TRUTHEAR x Crinacle Zero IEM Review

[GXAlan]

Play sounds of increasingly louder volume and look for nonlinearities.
Looks like this for DACs:
View attachment 237911
And here's a bookshelf speaker:
View attachment 237910

Do you need a proper coupling to really assess this? Does anyone else hear what I claim to be hearing? That we hear more low level details but this is happening because the volume is higher and the high’s aren’t as loud so it doesn’t feel like it’s louder?

The environmental sounds in a recording seem amplified somehow with these IEMs. I don’t have a lot of different headphones to compare, but it does sound different compared to the MDR-7506 (Samarium cobalt version) and Sennheiser HD 820 (German production) for environmental background noise in the recording.

 

[holicst]

Okay, after more listening, I'll put my Monarch MkII on sale. A bit differernt, not necessarily better. I'll spend the $950 difference on hookers, cocaine and whiskey. Great deal.

 

[Cote Dazur]

The environmental sounds in a recording seem amplified somehow with these IEMs

Or is it just that it is more transparent/revealing because the FR is smooth, not much dips or bumps where sound is either hiding or covering other sound. I agree that they can be very revealing of details that are somehow muffled on other headphones/speakers, but at the same time still musical and offering an extended FR at both ends.

 

[_thelaughingman]

Just got mine and immediately starting listening to Jazz on these. Great balance between lows and mids, the highs are tight and not exaggerated. Going to keep listening for more impressions on these.

 

[GXAlan]

Or is it just that it is more transparent/revealing because the FR is smooth, not much dips or bumps where sound is either hiding or covering other sound. I agree that they can be very revealing of details that are somehow muffled on other headphones/speakers, but at the same time still musical and offering an extended FR at both ends.

That’s the question for measurements, right?

The claim is that the IEMs are 117 dB/V at 10 ohms.

Sennheiser HD 820’s are 103 dB/V at 300 ohms. So you would expect the Sennheiser to be louder if you just unplugged and plugged in the two different headphones but I have to raise the volume knob with the IEMs paradoxically.

 

[Cote Dazur]

That’s the question for measurements, right?

Not sure what you are asking?
But as far as how loud the Zero can play, on my iPhone with the Apple dongle, they can play louder than what my ears can take and I have plenty of details without having to raise the volume.

 

[GXAlan]

Not sure what you are asking?
But as far as how loud the Zero can play, on my iPhone with the Apple dongle, they can play louder than what my ears can take and I have plenty of details without having to raise the volume.

We both agree we are hearing more details.

Option A: It's because of smooth FR
Option B: It's because of dynamic range compression making loud noises quieter, which causes you to turn up the volume to match.
Option C: It's sighted bias because we know how good the measurements are

As far as loud, I generally listen to 70-75 dB only.

What I'm saying is that if you took your Apple dongle and a 3.5mm to 1/4" plug and set the volume to your ideal listening volume on the Truthear Zero x Crinacle and then, keeping that same volume, swapped out to a headphone like the HD 820, the HD 820 will be too loud. In contrast, if you have a HD 820 and set the volume to your ideal listening level and then put in the Truthear, it will be too quiet and you have to turn it up.

That doesn't seem to be what I would expect based upon sensitivity.

For the record, I paid for my Truthear's out of pocket (and bought two more as gifts based upon the measurements alone) and didn't have to pay a cent to borrow these HD820's so it's not sighted bias or wanting to like the HD820's. It's just an observation I have made that these need more power than you'd think and the details you are hearing almost seem unnatural.

I think figuring out if it's option A or B (or C) can be determined by measurements, by comparing it to a Dan Clark Stealth which has a smooth FR and seeing if the IEMs are louder/quieter than the Dan Clark's which should be 100 dB/V?

 

[Cote Dazur]

We both agree we are hearing more details.

Thank you for the detailed explanation, I now understand what you wrote. To me the answer is option a, the Zero, when correctly set in my ears sound totally “natural”.

 

[Jimbob54]

That’s the question for measurements, right?

The claim is that the IEMs are 117 dB/V at 10 ohms.

Sennheiser HD 820’s are 103 dB/V at 300 ohms. So you would expect the Sennheiser to be louder if you just unplugged and plugged in the two different headphones but I have to raise the volume knob with the IEMs paradoxically.

Dont the figures you quote suggest the opposite. For 1V output, iem 14db louder?

 

[GXAlan]

Dont the figures you quote suggest the opposite. For 1V output, iem 14db louder?

Exactly. IEMs should be louder but in practice, I have to turn UP the volume to match subjective volume.

That’s what doesn’t make sense to me and makes me think that the extra details is that there must be some sort of dynamic range compression.

 

[Chromatischism]

Here's the problem: If you are going to claim that the Harman curve is not neutral, unbalanced, it is shouty, has bad tonality, etc
because you compare it with your own speakers and some other guy agrees with you, well, I would like to see what exact methodology
you use to reach that kind of conclusion: What measurement instruments you use. What protocols you designed to measure. Your statistical
model, how you deal with blind tests, the specifications of your speakers, characteristics of your room, the frequency response at your ear canal, etc.
how do you define things like "shouty" , Is there any way to independently reproduce what you claim against the Harman curve?

The fact is there is simply no way for us to produce that for you. You will just have to listen for yourself and see if it's an improvement.

