Khadas Tone2 Pro Review (DAC & Amp)

[olivier salad]

Is this the issue posters are referring to?
View attachment 115079
Please read Amir's comments written on the graph here, this is much more of a measurement issue then a performance issue. It does not affect usability or even audible performance.

If the issue you are referring to is the LED color system for changing settings then I understand, it sounds tedious and confusing. However do not be confused into thinking this is a poorly performing product.

I understand that there's no audible difference, the real problem is that the firmware upgrade doesn't work and you've got to use hardware programmer to change it.

 

[frogmeat69]

Oh boy, the sky is falling, .

 

[Gabriel1]

It's confirmed not hardware matter and this improvement is by upgrading a new firmware. But unfortunately the registor value is only able to be set/write via the co-processor, so common firmware upgrading like XMOS proessor via USB not work, more details:
View attachment 114977



You can wait for somewhile if this improvement comes important for you, and our future batches will support both firmwares upgrading via USB cable(hardware design already support).

To be clear, can early adopters expect to ultimately be able to accomplish this upgrade via USB like everyone else,(like the next product run) or will my unit always require specialized programming hardware and opening the unit? I don’t presently own such hardware nor do I have the experience to do so. So would be good to have an understanding and if possible some timelines. Thanks you in advance for your input . G.

 

[dtaylo1066]

I would say if one has reservations about the firmware update -- just wait a while. I am not concerned about the measurement anomolies, as people who have listened to this DAC think it sounds great. Very positive listenting reviews already are on youtube, and Amir's measurements show this thing is well made, but for a few anomolies. I would just like to be able to use it as preamp, thus I desire volume for the line out. It sounds like a firmware update will be able to fix that, but is not yet ready. New products can have some issues. My neighbor bought a $65,000 Tesla and after a few days the Tesla Tech guy had to come out and upgrade the firmware.

 

[KTN46]

I'd kill for a DAC/Preamp only version of this with maybe a TOSLINK/Coax input.

 

[digicidal]

Why can't all these Chinese manufacturers produce problem-free device? It seems that in most cases there are some bugs and sometimes they aren't fixable by a firmware update. Customers don't have to beta test hardware at their own expense.

Just curious, but what device from any manufacturer - regardless of origin or industry - were you able to get a newly released product which worked exactly as specified, in it's most optimal state, without significant inconvenience and/or revisions?

As someone who has recently played (or attempted to) Cyberpunk 2077 (EU) on a PC built primarily from "enterprise-grade" parts (JP/CN/US) - while waiting for my 3 cars (JP/CA/EU) to get back from their numerous recalls - and only marginally succeeded after dozens of hotfixes, patches, and firmware updates... I find it hard to believe I'm alone in this experience.

I've spent years trying to fix what my pool builder (US) did to my backyard and thousands fixing what my home builder (also US) did to the rest. I've replaced logic boards in 3 "premium" home appliances within a year or two of purchase (SK, SK, US)... and the list goes on.

I'm just honestly wondering if it's truly common for anyone to get anything from anywhere these days and not feel like a "beta-test victim" in one way or another? In my case, I can easily count the number of products and/or services that have been 100% trouble-free in the past 20 years on one hand. The ones that required some weird shenanigans (often provided by other enterprising consumers after the manufacturer ignored all requests) are far too numerous to even attempt counting however.

As the saying goes... GOOD, CHEAP, QUICK - pick any two.

 

[respice finem]

The "early adopters" risk is universal, there's always a possibility of buying something "half done" if it's new on the market. The more complex the product, the higher the risk. Probably the best example is software, which is really never "done". All this is IMHO acceptable, as long as the product "fits the description" - at least the minimum features/parameters etc. should work. Practically speaking, I'm with the camp that tends to buy the "ver. 2.0" of things.

 

[olivier salad]

Just curious, but what device from any manufacturer - regardless of origin or industry - were you able to get a newly released product which worked exactly as specified, in it's most optimal state, without significant inconvenience and/or revisions?

As someone who has recently played (or attempted to) Cyberpunk 2077 (EU) on a PC built primarily from "enterprise-grade" parts (JP/CN/US) - while waiting for my 3 cars (JP/CA/EU) to get back from their numerous recalls - and only marginally succeeded after dozens of hotfixes, patches, and firmware updates... I find it hard to believe I'm alone in this experience.

I've spent years trying to fix what my pool builder (US) did to my backyard and thousands fixing what my home builder (also US) did to the rest. I've replaced logic boards in 3 "premium" home appliances within a year or two of purchase (SK, SK, US)... and the list goes on.

I'm just honestly wondering if it's truly common for anyone to get anything from anywhere these days and not feel like a "beta-test victim" in one way or another? In my case, I can easily count the number of products and/or services that have been 100% trouble-free in the past 20 years on one hand. The ones that required some weird shenanigans (often provided by other enterprising consumers after the manufacturer ignored all requests) are far too numerous to even attempt counting however.

As the saying goes... GOOD, CHEAP, QUICK - pick any two.

You can't compare a DAC to a game or a car which were developed by thousands of people for years. It's a much simpler device, probably developed by one guy. Their previous product (Soncoz LA-QXD1) was a failure, but they've rushed to release a half-baked product again.

 

[digicidal]

You can't compare a DAC to a game or a car which were developed by thousands of people for years. It's a much simpler device, probably developed by one guy. Their previous product (Soncoz LA-QXD1) was a failure, but they've rushed to release a half-baked product again.

