Speaker stands - is there objectivist evidence?

[Soniclife]

Isoacoustics shows some measurements done at the NRC, comparing their isolation stands with spikes and with speakers suspended by bungee cords. There is little difference in the on-axis response, but the laservibrometer shows more cabinet vibration for spikes, less for the Isoacoustics stands, and least for the bungees

So no evidence of audible changes, just some classic audiophile FUD of resonances. Those might translate into an audible changes, but I'm betting they didn't go that far.

 

[Yorkshire Mouth]

Okay, I’m going to stick my oar in here.

None of these tests fall within the realms of objectivism as far as I can see, though I’m happy to be corrected.

You can measure vibrations with or without a particular product/sokution, but that doesn’t tell you if and to what extent any difference are audible.

When objectivist reviewers measure (for example) distortion introduced by a DAC, they do so in reference to what has been proven to be below the threshold of audibility. Without that benchmark, the measurements mean very little.

In the first instance, what is necessary is double blind testing, where listeners can say whether they can hear a difference between different solutions. If there’s no difference to be heard in repeated tests, we can stop there.

If there is a difference, then measurements can be taken, including those with the laser used in one of the above links, to see where the boundaries lay; at one point can differences be heard.

Then we can apply these measurements to future products, to see whether their product/solution is above or below threshold.

 

[Zapper]

So no evidence of audible changes, just some classic audiophile FUD of resonances. Those might translate into an audible changes, but I'm betting they didn't go that far.

I agree. The differences are barely visible on the on-axis response, so probably well below audibility.

I would like to see some similar tests with a speaker on a suspended wood floor instead of concrete slab, which likely would make a stronger case for the iso mounts compared to spikes.

 

[DLS79]

I think people are looking at this the wrong way, isolation pads aren't about improving audio quality.

They are about Helping to protect against potential issues. For example if your desk has a response that your speakers might excite.

 

[Purité Audio]

If you desk was adding audible resonance then removing or at least ameliorating would be a sound quality issue.
Keith

 

[Soniclife]

They are about Helping to protect against potential issues. For example if your desk has a response that your speakers might excite.

They do help a bit like that, at least as much as a pile of books, but with the open frame isoacoustics you can still reach through to get to crap behind them, that's why I kept mine.

 

[ZolaIII]

Those are broad topics. Could you be more specific?

It's all already been discussed and you had a link to go and read it yourself.
More specific:

Springs Under My Speakers: What's Happening?

(Sorry I don't have speaker measuring equipment to post data. For now I just have to say "this is what I heard...any explanation"?) I recently tried a "tweak" for footers under my speakers that has had fascinating results. And I'm wondering about the explanation. I've never been big on...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[DLS79]

If you desk was adding audible resonance then removing or at least ameliorating would be a sound quality issue.
Keith

The desk might or might not be an issue, it would depend on the desk, the speakers, and what sounds are being produced, and the positioning of the speakers.

That's why the side table test is a joke imo, it's nothing like the 48" to 60" wide by 24" to 36" deep flat pack desks most people have.

 

[Thomas_A]

As already mentioned, there may or may not be audible resonances. These are for example clearly audible:

The claim is then; using soft feet, you will at least avoid such problems completely, regardless if they would exist or not in the specific case. So why not use soft feet, always? They can be made for free or bought very cheaply.

 

[Zapper]

I think people are looking at this the wrong way, isolation pads aren't about improving audio quality.

They are about Helping to protect against potential issues. For example if your desk has a response that your speakers might excite.

I have an example of that. I placed the bass module of a desktop 2.1 system on the desk due to the 150Hz crossover, so I wanted it near the satellites. The 6" vertically firing woofer vibrated the desktop strongly and muddled the bass. A 4" thick block of packing foam reduced the coupling to acceptable levels.

 

[OnLyTNT]

I made pads with those soft materials used for computer hardware packaging to isolate my desktop speakers from the desk. It stopped resonating all the stuff on my desk and I don't feel the sound through the desk which was a bit irritating me.

 

[Zapper]

It's all already been discussed and you had a link to go and read it yourself.
More specific:

Springs Under My Speakers: What's Happening?

(Sorry I don't have speaker measuring equipment to post data. For now I just have to say "this is what I heard...any explanation"?) I recently tried a "tweak" for footers under my speakers that has had fascinating results. And I'm wondering about the explanation. I've never been big on...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Thanks for the link. Does Isoacoustics use silicone in their isolators?

 

[ZolaIII]

Thanks for the link. Does Isoacoustics use silicone in their isolators?

In packs they do but seriously you can do better for lot less money on your self (either making such or using something convenient which originally had a different purpose). As @Thomas_A already stated. Silicone thanks to it's physical properties is simply the best material for such applications and easy to work with (cut, mold and such).

 

[Esprit]

I think isolating and reducing vibration is important on a turntable (but I don't use turntables).
P.S. I believe I was among the first to purchase IsoAcoustic products when they started business. Now they gather dust...

 

[Count Arthur]

Thanks for the link. Does Isoacoustics use silicone in their isolators?

I don't think I've ever seen a particular material specified, but some sort of squidgy rubber or plastic.

 

[Vacceo]

In packs they do but seriously you can do better for lot less money on your self (either making such or using something convenient which originally had a different purpose). As @Thomas_A already stated. Silicone thanks to it's physical properties is simply the best material for such applications and easy to work with (cut, mold and such).

Amazon sells very nice packs of silicone hemispheres with a very affordable price. Those seem to be perfectly suited for the task.

 

[Purité Audio]

To isolate you need to look at visco -elastic material /open celled rubber, Sorbathane , then you will have to consider durometer and ‘height’ of the towers.
Keith

 

[Thomas_A]

You can just google Sylomer.

 

[IPunchCholla]

Joking aside my speakers, through necessity, actually point across the corners of my desk. I posted a thread elsewhere about minimising desk reflections, I suspect what I’m looking for is some sort of ‘desk carpet’.

I’m lucky enough to live in a city with an acoustic panel manufacturer. They do installations for major corporations mostly, but have an annual garage sale. I was able to pick up a desk sized piece of thick felt for cheap to knock down reflections. There might be something like that in your corner of the world.

 

[Jeremiah Sheets]

That's the classic audiophile theory, and I suspect much of it is wrong.

The proper way to dissipate energy is by decoupling and damping. Ask any mechanical engineer working in vibration and noise control. (Or ask a rider of a classic Harley with a rigid mounted engine.) A rigid connection to another body simply propagates vibration, in this case from speaker to stand to floor.

The minimal resonance (knock test) is the only part that clearly makes sense. More mass will push the frequencies lower, but it's not clear a priori that lower frequencies will have lower amplitude or be less audible.

It isn’t “audiophile theory” at all. It’s Acoustical fact. For the record I’m not an audiophile I’m a Sound Engineer and Acoustical Consultant (professionally).

Decoupling from the stand is ideal but incredibly difficult to do entirely. This is why many stands are instead coupled directly to the structure because if you decouple the stand from the floor but can’t decouple the speaker from the stand, it is ideal to increase the entire mass of the system.