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AIYIMA A07 TPA3255 Review (Amplifier)
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
Hello dude. Can you elaborate? What do you agree with? What you don't agree with? Let's debate.
You’ve brought nothing to debate other than a bunch of straw men, and audiophile folk lore. I’m not going to get into knocking those down one by one with someone who’s swallowed too much coolaid.
I'm really sorry for you. You don't know what you are missing.
I understand this a not a modding/DIY forum, but expected people to be more open minded. I see some people have already made their minds and won't accept anything different.
I would like to know about why you think "I've swallowed to much cool-aid". What is about the Opamp functionality on Aiyima A07? Or about speaker modding? We're you triggered by the capacitors? I've never said you have to spend hundreds on fancy capacitors, I just said capacitors sound different. But I don't believe cables sound different. And inductors.. well only if you saturate them. But I've never really needed more than 10W per channel to reach more than comfortable levels.
So, let me ask you. Regarding the Aiyima A07 ( because that's what this thread is about), what do you bring to the debate?. How do you think this amplifier can be improved? I'd love to hear your ideas.
What you are doing now is called sealioning. It is a form of trolling. I'm not biting.
When you have evidence for your extraordinary claims, they will be greeted with less derision. Evidence.
It is really unfair to ask for evidence to somebody who does not have any special equipment. I can only vouch for my hearing.
Measurements don't tell the whole story.
I realized this is not the place for me. And I feel many people think the same everytime they try to communicate an idea and they are completely shutdown by other members.
It's all about the "evidence", "proof". There is no place to debate theory. Only members who want to attack other people who don't think exactly as them. And who don't provide anything positive to the debate.
If you are going to disagree with me or my ideas at least have the decency of telling why I am wrong. Educate me.
Measurements don't tell the whole story.
I realized this is not the place for me. And I feel many people think the same everytime they try to communicate an idea and they are completely shutdown by other members.
It's all about the "evidence", "proof". There is no place to debate theory. Only members who want to attack other people who don't think exactly as them. And who don't provide anything positive to the debate.
If you are going to disagree with me or my ideas at least have the decency of telling why I am wrong. Educate me.
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Theory is supported by evidence. You don’t have a theory, just evidence-free claims, and highly unlikely ones. If you want a support group for stories, yes, a science oriented site is not for you. If you want to truly know what’s real and what’s your brain fooling you, this is very much the right place.
Determining what’s real and what’s imaginary doesn’t take a pile of equipment, it just takes an open mind, a willingness to put your beliefs to experimental test, and some basic controls.
Hint: yes, I saw Penn and Teller turn a fishbowl full of pennies into a fishbowl full of water and goldfish. I saw it, plain as day. So did the other thousand people in the audience. But guess what: it was our brains fooling us.
Ok. You seem nicer than the other guy, at least you took your time to present your arguments. But still you are asking me to have an open mind, when it is exactly the same I'm asking the other members.
But how could my brain be fooling me if I connect one modded speaker on the left channel and a stock speaker on the right and then set the amplifier to Mono and play with the balance? If I listen to both speakers individually one immediately after the other? If I can hear a difference( it does not matter if better or worse but different) why is my test flawed?
Or if I do the same test with different opamps inside an amplifier like the Aiyima A04 or 07?
If I am able pick differences why is my test wrong?
Now if I use different models of amplifiers/speakers (one for the left and the other for the right channel) is my test also wrong?. If so, then why this website exists if all the amplifiers and speakers sound the same and It's our brain fooling us?
Please explain me because I don't follow.
No controls. Peeking. Not ears only. Here’s a little article with some outlines on how to do testing with basic ears-only controls: https://linearaudio.net/sites/linearaudio.net/files/LA Vol 2 Yaniger(1).pdf
I think Amir has a YouTube video on the need for blind testing on the ASR channel; I don’t have the link offhand but if you can’t find it, I’m sure someone will pop up with it.
I do have a theory. My theory is that if better components are used the better the sound.
I think that is generally accepted that if I replace a cheap Fosi audio amplifier with a TPA3116, and I replace it with a Topping PA5 for example which has better components and amplifier chip. It is commonly accepted that my sound will be better right?. Every other component( audio files, DAC, preamp,etc..) remain the same.
The same would apply if I replace a pair of Sony SS-CS5 with a pair KEF or whatever other speaker widely accepted as great.
But why the same theory does not apply if I replace internal components inside an Amplifier or Speaker? That means the theory is flawed, don't you think?
But isn't it the stock component(speaker/amplifier...) my control? My baseline?
I'm sorry but your link to pdf did not work.
