Emotiva RMC-1 AV Processor Review

[ernestcarl]

Yeah that thread has given me many a hearty laugh. Especially with the latter posts. However, in Emotiva's defense... developing a DAC that can compete in both price and features/performance of the best models coming out of China now - is ridiculously difficult. To a large extent it's just reinventing the wheel at this point - it's not like you can get "more" transparent than fully transparent, nor are there any requisite features that are missing from the majority of competing devices.

This is where the high end guys have a much easier time. You can provide provably inferior performance for a 10K% markup... and people will fight each other over how much better is just has to sound. Unfortunately for them, Emotiva hasn't chosen that market - instead targeting those with smaller budgets and much less religious adherence to "brand superiority".

It's quite similar to the computer market (for the same reasons) - unless you have the price, materials, and logo of Apple... people aren't going to pay $5K+ for outdated technology. If you are Apple however... people will pay you $400 for adding tiny casters to it:
View attachment 71699
Seems reasonable... Also far less work than adding Dirac to a processor I would imagine. LOL!

Should be relatively easy to DIY this project if one were interested... I wonder if Apple has coined a name for their special wheels.

 

[digicidal]

Should be relatively easy to DIY this project if one were interested... I wonder if Apple has coined a name for their special wheels.

Internally probably something like "the rolling ripoff" - externally though "premium mobility-enhancement technology" is more likely.

Human beings are definitely an odd species in that regard. No matter how limited the convenience, economy, or luxury might be, we're willing to spend far more resources and effort to acquire them than they save/contribute in almost every case. I seriously doubt anyone would tolerate the delays and bugs in something like the RMC-1 if it weren't for the perception that you're getting a $20K processor for a quarter of the price.

I see that all the time on houses here too... spend $30K-40K on a full solar array, tankless water heater, etc... only to sell the house 2 years later (often for no more than non-upgraded houses nearby). The perception that you're "beating the system" somehow is usually enough to convince most people to separate themselves from their cash - even if there is no rational expectation of ever actually realizing those savings.

How many people drive their Tesla Model S long enough to save $40K+ in fuel? Sure many paid cash because it was the "in thing" or because it is ludicrously fast while not costing Bugatti money... for the rest, it seems the near six-figure price (over with options) was justified by perceived savings and financed via a 10-year loan (which guarantees they won't ever realize any savings over even the most inefficient ICE based vehicles).

 

[patate91]

So far Emotiva has two AVR in the top 3 of ASR.

They are putting out good products

 

[ernestcarl]

Internally probably something like "the rolling ripoff" - externally though "premium mobility-enhancement technology" is more likely.

Hmmn... Automated, smart voice/retina-scan-activated, extra secure wheel locks are missing, so the “tech” is second only to superficial “visionary” aesthetics. Too bad...

 

[digicidal]

So far Emotiva has two AVR in the top 3 of ASR.

They are putting out good products

Agreed... sort of. The performance of what is there and works is quite acceptable, and in many cases even exceptional. What's missing however is quite a bit less acceptable. If it weren't for the market shift (IMO caused by software companies mostly) where paying full price for a beta product with multiple marketed features broken and/or missing completely is considered "OK"... they'd never be able to get away with taking months or even years to fully deliver what was initially promised.

However, as far as the basics... yes, they are actually doing very well against their competition. Some of us would prefer not to be told a product does something or has something unless that is actually the truth... which Emotiva has a rather long history of failing at.

Full disclosure... I currently own 7 Emotiva products... and I've owned a few others in the past. I like them generally - but I also disagree with their marketing and release decisions strongly. I've also had mixed results as far as reliability - some great, some miserable lemons. YMMV.

 

[Rxw]

A lot of people love to bash Emotiva for the bugs and glitches but so many other highly configurable and complex AVR's have just as many problems, take the JBL SDP-55 for example... The firmware on that is a complete mess.

 

[Sal1950]

The performance of what is there and works is quite acceptable, and in many cases even exceptional. What's missing however is quite a bit less acceptable. If it weren't for the market shift (IMO caused by software companies mostly) where paying full price for a beta product with multiple marketed features broken and/or missing completely is considered "OK"... they'd never be able to get away with taking months or even years to fully deliver what was initially promised.

A funny (NOT) set of circumstances. Emo is just about leading the pack in measured performance for AVR's while if you follow the AVR market you will know how bad things can be on the software bugs side of the ledger. I've always pulled for Emo to do well, I have enjoyed my DC-1 DAC for around 5 years now, IMO they are building some of the handsomest components around, but just can't seem to get their schitt together on the heavily complicated designs such as AVR's.

A lot of people love to bash Emotiva for the bugs and glitches but so many other highly configurable and complex AVR's have just as many problems, take the JBL SDP-55 for example... The firmware on that is a complete mess.

As I think I've made clear above, I take no joy in saying what I have about Emo. I don't know anything about the JBL you mentioned but I've owned 2 Marantz pre/pros now, a 7701 which I believe Blumlein 88 still owns and the 7703 I am currently using. Sadly they both drop the ball in the measurements department but neither has suffered from any sort of software bugs that have interfered with their day to day use that I'm aware of.
Good news is that the measurement failures have caused no audible problems that I can hear, though I would prefer to have Dirac over Audyssey.

