Review and Measurements of Yamaha RX-A1080 AVR

[Rja4000]

@amirm
In multi tone comment:
"Tested a single tone at a tone"
I guess you meant "Tested a single tone at a time"?

So no level change when one single tone is played?
That answers my previous question.

 

[amirm]

Does it squeeze out a recommendation because of some performance adequacy or does it fall short.

It does not. I was waiting to confirm some of the issues I found such as Toslink performance loss.

 

[amirm]

In multi tone, not only the noise raises below 300Hz, but also the signal level is not at same level at all frequencies, as you noted.
Some tone correction is applied without telling?

I thought so but even ran a frequency response test and it was flat. I am going to double check but hard to imagine there is an EQ for Toslink but not for other digital inputs.

 

[amirm]

@amirm
In multi tone comment:
"Tested a single tone at a tone"
I guess you meant "Tested a single tone at a time"?

Correct. I will fix.

 

[Rja4000]

I thought so but even ran a frequency response test and it was flat. I am going to double check but hard to imagine there is an EQ for Toslink but not for other digital inputs.

That may explain the SINAD difference?
The DSP must be doing something...

 

[D700]

There’s a June firmware update. Wonder if it would change anything. https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/rx-a1080_rx-v1085_rx-a2080_rx-v2085_rx-a3080_rx-v3085.html

 

[amirm]

The DSP must be doing something...

I can't think of DSP mistakes that increase non-linearity that way. They can clipping and such but that would have a different signature.

 

[amirm]

There’s a June firmware update. Wonder if it would change anything. https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/rx-a1080_rx-v1085_rx-a2080_rx-v2085_rx-a3080_rx-v3085.html

The firmware is up to date. It says there are no upgrades available.

 

[Rja4000]

Which makes me think that indicating the firmware revision for those tests may be a good idea.
The drawback being that it may mislead readers in letting them think that bad performances may be software-fixable, while most can't.
But still...
(We've seen some difference in measurements after firmware upgrade with other products in te past. I remember the NAD M51...)

 

[restorer-john]

There’s a June firmware update. Wonder if it would change anything.

...

 

[amirm]

The usual suspect needing stability improvements is the networking/host software. Not basic hardware features.

 

[Xulonn]

This is pretty much the performance (even the published ones) of a “stereo” receiver or integrated amp in the 2000s decade except for more power and more channels. So, there has been no real innovation/improvement since then. They have just stopped publishing the numbers of the different sections like they used to.

As much as I hated the condescending term "MidFi" used by high-enders to embellish their claim to exclusive use of the term "HiFi", I keep thinking "MidFi" is an appropriate description for the underwhelming batch of AVR's that have passed through Amir's testing queue.

The High End, Mid-Fi, & Pretend High End

John Atkinson | Sep 9, 2007 | First Published: Nov 9, 1994

If there's a phrase that increasingly gets my dander up, it's "mid-fi." I'm even starting to lose patience with the term "High End."

There are products I've heard audio snobs dismiss as "mid-fi"—Tyll Hertsens' delightful little HeadRoom headphone amplifiers, for example—purely because they're cheap enough to bring them in reach of those who don't have unlimited disposable income.

On the other hand, there are high-priced products—I'll draw a kindly veil over which ones, this not being the appropriate forum to add to their manufacturers' miseries—which audiophiles almost automatically think of as being the epitome of "high-end," yet are poorly engineered, suffer from abysmal quality control, and are sometimes incapable of producing a sound that anyone would find musical.

 

[Rja4000]

The usual suspect needing stability improvements is the networking/host software. Not basic hardware features.

They fix it because that's what users complain about
But imagine someone test their product and publish some really bad performance measurements that get some impact on sales...
They may want to also fix bad software for DSP or other broken thing they could fix without breaking the bank or admitting they failed the design.
One can dream...

 

[amirm]

DSP is not in the path of the many performance issues we see to correct them.

 

[Ataraxia]

I don't get it. I'm new to this but my A2080 sounds extremely good paired to my KEF R3's in 2 channel mode (2.2) after YPAO or in Pure Direct running Tidal Hi-Fi or FLAC from the front USB port. Great sound stage, channel separation, imaging.... Excellent vocals and strings. Easily distinguishable between good and mediocre recording quality.. Gotta be at least upper mid-fi. What am I missing? Splain me please.