And what happens if I ask multiple people without explaining anything about what has changed and while blindfolded I ask them If they can hear a difference and point out which one they think sounds better? Is this test better? It seems like a lot of hassle just to prove you guys a point.
And the funny thing is that I'm the one being asked to be open minded.
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What is a better component? What specific characteristic is better?
Let's flesh out your amplifier example.
Certainly the Fosi and Topping have some different characteristics that may result in audible differences depending on application. For example if the Fosi starts to clip before the Topping that would likely be audible. But the way to understand those differences is to isolate variables and listen blind. For example if you level match the output and listen at a volume level where neither is clipping do you still hear a difference when listening blind? And what is the difference you hear? Certainly if the Fosi is noisier than the Topping it may not be hard to pick out with nothing playing and your ear close to your tweeter. By measuring the noise output of each amplifier you could start to get an idea what kind of SNR you need to not hear noise at your listening position. Is it a difference due to frequency response in to load? You could measure the frequency response and implement EQ so they had identical response in to load and retest and see if you can hear a difference. Maybe it is none of those things and it is due to a difference in distortion levels below clipping.
My main point is "better" can be quantified and tested. And with listening experience you can develop a set of criteria that is good enough for your application. Unfortunately without basic test equipment it does make it rather hard to understand why you are hearing differences. However even without test equipment you can still learn quite a bit by making blind level matched comparisons and determining if you truly can hear a difference.
Michael
Raindog123
Major Contributor
The more accurate statement is that “all properly designed amplifiers are/sound the same below their P1dB point”.
So, it’s the responsibility of the listener to pick an amplifier to operate below its compression point for the desired output levels. And to realize that anything else is in their imagination.
So, it’s the responsibility of the listener to pick an amplifier to operate below its compression point for the desired output levels. And to realize that anything else is in their imagination.
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Ok, but don't you agree that the Topping PA5 is "better" than the cheap Fosi Audio with TPA3116?. I mean all the measurements on this website show the Topping as a much better amplifier.
Ok, let me rephrase my question:
If I replace a component with another one that measures better( all the different test run on this website) isn't my sound better?
If a replace a pair of speakers with another one that measures better(FR, THD,....) isn't my sound better?
And if I replace a capacitor with another one that measures better(ESL, ESR, leakage current, Dielectric absorption, Temperature Coefficient, Dissipation factor, working voltage, working temperature, etc..) on a speaker crossover, isn't my sound better?
Raindog123,
Really?. And what amplifier do you have? If I may ask. And what were the reasons for you to buy it?
So all amplifiers sound the same if they are not overtaxed? For example I have a pair of speaker with a 91db/w*m sensitivity. So I only need one watt to play at 91dB which is more than fine.
Does it mean that all amplifiers which do not clip at that power output(1W) sound the same?
Then why somebody who listens music at 91dB using those speakers would buy anything more than Lepai T2020A+?
If the improvement is below the audibility threshold then I would say your sound is not better because you can't hear a difference.
For example I know from my listening / measurements that I will not be able to hear noise at my listening position if I have less than ~200 uV noise (20-20K, unweighted) at the amplifier output terminals. I can achieve this pretty easily with rather middling pro audio DACs (MOTU Ultralite Mk5, MOTU M4, RME FireFace 800) and a Hypex NC252MP amplifier. Therefore I know that changing my amplifier to a Topping PA5, Benchmark AHB2 or Purifi or my DAC to a Topping D90SE or Mola Mola Tambaqui isn't going to result in an audible differences in terms of noise.
If you are changing something in hopes of improvement it is important to understand what you hope to achieve. Better frequency response? Lower noise? Lower distortion? And then it is important to have some perspective on the audibility of the improvement of those parameters.
I will say this, a lot of folks on ASR espouse rather unscientific opinions when upgrading to better measuring gear and claim to hear substantial differences based on sighted listening. I think that the vast majority of these supposed improvements are confirmation bias due to sighted listening.
Michael
Oh and I should say my comments thus far have been around electronics which are easily measured and performance of which is well understood. Speakers are a whole different ball game. I would argue that no two speakers (of different models) will sound the same due to large differences in frequency response, directivity, distortion, etc.
Michael
Michael
Controls means ears-only, just the sound. Please read my article and see Amir’s video. If you peek, you’re not testing the sound, you’re bringing a whole lot of extraneous brain stuff unrelated to actual sound waves.
Also, “theory” has a specific meaning in technology. It is not the same as a hypothesis or an assertion lacking evidentiary support. It’s a word often misused, so don’t feel bad.
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