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Wilson Alexia V - 2023 Stereophile Speaker of the Year ???

prestigetone

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Your talking about being open minded not objective. Im all for open minded as long as your brain doesn't fall out.

Yes there are people here that think they want accurate, thats what ASR espouses but when they hear it it doesn't satisfy. Why do you think people sell there Genelecs, they sound bad?
You said what I tried to say in one sentence. Impressed.
 

Anton D

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If I wanted to sell a Genelec, for whatever reason, ASR is a logical place.
It certainly is. So, you are implying people who don't like accuracy somehow buy Genelec speakers and then serendipitously wander into this place hoping for a buying audience?

I guess we could check the sellers' profiles and see.

Interesting postulation.
 

Anton D

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Yes there are people here that think they want accurate, thats what ASR espouses but when they hear it it doesn't satisfy. Why do you think people sell there Genelecs, they sound bad?
Tough question.

Accurate doesn't satisfy...so why not? Old joke: there are no bad good measuring speakers, there are just bad listeners. ;)
 

Hauxon

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I think a lot of casual listeners do get seduced easily by lots of bass response.
Probably. Those speakers are really heavy, 200+ pounds so they probably have very little resonance and solid bass/low mids.
 

Sokel

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This makes me wonder: If you look at the 'for sale' section here, it seems people want to part with Genelecs more often than any other brand. I like their line, but that rate of abandonment does make me wonder, sometimes. (I think Genelec and then KEF seem to be the top two, but that's just an impression. Sometimes, the ready availability of brands on the used marker can tell us something about the long term pleasure they may or may not bring to someone.)
That's because people don't look the whole picture and overestimate some parameters while underestimate others.
The one biggest underestimated parameter with Genelecs and such smaller speakers is distance and room volume.

Genelec is very specific about it but people don't seem to care,they just go ahead and buy a tiny 2-way and expect to fill a room while listening to them 3 meters apart.

Who's to blame?
 

ahofer

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I do think speakers are more subjective, but those subjective preferences remain fully measurable phenomena. The complexity arises from the difficult to predict chaos of room interaction, not magical sound properties that can't be measured.

Solving the room problem by random listening seems like a very indirect way of going about it, but some people like the chase. All fine, so long as we aren't asserting magic unmeasurables.
 

fpitas

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It certainly is. So, you are implying people who don't like accuracy somehow buy Genelec speakers and then serendipitously wander into this place hoping for a buying audience?

I guess we could check the sellers' profiles and see.

Interesting postulation.
Honestly? I don't care. Sorry. You can listen to whatever you like and I'm OK with that. But I like accuracy.
 

prestigetone

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I do think speakers are more subjective, but those subjective preferences remain fully measurable phenomena. The complexity arises from the difficult to predict chaos of room interaction, not magical sound properties that can't be measured.

Solving the room problem by random listening seems like a very indirect way of going about it, but some people like the chase. All fine, so long as we aren't asserting magic unmeasurables.
What speakers do you have in your system?
 

ahofer

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they probably have very little resonance and solid bass/low mids.
Surprisingly, given that low resonance is kinda their thing, they still have them. Whether these bother you, I don't know, but it seems like the materials claims are a bit stretched. The discouraging thing about these speakers is that the designers might have failed at their own goals despite the lack of cost constraints.

1222wilson.WAlexiaVfig6.jpg

1222wilson.WAlexiaVfig4.jpg
 

ahofer

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What speakers do you have in your system? I glanced at your posts and you are looking into Bose, I would guess they have some of the worst measuring products out there.
What?

I have Harbeth, Revel, and Genelec speakers in my systems. Last time I looked at a Bose was in 1980.
 

fpitas

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the designers might have failed at their own goals
If those were their goals. I suspect the marketing department had more to do with the stated "goals".
 

ahofer

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If those were their goals. I suspect the marketing department had more to do with the stated "goals".
see my earlier gif on the Chronosonic. But avarice shouldn't stop them from trying to live up to their materials hype.


giphy.gif
 

fpitas

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Galliardist

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That's because people don't look the whole picture and overestimate some parameters while underestimate others.
The one biggest underestimated parameter with Genelecs and such smaller speakers is distance and room volume.

Genelec is very specific about it but people don't seem to care,they just go ahead and buy a tiny 2-way and expect to fill a room while listening to them 3 meters apart.

Who's to blame?
Well, are we?

After all, there is an entire series of "home" loudspeakers on the Genelec website that the company, or at least the marketing department, clearly intend to be listened to from greater distances and in the typical home. Yet every time I see Genelec recommended, it's always the studio models for near field listening.

It's not like the home speakers are inaccurate, judging from the maker's measurements, either. Time to reassess, perhaps?
 

ahofer

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Bose headphones. I edited my comment. After all that you have poor measuring speakers.
What on earth is your point? I discussed this up-thread but yes, if I had it to do over again I would take Revel over Harbeth.

Now I am going to get personal. You seem pretty unpleasant. I'm gonna put you on ignore.
 
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prestigetone

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This is getting a bit rude. Don't you think?
Rewind and see how much grief I got for suggesting listening to speakers that don’t measure well. And they own a pair. Proves my point that people enjoy what they enjoy. They’re calling people out for wanting to entertain the idea of listening to overpriced gear and they own said gear. Mind bent.
 

ahofer

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Something about speaker discussions
My experience is that it tends to be about the overpriced yet undifferentiated stuff. I think there's a lot of difficulty acknowledging that the gods once worshipped are mostly false. It certainly was difficult for me.
 

Sokel

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Well, are we?

After all, there is an entire series of "home" loudspeakers on the Genelec website that the company, or at least the marketing department, clearly intend to be listened to from greater distances and in the typical home. Yet every time I see Genelec recommended, it's always the studio models for near field listening.

It's not like the home speakers are inaccurate, judging from the maker's measurements, either. Time to reassess, perhaps?
Not long ago in this forum a couple of well informed (otherwise) members didn't even know the existence of Genelec's main monitors,they thought 8361 is the top.
But even the specific one needs W371 woofer to sound full from a distance and in a small to medium room.

And I'm not talking about SPL,just full-bodied natural sound.
 
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