 

[GrimSurfer]

Just for kicks, I visited Yamaha's page on this product. Here's what they had to say:

A New Frontier in Sound.
Discover the thrill of the most advanced cinematic surround sound in the home. Breakthrough Surround:AI technology analyzes the scene of the entertainment content and optimizes the surround effect in real time while you watch.

The Heart of the Smart Home.
State-of-the-art configuration options and unparalleled versatility satisfy the most demanding whole-of-home applications.

Intuitively Simple to Use.
Simple and straightforward operation, whether using specially designed compatible apps, or intuitive on-board menu.

Notice what they didn't say? No mention of sound quality. This is the audiophile's first clue that the engineering department had a very serious discussion with the marketing guys about not getting carried away.

The only specs were:

--- 110 W per channel (8 ohms, 20 Hz-20 kHz, 0.06% THD, 2-ch driven)
--- 120 W per channel (8 ohms, 1 kHz, 0.9% THD, 2-ch driven)
--- 165 W per channel (8 ohms, 1 kHz, 10% THD, 1-ch driven)

Now I don't get out much, but this is the first time I've seen ratings for 1 channel at 10% THD being used. [I have seen 1 ch being used by AVR manufacturers... but not with 10% ("holy French Connection UK") distortion.]

These are the sorts of things I notice before letting my expectations get the better of me.

 

[audimus]

I thought so but even ran a frequency response test and it was flat. I am going to double check but hard to imagine there is an EQ for Toslink but not for other digital inputs.

If and when you do a tear down, it might be interesting to trace the path for toslink vs hdmi if possible (easier with a service manual). It wouldn’t surprise me greatly if they had separate extraction/codec decoding paths before the data reached the DSP/DAC. Some of it because of the switching circuitry needed for HDMI, some of it for legacy reasons in S/PDIF handling. The “cleanliness” of the two paths may be different. Not saying the two paths are necessary but it would depend on how the unit evolved over time.

 

[Rja4000]

The unit though was at the verge of shutting down despite me leaving speaker terminals disconnected. If I just dialed up the volume 0.5 to 1 dB, it would shut down.

I don't understand that.
Why would it shut down with no energy being consumed ?

Does that mean that the power supply voltage is not enough to reach required voltage at power amp output while we have 2V at pre out?

 

[audimus]

--- 110 W per channel (8 ohms, 20 Hz-20 kHz, 0.06% THD, 2-ch driven)
--- 120 W per channel (8 ohms, 1 kHz, 0.9% THD, 2-ch driven)
--- 165 W per channel (8 ohms, 1 kHz, 10% THD, 1-ch driven)

Now I don't get out much, but this is the first time I've seen ratings for 1 channel at 10% THD being used. [I have seen 1 ch being used by AVR manufacturers... but not with 10% ("holy French Connection UK") distortion.]

This is not uncommon in Asian mass-market brands. Started with the power spec war between them when Pioneer started some really wild claims (before and after FCC regs) for multi-channel units such as multiplying that 1 channel rating by 5 or 7 to claim that it is a 700w amp or whatever. Some brands started to use 10% distortion numbers to make a higher number stick in a consumer’s head, especially if that was the only way to get it above 100W minimum marketing number.

The other common thing is to measure it for 6 ohms into 1% distortion to get that number up.

They all believe the highest number in that group sticks with the average consumer when making brand comparisons.

 

[GrimSurfer]

I don't get it. I'm new to this but my A2080 sounds extremely good paired to my KEF R3's in 2 channel mode (2.2) after YPAO or in Pure Direct running Tidal Hi-Fi or FLAC from the front USB port. Great sound stage, channel separation, imaging.... Excellent vocals and strings. Easily distinguishable between good and mediocre recording quality.. Gotta be at least upper mid-fi. What am I missing? Splain me please.

If I've learned anything on ASR it is that there is often a wide margin between what we think we hear and what is actually going on in an audio circuit.

There is a broad range between what some people hear and other people don't. Some of this is a matter of conditioning (becoming used to a certain fidelity) or a matter of training (knowing what to listen for) or a matter of material (audio masking, dynamic range) or use (playback levels below audibility thresholds or high enough to saturate hearing).

A spectrum analyzer sees all. It is a calibrated instrument capable of precisely measuring all sorts of things, regardless of whether they are discernible to golden ears or overlooked by lesser mortals.