Bluesound releases 2024 ICON streamer

[robsonj]

I don't have the Buckeye amp (yet), I have the Icon connected to a SMSL AO200 MKII Amp using XLR cables then onto KEF LS50 Meta's. I am not experiencing this buzz.

 

[darth]

I am not fully sure why the presence of a signal removes the hum from the YT video (most ground loops are always there). I am not sure if the music masks it or if there is something that happens when there is a signal.

That is also what I noticed, but it's not just when playing music. The device can still show an input selected / connection to an input source like connected to HDMI (TV being off or in stand by) with no signal over HDMI and then the hum vanishes. So in the picture below, it shows HDMI arc connected even though TV is off as that is what I had last selected and never un-selected. In this mode it doesn't have the hum. So I just leave it as-is and don't notice the problem.

There needs to be away to output a 1 bit sinewave at 48 kHz, which should be inaudible due to both amplitude and frequency at idle. They need to program the 12v trigger to not consider this as a signal and to still power off the downstream 12v trigger if there is no content actually being played. This should keep the XLR outputs in an active state which might address the ground loop.

Unless properly implemented I think that might be a bit annoying for active speakers that have some kind of power saving tech that turns off the speakers when idle. For my genelecs its the ISS delay.

 

[robsonj]

I have mainly been using my Icon to stream music from Roon. I have all sources disabled except the USB-C source, which is connected to my Mac, though the Icon spends 80% of its life connected to Roon

 

[darth]

That YT video might be from this person

NODE Icon XLR issues

When using the XLR outputs to my power amplifiers, I experienced constant buzzing/noise ONLY during pause/stop states (no buzz during actual playback). After troubleshooting, I discovered this was ...

support1.bluesound.com

I also replied to it.

 

[robsonj]

That YT video might be from this person

NODE Icon XLR issues

When using the XLR outputs to my power amplifiers, I experienced constant buzzing/noise ONLY during pause/stop states (no buzz during actual playback). After troubleshooting, I discovered this was ...

support1.bluesound.com

I also replied to it.

This is why I mentioned the USB-C connection. I have that connected to an Apple Studio Display, which is powered with a 3 prong cable, was wondering if it was providing an inadvertent ground wire

 

[sapphari]

My local shop has an Icon reserved for me, it should arrive in 4 days. Will be picking it up provided I don't get cold feet for some reason!

 

[darth]

Here is what the hum sounds like before and after I ground one of the RCA terminals.

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The louder parts are when disconnected from ground and quieter parts are when connected. So the ground loop hum remains unfortunately, just that it gets quieter.

I took an RCA cable, chopped it. Took a typical nema 15 power cable and chopped it. Attached the RCA shielding part to the ground wire of the power cable. Plugged it into the same power strip as speakers/subwoofer.

 

[GXAlan]

Unless properly implemented I think that might be a bit annoying for active speakers that have some kind of power saving tech that turns off the speakers when idle. For my genelecs its the ISS delay.

Yeah, good point.

Here is what the hum sounds like before and after I ground one of the RCA terminals.

So we know it’s a ground loop for sure.

Does the buzz sound the same on both channels? I wonder if you need a XLR splitter and then ground both channels to the surge protector.

Edit: the other idea is to ground via the USB port

Amazon.com

Versus

https://a.co/d/7n2A7J9

Since you are in contact with Bluesound, see if they can escalate this to engineering to tell you what the best grounding solution would be.

Then, Bluesound should offer that adapter for sale for people affected by the ground loop issue.

 

[darth]

Edit: the other idea is to ground via the USB port

Amazon.com

Versus

https://a.co/d/7n2A7J9

Since you are in contact with Bluesound, see if they can escalate this to engineering to tell you what the best grounding solution would be.

Then, Bluesound should offer that adapter for sale for people affected by the ground loop issue.

I was thinking about the USB grounding route, can try later. Was not gonna buy it unless I can find it super cheap, but instead just split open a USB cable. TIL that black is the ground wire in USB, not the green since black considered the negative in DC. Though grounding DC to AC ground feels icky, will do more research. I already started my RMA process for the node icon, but still have a few days before I need to post mark it and/or cancel the return.

While I was browsing on amazon, it showed same day delivery for Wiim Ultra, so got it lol.

Since Wiim doesn't have XLR outs, I just connected its USB out to my SMSL DL100 dac and then connected speakers via XLR that way. I don't have RCA to XLR adapters lying around. That DAC has 3 prong power so grounding is all good too. Besides Wiim has a ground lug too. Things seem to works fine thus far, HDMI volume control etc.

