KH150 vs KH120 II (both with KH750). Or Genelec?

[starfly]

So I've gone through a few iterations of this now, but at this point I'm kind of at a point where I'm looking for my end-game office setup and will spend the required money.

I recently picked up the KH120 II (2x) +KH750 and they sound great, after calibration with MA-1 (and adjusting Neumann's default curve, which introduced too much bass for my liking, so I got it flat-ish after tweaking the MA-1 PEQ filters, though it's REALLY annoying I can't just start with a flat curve and need to tweak their default curve, which means it's not a perfectly flat line, but I got it as flat as I could get it).

This setup is probably fine for my current office. But I expect to move later this year, or next year. And overall wondering if I should just get the KH150 instead of the KH120. Other than the SPL differences, they measure about the same. But I was reading that actual in-room response can show some more dramatic differences, with the KH120 overall perhaps sounding better. Any data to show the differences here?

Ideally I'd have a somewhat large listening sweet spot, both vertically and horizontally, as my head might move around a lot. Current listening distance is about 4 feet (1.2m) to each monitor. This listening distance could increase or decrease depending on what kind of house I move to eventually. The monitors are on stands next to my desk aiming down at me so they can fire over my two monitors which take up most of my desk space. Tweeters more or less pointed at ear level.

Going to KH150 worth it here? (yes there's a big jump in price, but I'll never buy another office system again).

Or, would a Genelec setup (e.g. 8340 + 7350/7360) be a better overall system for this purpose? I read they're supposed to have wider dispersion, so would that mean a larger listening sweet spot?

Edit: anywhere I mention “KH120”, I mean the KH120 II.

 

[unpluggged]

their default curve, which means it's not a perfectly flat line

This is not how a speaker system should sound in a room. Speakers should have flat FR in anechoic environment, but in a room such FR curve sounds much too bright and unnatural. The MA 1 does a great job with default settings; you should tweak the target curve only if you have a specific requirement and know what you are doing.

This setup is probably fine for my current office. But I expect to move later this year, or next year. And overall wondering if I should just get the KH150 instead of the KH120

Instead of KH 120, perhaps. Instead of KH 120 II, unlikely. In the nearfield and with the KH 750 DSP, definitely not.

with the KH120 overall perhaps sounding better

Why are you contemplating the KH 120 when you already have the much superior KH 120 II?

Going to KH150 worth it here? (yes there's a big jump in price, but I'll never buy another office system again).

Here − no.

Or, would a Genelec setup (e.g. 8340 + 7350/7360) be a better overall system for this purpose? I read they're supposed to have wider dispersion, so would that mean a larger listening sweet spot?

Exchanging Neumanns for Genelecs of similar size here will not improve the sound.

For my desktop setup, I'm happy with my KH 120 with KH 750 DSP and not even think now about getting the KH 120 II or the KH 150. The MA 1 and the sub make a night-and-day difference even with the old analog Neumanns.

 

[jhaider]

it's REALLY annoying I can't just start with a flat curve and need to tweak their default curve, which means it's not a perfectly flat line, but I got it as flat as I could get it).

Send a support message asking for this. I have as well, as like to start room gain where it actually starts in room and eyeball the actual trend from there. That doesn’t always match the default curve.

As for 120 II vs 150 - speaking for me only 150 is too big for home desktop. Unless someone comes up with something smaller that has the same measured superiority and output capability, don’t see an “upgrade” path from 120 II.

 

[starfly]

This is not how a speaker system should sound in a room. Speakers should have flat FR in anechoic environment, but in a room such FR curve sounds much too bright and unnatural. The MA 1 does a great job with default settings; you should tweak the target curve only if you have a specific requirement and know what you are doing.


Instead of KH 120, perhaps. Instead of KH 120 II, unlikely. In the nearfield and with the KH 750 DSP, definitely not.


Why are you contemplating the KH 120 when you already have the much superior KH 120 II?


Here − no.


Exchanging Neumanns for Genelecs of similar size here will not improve the sound.

For my desktop setup, I'm happy with my KH 120 with KH 750 DSP and not even think now about getting the KH 120 II or the KH 150. The MA 1 and the sub make a night-and-day difference even with the old analog Neumanns.

Thanks. I should clarify that everywhere I mentioned KH120 I meant KH120 II

 

[DJBonoBobo]

No, there is no reason getting new speakers in your situation. If you are not satisfied the first thing to adress is suboptimal positions. A typical desk setup with monitors in a small room always is a compromise, though. Don't expect perfect quality in a suboptimal environment.

 

[Mort]

One thing you might like about genelec GLM - it forces a more flat curve. I actually wish it allowed more customization.

 

[AnalogSteph]

One thing you might like about genelec GLM - it forces a more flat curve.

Keep in mind that Genelecs also tend to have wider dispersion, so would tend brighter in-room.

 

[starfly]

Keep in mind that Genelecs also tend to have wider dispersion, so would tend brighter in-room.

Does wider dispersion in this sense mean a bigger sweet spot?

 

[Mort]

The best answer is 'no'. It does not mean that.

 

[starfly]

The best answer is 'no'. It does not mean that.

Ok, interesting video. So that changes my views a bit on wide dispersion speakers. So Genelec vs. Neumann doesn't really mean one will have a wider sweetspot than the other, it just depends on how you set it up.

It's either way starting to look like one of my KH120 II monitors might have an issue with the tweeter where I hear a slight crackling sound when I put my ear next to it. Been troubleshooting this with Neumann support, but it appears to be an issue with the monitor itself. No interference, cables, etc.

What's the general consensus on long-term reliability of Neumann vs. Genelec? I want to keep these expensive speakers for decades if I can.

 

[Klonatans]

What's the general consensus on long-term reliability of Neumann vs. Genelec? I want to keep these expensive speakers for decades if I can.

I can tell only my experience. One of my KH150 speakers stopped working 15 months after purchase. As it was still under warranty, it was repaired for free and the cause of malfunction was mainboard failure. It works just fine since then. I don't think it's a common issue (may happen as well to Genelec or any other studio monitors), however I was unpleasantlly surprised when it happened.

 

[Mort]

Genelecs have exceptional reliability.

 

[starfly]

I can tell only my experience. One of my KH150 speakers stopped working 15 months after purchase. As it was still under warranty, it was repaired for free and the cause of malfunction was mainboard failure. It works just fine since then. I don't think it's a common issue (may happen as well to Genelec or any other studio monitors), however I was unpleasantlly surprised when it happened.

Hmmm, the fact that one of my KH120 II’s has a faint crackling sound in the tweeter gives me a bit of pause with Neumann. And this thing is brand new. At this price point I want to be pretty sure it’ll last me at least a couple decades if not longer.

 

[Klonatans]

Hmmm, the fact that one of my KH120 II’s has a faint crackling sound in the tweeter gives me a bit of pause with Neumann. And this thing is brand new. At this price point I want to be pretty sure it’ll last me at least a couple decades if not longer.

I would recommend you to contact the store you bought your KH120 II from and ask for a replacement or repair if the crackling sound is still there.

A couple of decades is a long time for active speakers with electronic components, but in theory they could last 20+ years with reasonable care and routine maintenance after a while. Of course, nothing is perfect and it's not a given, as my experience proves (I was lucky though to have a valid warranty back then and I hope my KH150 will serve me for years to come).

 

[unpluggged]

gives me a bit of pause with Neumann

Not a single issue with my Neumanns in three years of continuous use.

And this thing is brand new. At this price point I want to be pretty sure it’ll last me at least a couple decades if not longer.

Nobody will give you such an assurance regarding any electronic device.