My neutral reference is a controlled directivity speaker that was designed with, and measured by, the Klippel NFS machine (actually 2 different machines + one set of Klippel tools without the NFS), supplemented with two Rythmik subwoofers integrated to produce bass with 0 room modes from 20-100 Hz. While I am not claiming that my system nor my ears are perfect, it produces pleasant sound with very little detectable coloration. I would like to know what those arguing about the Harman IE target have as their reference.

My experience is telling me the IEF Neutral target on Crinacle's graph tool is a lot closer to neutral tonality than Harman IE 2019. The only thing is it doesn't really define what the bass should look like, but the highs are much better.

 

[Chromatischism]

Come on, don't be silly, don't try to qualify your earlier statement which you were called out on....just accept it, people don't mind, but they'll think less of you if you continue to defend it. There's no reason why you should expect your individualised EQ to be to superior to the Harman Curve for most people, you can't say stuff like that, which is what you're being called out on.....we don't have to continually repost the reasons for this, because it's already been shown......no amount of replies from you to try to change the goal posts or wriggle the angle of discussion in a tangential direction can hide that fact.

Or instead of all this typing you could just try the EQ and report back if it's an improvement over stock or not. I'd like to see more people try the highs of something closer to the IEF Neutral target and report their impressions.

 

[Chromatischism]

The environmental sounds in a recording seem amplified somehow with these IEMs.

Can you explain what part of the spectrum these sounds occupy, or point us to the recording?

Also, have you used IEM's before? If you haven't you may not be used to the lower noise floor. That, with the extra 3 kHz + that these have, can produce that effect.

 

[Robbo99999]

Or instead of all this typing you could just try the EQ and report back if it's an improvement over stock or not. I'd like to see more people try the highs of something closer to the IEF Neutral target and report their impressions.

Even if it was an improvement for me over stock then it wouldn't support your statement that your individualised EQ "should be a big improvement for most people" vs the Harman Curve - as many people have pointed out to you already. (Anyway, it wouldn't be for me because I don't need to take the pinna gain region down that much anyway, the stock IEM is near perfect and Maiky's EQ just takes it that extra mile in terms of shaving a bit of shoutiness off.) Just leave it already, you've been called out for your misleading statement by a load of people that have explained to you why, just leave it, you can be wrong, pursuing it further is to your detriment. Your personalised EQ can be good for you, just leave it at that.

 

[Chromatischism]

Even if it was an improvement for me over stock then it wouldn't support your statement that your individualised EQ "should be a big improvement for most people" vs the Harman Curve - as many people have pointed out to you already. (Anyway, it wouldn't be for me because I don't need to take the pinna gain region down that much anyway, the stock IEM is near perfect and Maiky's EQ just takes it that extra mile in terms of shaving a bit of shoutiness off.) Just leave it already, you've been called out for your misleading statement by a load of people that have explained to you why, just leave it, you can be wrong, pursuing it further is to your detriment. Your personalised EQ can be good for you, just leave it at that.

You're making assumptions based on the graph, which can't be done because the bass region was reshaped. Bass affects how we perceive the highs. There is no missing treble, despite what the graph looks like. What's there are correct proportions and tonality. And that is not a misleading statement. You don't have to try it, but you won't know what it sounds like until you listen.

 

[GXAlan]

Can you explain what part of the spectrum these sounds occupy, or point us to the recording?

Also, have you used IEM's before? If you haven't you may not be used to the lower noise floor. That, with the extra 3 kHz + that these have, can produce that effect.

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[_thelaughingman]

Or instead of all this typing you could just try the EQ and report back if it's an improvement over stock or not. I'd like to see more people try the highs of something closer to the IEF Neutral target and report their impressions.

I actually am using the IEF target with these and the high's sound a bit more controlled compared to the stock tuning. I made a post above about initial listening impression on stock tuning and still stand with my impression that the highs are not exaggerated on stock but lack detail retrieval. That detail retrieval shines specifically when listening to jazz or classics.

 

[julian_hughes]

Update on the Cambridge Audio Memory Foam Tips...

Amazon sent me small silicone tips instead of medium memory foam! So the tips are going back to Amazon. However, I tried a silicone tip on the Zero's before repackaging them and it fitted perfectly. I've ordered another set of medium foam tips directly from Cambridge Audio (still £10 inc.) and it seems almost certain they will fit the Zero's.

I received mine today. I ordered large size and received "Large Memory Foam Ear Tips". They are not large. In fact about 11mm width, which is medium size by any normal standard (large is usually 13 or 14mm). They do fit the Truthears perfectly but they don't fit my ears.

 

[Berwhale]

I received mine today. I ordered large size and received "Large Memory Foam Ear Tips". They are not large. In fact about 11mm width, which is medium size by any normal standard (large is usually 13 or 14mm). They do fit the Truthears perfectly but they don't fit my ears.

I ordered the Medium size and they are quite small and shorter than the stock foams. However, they do fit my ears. They are also a little looser on the nozzle than the stock foams, but they're tight enough to not come off (this could be more of an issue if they were a tighter fit in my ears).
As it stands, 5 pairs for £10 is a bargain for me.

Compared to stock foam...

 

[Fregly]

Okay, after more listening, I'll put my Monarch MkII on sale. A bit differernt, not necessarily better. I'll spend the $950 difference on hookers, cocaine and whiskey. Great deal.

You going to do all that in one night while wearing the Truthears? Report back if it improves the technicalities.