True... it's far, far less likely for a small team or single engineer to accomplish what your are suggesting. I also wouldn't call this a "half-baked" product... more like "mostly baked" - but fair enough. My real point was that although I've also had my share of bad experiences with smaller Chinese manufactured devices... I've had some which worked flawlessly without compromise - and plenty of half baked (or less) results from domestic manufacturers with far more resources to work with.

 

[Gouwa]

Hi, Tone2 Pro early bird and the potential backers,
1) For the early bird with SN 0Cxxxx and 11xxxx, thanks for the support and you can always contact our sales or distributors where you placed your order for a return, a replacement or refund if you do care the 'issue' or improvement.
2) The potential backers might just wait for some while

And actually, as what I commented im my previous reply, the T2P still supports USB upgrade for XMOS processor, which means we still have path/method to update(override) the DAC registors for this improvement even that initial registor values is write/set by the co-processor.

BTW, if you are interesting on the hardware designer of Tone2 Pro, I will tell you his name is Eric.

Good day!

 

[Anthony Rehm]

BTW, if you are interesting on the hardware designer of Tone2 Pro, I will tell you his name is Eric.

Gouwa, this is really awesome that Khadas actively participates in the life of its community. I do not own any Khadas products yet, but given your professional attitude and the review results, I definitely want to buy Khadas Tone2 Pro as soon as the matter is resolved.

 

[Gabriel1]

Hi, Tone2 Pro early bird and the potential backers,
1) For the early bird with SN 0Cxxxx and 11xxxx, thanks for the support and you can always contact our sales or distributors where you placed your order for a return, a replacement or refund if you do care the 'issue' or improvement.
2) The potential backers might just wait for some while

And actually, as what I commented im my previous reply, the T2P still supports USB upgrade for XMOS processor, which means we still have path/method to update(override) the DAC registors for this improvement even that initial registor values is write/set by the co-processor.

BTW, if you are interesting on the hardware designer of Tone2 Pro, I will tell you his name is Eric.

Good day!

Ok, so let’s put things in perspective. Anyone can make a mistake. But to find an individual or a corporation able to respond so quickly to an oversight is rare indeed! And, to move to make things right so fast, EXCELLENT and EXCEPTIONAL ! I’m really impressed and would go out of my way to support such a company. A big thumbs up and thank you, regards G.

 

[Whodiini]

I received the tone2 pro and here are my initial impressions. Despite the small size, it feels quality construction and parts. Sound is quite good, but will need to burn it in for a week to really know how it sounds. Right now, I would put it slightly at or above the SMSL SU8v2, Below the SMSL SU-9 and M500. It has a very similar tonality (ESS sound) with the SU-9, but lacks the dynamics. A bit boring. Running TIDAL, and cannot tell if it is correctly processing MQA. My recommendation is for discrete LEDs to tell which mode it is in. The LEDs underneath the knob are ergonomically poor. I can live with the selection knob as long as there is decent feedback, Also, there is no way to select oversampling on the tone 2 pro to run it at 96khz to avoid the issue described. Amir is really doing a service to the community by his measurements. But there are aspects that my ears tell me differences that are not measured. One of them is dynamics. All the measurements are steady state, whereas live music is very dynamic. That is probably why my go to DAC is the Schiit Yggydrasil. Measures poorly, but makes music dynamically alive. Leading edge transients is another aspect that I hear than isnt measured. Su-9 is better than the tone2pro in this regard. For $200. the tone2 pro would be the one to beat if they could fix the issues mentioned in this thread and put discrete LEDs. (BTW, I tested it only as a USB DAC)

 

[Veri]

All the measurements are steady state, whereas live music is very dynamic.

That is.. just absolutely not true. Total bollocks. Dual tone, multi-tone, linearity, jitter, these are all what you call "dynamic" tests. Not "steady state".

 

[Massimo]

I have an issue with my KTB2 Pro that has proven to be very frustrating. It's connected to my iMac via USB and after a some hours it just drops the connection requiring that I unplug the USB cable to my iMac and reconnect it. I have run many DACs with this iMac and never experienced this issue.

 

[courtesy]

I have an issue with my KTB2 Pro that has proven to be very frustrating. It's connected to my iMac via USB and after a some hours it just drops the connection requiring that I unplug the USB cable to my iMac and reconnect it. I have run many DACs with this iMac and never experienced this issue.

Do you have the input set to “auto sense”? Try setting it to USB.

 

[Massimo]

Do you have the input set to “auto sense”? Try setting it to USB.

Thanks. I have tried with input set to auto sense as well as USB. The issue remains. I have also tried to power it up with an external power source. It doesn't help. My unit still drops the USB connection after some random period of time, typically several hours.

 

[Roen]

Any Headphone Out SINAD ratings?

 

[evilyoda]

I've been waiting for an ASR review for a while and of course I got busy with my move and actually stumbled upon the Youtube video! (guess those algorithms aren't so far off...) I'm not on top of all the reviews so if there's another comparable product (around the $250 price range with balanced cables), I'd love to know what it is. Otherwise, once things settle down for me in a few months, I look forward to playing with a Tone 2 Pro!

 

[somebodyelse]

If you care about the headphone output then I think the closest we've seen is an interface like the MOTU M2, a bit behind on performance but with other capabilities too. If you just want line level outs then there's the Schiit Modius, the LA-QXD1 and maybe the M200. If you only need the USB input then there's a balanced D10s variant on the way. Keep in mind the relatively expensive cables for those custom connectors when comparing prices. I may have missed some other options.