behavior: turns on by on/off rocker but no sound at all from any source. It forwards the SPDIF signal to the right-channel of 120 ii (via ouputs) but for itself, nothing.

When on "network" control, doesn't PROMPT for any further fw update, it's seen by the ma-1 as being on latest fw (ending in .11).

Too late for me to revert something. Have no (more) optionto not update, now, so cannot tell you YES
 
Would you happen to know how the KH 120 II compare to the previous KH 120 A? The latter can be found for a better price
Neumann provide measurements of both versions on their website: https://www.neumann.com/en-us/file-finder/

I downloaded their graphs, scaled them to match, then overlaid them for easy comparison.

Frequency Response (red=KH120A):
FR.png
KH120II plays deeper.

Group Delay (red=KH120A):
GD.png
KH120II less GD at lowest frequencies.

THD at 90dB SPL (red=KH120A):
THD.png
No meaningful difference.

Directivity (top=KH120A):
DIR_120A.png
DIR_120II.png
KH120A has very slightly wider directivity in both axes, but vertically it's less controlled.
 
I am considering getting these since they are retailing for 750€ at Thomann momentarily and would be really thankful if someone could help me with a couple questions:
1- Do you think I could connect my wiim pro plus as source using the coax input? Or using a converter cable RCA-TRS?
2- Do the KH 120 II have enough power for listening at a distance of 2 - 2,5 meters in a 25 sq. m. room? I rarely reach 90 dB whilst listening
3- Is there a significant difference with the Neumann KH 120 II AES67 apart from the AES connection?
4- Would it be feasable to work measuring with a umik-1 + REW and then manually inserting the filters to the Wiim's PEQ?

Thanks a lot in advance!
Thanks a lot, I just wanted to make sure cause with these professional monitors I am not always sure when the comments refer to sound mixing/editing and when they refer to hifi listening

I'll use it for music listening (not mixing), would that be ok? (I don't think I'd go over 90db)

Would you happen to know how the KH 120 II compare to the previous KH 120 A? The latter can be found for a better price

Studio monitors sound fine for hi-fi, music enjoyment listening, but there is a difference in what studio monitors aim for versus what hi-fi speakers aim for. This is not a perfect analogy, but one way I think about it --

When you shop for light bulbs, you will see bulbs that are a bit cooler and blue, and light bulbs that are a bit warmer and yellow. They are both correct presentations of white, but in different ways. If you are a doctor inspecting patients, you probably prefer the cooler bulb: you can better see flaws in your patients' skin under that light. In that setting, the cooler bulb is more true in showing what people look like. If you are taking photos of people, you probably prefer the warmer bulb: it makes them look more natural, like how people look outdoors under sunlight. In that situation, the warmer bulb is more true in showing what people look like. In either situation, you are trying to see people as they really are, but in different ways to reveal what is true.

Studio monitors and hi-fi speakers often aim for neutral EQ and low distortion, so they can both go for the same measured results. But there are also other things not captured by measurements. For example, hi-fi equipment often aims for creating a large soundstage, as hi-fi listeners love that for music enjoyment. You'll see hi-fi listeners talk constantly about soundstage in judging and comparing hi-fi equipment. But you don't see the music pros and mixers talk so much about soundstage when they judge and compare studio equipment. They have other priorities in what they are looking for.

The KH 120 II has digital inputs, so you can use the speaker's internal DAC and its room correction technology. The KH 120 A only takes analog inputs, so you would need an external DAC, and you would not have the room correction technology. (However, to use the room correction technology, you will need to buy the Neumann MA 1 microphone and have equipment to connect up the microphone.) If you are using these speakers in a home hi-fi system, you should consider how you will manage a turntable (especially if you want to be fully analog from record to speakers) and RCA versus balanced jacks along your system. Monitor speakers are designed with studio gear upstream, while hi-fi equipment is designed for hi-fi equipment upstream.

I think the KH 120 II can work for a 25 sq meter room. Some advantages of going up in size (like to the KH 150) include: better bass extension; more powerful speaker can sound better and less strained at the same volume as their smaller brother. Some disadvantages of going up in size include: too much bass (may need to get into room treatments, and positioning, where your options can be harder in a living space); they can sound worse and less cohesive at very low volume listening compared to their smaller brother. It is very hard to tell someone what speaker size is best for them, without seeing the space itself and what issues that space will have with positioning speakers. If you do not already have hi-fi speakers, to know what size works or does not work in your space, and you are not a loud listener, I might think go with smaller ones with the option of adding a sub later.
 
Neumann provide measurements of both versions on their website: https://www.neumann.com/en-us/file-finder/

I downloaded their graphs, scaled them to match, then overlaid them for easy comparison.

Frequency Response (red=KH120A):
View attachment 377548
KH120II plays deeper.

Group Delay (red=KH120A):
View attachment 377547
KH120II less GD at lowest frequencies.

THD at 90dB SPL (red=KH120A):
View attachment 377546
No meaningful difference.

Directivity (top=KH120A):
View attachment 377544
View attachment 377545
KH120A has very slightly wider directivity in both axes, but vertically it's less controlled.
Cheers! That is really friendly of yours
 
would a pair of these be louder than kali in8 v2 at around 2.5 metres.
I understand that it is a 3 way and has 8 inch woofer.
But it has lower amplification and I believe has higher distortion at lower spl too.
This is of course without a sub at this point.
 
If listened nearfield to midfield I personally would opt for the very slightly better directivity of KH120II and full range of adding a sub with MA-1, it usually should be loud enough for sensible distance and volume anyway, and cash is king above that

When listening in lounge.
If your going to add a sub, how much does the ma1 correction do compared to other subs having eq and being placed wherever you want. Surely the kh750 is over kill with kh120 ii.

I mean you could save money with Kali ws12 v2 subwoofer.
It has lots of low pass filter frequency options and footswitch for comparing with/without sub.
And above all else, has high spl.
Maybe add rew and Wiim device to eq the whole setup.
 
When listening in lounge.
If your going to add a sub, how much does the ma1 correction do compared to other subs having eq and being placed wherever you want. Surely the kh750 is over kill with kh120 ii.

I mean you could save money with Kali ws12 v2 subwoofer.
It has lots of low pass filter frequency options and footswitch for comparing with/without sub.
And above all else, has high spl.
Maybe add rew and Wiim device to eq the whole setup.
Sure there will be some savings going that route, it’s always a cost vs ease of use case. The ma-1 is just a very continent way to get it calibrated with phase alignment vs user effort. One could decide which way is the best
 
Neumann provide measurements of both versions on their website: https://www.neumann.com/en-us/file-finder/

I downloaded their graphs, scaled them to match, then overlaid them for easy comparison.

Frequency Response (red=KH120A):
View attachment 377548
KH120II plays deeper.

Group Delay (red=KH120A):
View attachment 377547
KH120II less GD at lowest frequencies.

THD at 90dB SPL (red=KH120A):
View attachment 377546
No meaningful difference.

Directivity (top=KH120A):
View attachment 377544
View attachment 377545
KH120A has very slightly wider directivity in both axes, but vertically it's less controlled.

There is a massive difference in amplification.
Same watts as kh150 for what it’s worth.
 
There is a massive difference in amplification.
Same watts as kh150 for what it’s worth.
But I doubt that's worth anything beside it goes for a cooler class D amp. with basically the same distortion at 90db spl getting more watts likely doesn't matter
 
would a pair of these be louder than kali in8 v2 at around 2.5 metres.
I understand that it is a 3 way and has 8 inch woofer.
But it has lower amplification and I believe has higher distortion at lower spl too.
This is of course without a sub at this point.
any answers?
 
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