Poll for Topping PA5 owners only please.

[Laserjock]

Thanks. I am going to contact Topping and see if they have a response.

Any updates?

 

[xenvre]

Hi all,

just wanted to share my experience too.

I am an owner of a PA5 that I use in conjunction with E50 DAC and a pair of JBL Stage A 130. The serial of the unit I own starts with 211112. I have bought it end of May from a local store in Italy and have been using it for nearly one month with no issue thus far.

Just wanted to say that the first time I used it, I carelessly removed the power chord from the inlet without switching the amplifier off. I hear very strange noises from both speakers. From that day on I always switch it off using the front panel switch before removing AC, and the thing never happened again.

Noticed very rare pops (probably 3 in a month) but always attributed them to the Fiio M7 DAP connected via USB to the E50 DAC (it seems the audio stream gets corrupted when the player goes in standby or the screen gets locked. I am quite sure this is the reason as it is repeatable.)

For those saying that failures have been reported only in ASR-related places by ASR-related people, just have a look at this post from a PA5 thread (https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=63032&start=30#p1058773) reporting a failing LA90 after few days. Of course, this is a different product, but still makes me doubt.

 

[amirm]

Any updates?

Not yet.

 

[mccririck]

These little mini-amps with the external supplies (and even some with internal supplies) are not intended to be turned off and started back up repeatedly. The power supply should be plugged into a live outlet and left on all the time. The amp itself is also always on, but when "off" from it's power switch it is in a deep standby mode.

The reason for this is the large reservoir "Bulk" capacitors used on the amplifier boards and, often, in the power supply as well. When you first connect the Power cord to the supply there is a rather large inrush of current until it gets charged up and working. When you first connect the amp to the power supply there is another large inrush of current while the amp's big caps charge up and settle down. When you power cycle with both devices connected that inrush can be big enough to do damage.

Neither device is likely to be designed to handle this repeatedly. Each repetition puts a very large strain on the rectifier diodes and AC filters in the power supply. Each time causes some trivial amount of damage, until one day it starts acting up and eventually dies.

This issue came to the fore with people shutting down their PCs and then turning off the "babysitter switch" on the back of the case. We had a large rash of failed power supplies because the current inrush was popping the rectifiers inside. We ended up replacing quite a few under warranty and advising that the power switch be left on all the time. After that, very few supply failures.

So .... best advice... to avoid the "inrush" problem, hook up your mini-amp, plug it into a live outlet... and leave it "on" all the time. When not in use, use the "on-off" switch on the amplifier to put it into standby mode.

This seems such a poor excuse for failures. All products should be designed to survive powering up regularly! Most of these products that have failed are only a few months old - it doesn't bode well for the survival rate after a few years...

 

[antcollinet]

This seems such a poor excuse for failures. All products should be designed to survive powering up regularly! Most of these products that have failed are only a few months old - it doesn't bode well for the survival rate after a few years...

You are absolutely right. But you are quoting a deleted member: perhaps not one to rely on for perfect insight.

 

[mlee]

For what its worth Aoshida Audio-CA from Canada who sold me the original PA5 units via amazon.ca was very responsive to the issue and was able to get me a full refund via amazon for both units even though the return date was after the standard amazon return date.

 

[Toku]

For what its worth Aoshida Audio-CA from Canada who sold me the original PA5 units via amazon.ca was very responsive to the issue and was able to get me a full refund via amazon for both units even though the return date was after the standard amazon return date.

Japan's Aoshida HiFi-JP also has very solid support after purchase. They are always on the user side.

 

[amirm]

OK, I heard back from Topping. They should be responding on their own.

 

[BoredErica]

OK, I heard back from Topping. They should be responding on their own.

Hope so. Last I heard from them, they told me they were struggling to find the cause of the problem. Paying shipping back to Hifigo is probably expensive enough. I can't risk sending one back for a replacement rather than refund and getting another one that malfunctions. I need to be sure I'd be getting inventory that has been fixed.

Dumb comments about how Topping products are toys and class D amps are (almost all) garbage aside, it is still true that Topping handled this situation very poorly. Hifigo told me they are aware of the issue, but no official statement yet. Nothing from Johnyang, not even an acknowledgment.

 

[amirm]

Nothing from Johnyang, not even an acknowledgment.

John is a designer for the company. He is not customer service. He has also pulled way back from forum participation in general.

Company will have an official support account here to respond to such things.

 

[airbornimal]

Interestingly, today I forgot to turn on the fan pointing to my (second) PA5 and it started hissing after a few hours. I don't think it ever hissed with the fan on.

Perhaps this is evidence pointing to the issue being thermally related. It would be good to finally hear from Topping.

 

[raest]

He has also pulled way back from forum participation in general.

he has pulled away so much, he's posting in Sabaj threads... :/

 

[MAB]

John is a designer for the company. He is not customer service. He has also pulled way back from forum participation in general.

Company will have an official support account here to respond to such things.

That makes sense. I think John may be in a difficult position here if he has to both evangelize the product, and provide a grief-counseling for people like me on this forum. Both are kind of important!
And, my issue isn't with Topping so much as it is with the inability of the vendor to provide service.

 

[BoredErica]

It's not that hard to say 'Not sure what's going on, but sorry about the issues'. It's 1 message. Must he do it? Of course not. Would it have been nice if had? Yeah. And if John shouldn't have been the one to do it, someone who does work in customer service should've talked about it. it's been over half a year since the review. Even if somehow we're all just unlucky and there is an elevated but not super high chance of failure, at least say *something* about it.

If a person's gonna come on ASR to talk about how great their product is and answer questions, I would expect them to at least apologize if the product they're talking about malfunctions. I don't think it's a difficult position, I think it's just slightly awkward. What's difficult is to be sitting here with a malfunctioning product.