 

[Vasr]

A lot of people love to bash Emotiva for the bugs and glitches but so many other highly configurable and complex AVR's have just as many problems, take the JBL SDP-55 for example... The firmware on that is a complete mess.

Any user discussion on reliability of Monoprice HTP-1? Seems like it has Dirac Live running already.

 

[Rxw]

Any user discussion on reliability of Monoprice HTP-1? Seems like it has Dirac Live running already.

HTP-1 seems pretty stable these days but as most processors it has it own quirks and downfalls. Overall firmware wise they seem one of the better sorted units from what I've seen.

 

[DLxP]

A lot of people love to bash Emotiva for the bugs and glitches but so many other highly configurable and complex AVR's have just as many problems, take the JBL SDP-55 for example... The firmware on that is a complete mess.

For me it's not just about bugs. I owned the XMC-2 and bought it knowing I'd have to deal with bugs, but felt I could tolerate that as it'd likely perform similarly to the RMC-1, and with Dirac would sound great. That, plus I took a gamble that Emotiva would deal with bugs eventually.

I was aware Emotiva had a reputation for poor communication. But, when I started following Emo Lounge posts, I realised it wasn't just poor, it was flat out incompetent and borderline deceptive. They completely mislead customers, time after time. They committed to me, directly, about Dirac's release date, and the date they indicated is long gone. I also noticed a reluctance on their part to acknowledge obvious issues (e.g. an ongoing issue with Neural: X).

I decided to return the XMC-2 because I'm not in the market segment that will accept both bugs and incompetent and misleading communications. I replaced it with an AV8805 knowing full well its failings and the cheaper options, but also wanting its reliability, features and future upgrades. I'm delighted with it, although find Ratbuddyssey essential. I miss Dirac though, which I've enjoyed on previous AVRs.

So, in my case, Emotiva had a customer that was apprehensive at purchase but willing to endure some bugs but lost him, probably for good, because their communication and customer management is a joke. That's not a happy situation for a company to be in.

Here's an idea for Emotiva that's not rocket science: hire someone with the experience to sort out these shambolic communications issues, and plan engagement with customers. Spend some money on repairing the damaged reputation. Any perception that the investment isn't affordable is likely wrong, as the alternative is eventual doom. The short-term investment would pay considerable dividends.

 

[digicidal]

As I think I've made clear above, I take no joy in saying what I have about Emo. I don't know anything about the JBL you mentioned but I've owned 2 Marantz pre/pros now, a 7701 which I believe Blumlein 88 still owns and the 7703 I am currently using. Sadly they both drop the ball in the measurements department but neither has suffered from any sort of software bugs that have interfered with their day to day use that I'm aware of.
Good news is that the measurement failures have caused no audible problems that I can hear, though I would prefer to have Dirac over Audyssey.

That's exactly my take. Both of my 8801's are still running as strong as the day I purchased them. All features working on day one and continue to do so. My silver (maybe even bronze) ears can't tell what I'm missing either... of course, I deliberately don't plan any blind testing until I'm already decided on their replacements... so that helps. Same on the Dirac front... I'd rather have that, but I'll take a functional and fully implemented RC system now over a superior one "eventually" - especially for less money (got my 8801's on closeout).

 

[Maconi]

After having owned the RMC-1 in the past, I'll likely never bother with another Emotiva processor again. Measurements don't matter if the unit doesn't function the way it's supposed to.

Another annoyance is their amps. They wire all of their amps in reverse polarity which obviously causes issues with subs that have their own amps wired in normal polarity.

 

[Sal1950]

Another annoyance is their amps. They wire all of their amps in reverse polarity which obviously causes issues with subs that have their own amps wired in normal polarity.

So your saying they get things a-s backwards? LOL

 

[rccarguy]

So your saying they get things a-s backwards? LOL

Their internal headphone amp signal able was inverted phase too! It needed a swap out of the ribbon cable

Great QC for £5500

 

[Sal1950]

Their internal headphone amp signal able was inverted phase too! It needed a swap out of the ribbon cable

You could hear that ???

 

[rccarguy]

You could hear that ???

Owner on another forum opened it up and replaced the cable. He noticed it yeah

 

[Sal1950]

Owner on another forum opened it up and replaced the cable. He noticed it yeah

Sure he did. It sounded every bit better as he thought it would, maybe even more so. LOL

 

[SmoothR]

Another annoyance is their amps. They wire all of their amps in reverse polarity which obviously causes issues with subs that have their own amps wired in normal polarity..

Is this really true?! Mic-In doesn't matter to me, but the regular channels do...

 

[TimoJ]

You could hear that ???

I believe only one headphone channel had inverted phase. And you can certainly hear that.

 

[Koeitje]

A lot of people love to bash Emotiva for the bugs and glitches but so many other highly configurable and complex AVR's have just as many problems, take the JBL SDP-55 for example... The firmware on that is a complete mess.

And those others also have to deal with criticism regarding that. It doesn't excuse Emotiva.