One big reason I didn't get Wiim earlier was people complaining about audio dropouts when using HDMI arc. So gonna test this next few days and then make a decision. To my surprise the Wiim USB out is also able to volume control my Quloos DDC that converts USB to AES to feed digital directly into Genelec speakers. I was complaining about the Node icon not being able to do that over in this ASR thread. There must be something with Node icon's USB out that doesn't work properly for volume control, but will try again with a different USB cable.

Wiim app definitely seems a step up from blueOS. Latter might be simpler for users, while Wiim one seems power user friendly.

 

[PloddyPastard]

Yeah, good point.



So we know it’s a ground loop for sure.

Does the buzz sound the same on both channels? I wonder if you need a XLR splitter and then ground both channels to the surge protector.

Edit: the other idea is to ground via the USB port

Amazon.com

Versus

https://a.co/d/7n2A7J9

Since you are in contact with Bluesound, see if they can escalate this to engineering to tell you what the best grounding solution would be.

Then, Bluesound should offer that adapter for sale for people affected by the ground loop issue.

I wonder if using a 3 prong multi-point plug for powering the icon would have the same effect?

 

[GXAlan]

Though grounding DC to AC ground feels icky, will do more research.

Ground is ground though?

Things seem to works fine thus far, HDMI volume control etc.

One big reason I didn't get Wiim earlier was people complaining about audio dropouts when using HDMI arc. So gonna test this next few days and then make a decision.

Interestingly, I bought the WiiM Ultra but just returned it since I thought my RCA to XLR connections were creating a very minor ground loop. There was a buzz in one channel that was NOT on the Fosi ZD3. (but the ZD3 doesn’t power down via HDMI CEC consistently which is a challenge for the 12v trigger use). I’m supposed to get the Node Icon at the end of the month, so hopefully my “upgrade” isn’t a downgrade.

I have a WiiM Pro but after ordering the Node Icon, I saw Bluesound’s clearly stated privacy policies but then saw that WiiM has none published and requires precision localization permissions even though it could just ask for Bluetooth and local network support, etc.

Also @pogo, you were wrong about using the Node Icon as the front of a multichannel BluOS setup.

 

[darth]

I wonder if using a 3 prong multi-point plug for powering the icon would have the same effect?

They should have done this from the get go or provided a grounding pin. This isn't a new problem for them as there have been reports of it in the past. Seems they just ignored it.

 

[GXAlan]

They should have done this from the get go or provided a grounding pin. This isn't a new problem for them as there have been reports of it in the past. Seems they just ignored it.

Are there visible chassis screws on the bottom or anywhere?

 

[darth]

Are there visible chassis screws on the bottom or anywhere?

Nope

 

[darth]

Since you are in contact with Bluesound, see if they can escalate this to engineering to tell you what the best grounding solution would be.

Then, Bluesound should offer that adapter for sale for people affected by the ground loop issue.

Not been responsive since the last message telling just to return. I highly doubt they will suggest something DIY to do grounding due to warranty and/or liability reasons but maybe they themselves could offer a device like you say. Though again I highly doubt they would as they haven't done thus far for their prior products exhibiting same problem. I think they will only do this when a critical mass of people start returning (or stop buying) their devices due to these reasons.

 

[castalla]

A white/silver version would be nice.

 

[GXAlan]

I think they will only do this when a critical mass of people start returning (or stop buying) their devices due to these reasons.

It’s tricky because it’s not clear if it’s a feature or a bug or how many people it affects.

Marantz, Yamaha, Anthem, and JBL/Arcam all release premium AV processors (XLR out) with two prong power. But companies like Mark Levinson, McIntosh and Accuphase go with three prong.

There may be different ways they interact. The NAD M23 has three prong power and a ground lug, and I would assume the Node Icon plays friendly with the M23.

 

[pogo]

you were wrong about using the Node Icon as the front of a multichannel BluOS setup.

At this time

 

[GXAlan]

At this time

It would be a killer setup if they can actually implement it. It seems like the PowerNode is an older processor, so it “shouldn’t” be too hard.

 

[pogo]

With HDMI eARC, Dolby Digital and Dirac Live Ready, you can also transform the way you experience music and TV with Dolby downmixing and state-of-the-art room correction technology.
Where downmixing is possible, theater mode should also be possible