Professionally, if I design/work on something and I screw it up and I talk to customers, then yes, I would absolutely apologize to them. I did something wrong, so it is natural I apologize. I think Topping is burning my goodwill for seemingly no good reason.

 

[Doodski]

It's not that hard to say 'Not sure what's going on, but sorry about the issues'. It's 1 message. Must he do it? Of course not. Would it have been nice if had? Yeah. And if John shouldn't have been the one to do it, someone who does work in customer service should've talked about it. it's been over half a year since the review. Even if somehow we're all just unlucky and there is an elevated but not super high chance of failure, at least say *something* about it.

If a person's gonna come on ASR to talk about how great their product is and answer questions, I would expect them to at least apologize if the product they're talking about malfunctions. I don't think it's a difficult position, I think it's just slightly awkward. It's difficult to be sitting here with a malfunctioning product.

When I provided factory authorized Sony warranty service for 15 years we had to deal with the STR-AVXXXX series of receivers' faults for several years. They where renowned for intermittently turning on in the middle of the night, switching inputs and radio stations and the volume going to 100% as the room temperature delta changed. Additionally they would have low level fuzzy sounding distortion in one or both channels and the amps would blow for no apparent reason. Customers with these issues where au plenty. What seemed like a CPU/brain issue was actually the ground reference for the CPU/brain intermittently floating in the range of a good oscilloscope visibly measurable microvolts (I had a analog storage differential input HP O-scope that went to 5 microvolt /div and could observe the change.) to millivolts due to the chassis ground planes layout and the use of #2 phillips screws for grounding the main and display PCB ground planes. The fuzz distortion was caused by a mis-spec'd voltage amp transistor in both channels and the protection circuitry fusible resisters would change value and then blow the amp's output unity gain stage. Sony handled it brilliantly. Service bulletins where au plenty, communication was excellent and clear and precise instruction was provided for all authorized service departments. I personally serviced ~several hundred or more of these units and brought them all back to life and had happy customers that where amazed that we could provide such prompt service. Sony wrote the book on customer service as far as I am concerned and Sony serves as a excellent example for all consumer/domestic audio companies for what is a proper level of customer service. Shutting down communications and using protectionistic measures only serves to discredit a company and ruin it's reputation. Topping is digging a hole by not communicating and resolving these long term issues that are affecting so many people. As a result of the Topping lack of action and resolution I have decided to not purchase a Topping headphone DAC/amp/AIO for my headphone upgrade path. The intention/reaction of Topping has not been rapid nor reasonable in my opinion. Topping needs to get their professional act together and stop stalling.

 

[restorer-john]

When I provided factory authorized Sony warranty service for 15 years we had to deal with the STR-AVXXXX series of receivers' faults for several years. They where renowned for intermittently turning on in the middle of the night, switching inputs and radio stations and the volume going to 100% as the room temperature delta changed. Additionally they would have low level fuzzy sounding distortion in one or both channels and the amps would blow for no apparent reason. Customers with these issues where au plenty. What seemed like a CPU/brain issue was actually the ground reference for the CPU/brain intermittently floating in the range of a good oscilloscope visibly measurable microvolts (I had a analog storage differential input HP O-scope that went to 5 microvolt /div and could observe the change.) to millivolts due to the chassis ground planes layout and the use of #2 phillips screws for grounding the main and display PCB ground planes. The fuzz distortion was caused by a mis-spec'd voltage amp transistor in both channels and the protection circuitry fusible resisters would change value and then blow the amp's output unity gain stage. Sony handled it brilliantly. Service bulletins where au plenty, communication was excellent and clear and precise instruction was provided for all authorized service departments. I personally serviced ~several hundred or more of these units and brought them all back to life and had happy customers that where amazed that we could provide such prompt service. Sony wrote the book on customer service as far as I am concerned and Sony serves as a excellent example for all consumer/domestic audio companies for what is a proper level of customer service. Shutting down communications and using protectionistic measures only serves to discredit a company and ruin it's reputation. Topping is digging a hole by not communicating and resolving these long term issues that are affecting so many people. As a result of the Topping lack of action and resolution I have decided to not purchase a Topping headphone DAC/amp/AIO for my headphone upgrade path. The intention/reaction of Topping has not been rapid nor reasonable in my opinion. Topping needs to get their professional act together and stop stalling.

Sony had service manual addendums out for the Sony CDP-101 in June 1984 in Australia. The worlds first CD player was only a few months old.

God I miss the Sony of old.

 

[Doodski]

Sony had service manual addendums out for the Sony CDP-101 in June 1984 in Australia. The worlds first CD player was only a few months old.

God I miss the Sony of old.

View attachment 216713

I do too very much. I looked forward to each and everyday that I serviced the gear. Some nights I was dreaming it and waking early to get ready for it. From the (As we have drooled over multiple times) very very high quality color rice paper schematics, to the service bulletins and the prompt service for parts acquisition and even the ~8 to 12 weeks delay for parts for 25+ year old product Sony ruled the day. If Sony said it was a ETA estimate situation we knew the parts where coming or being made. I actually felt sorry for peeps that serviced the brands that had poor schematics and poor support. I knew what I had and I appreciated it. It could have paid more but it was a labor of love that I enjoyed and found challenging like when a good involving puzzle is solved...

 

[MAB]

I do too very much. I looked forward to each and everyday that I serviced the gear. Some nights I was dreaming it and waking early to get ready for it. From the (As we have drooled over multiple times) very very high quality color rice paper schematics, to the service bulletins and the prompt service for parts acquisition and even the ~8 to 12 weeks delay for parts for 25+ year old product Sony ruled the day. If Sony said it was a ETA estimate situation we knew the parts where coming or being made. I actually felt sorry for peeps that serviced the brands that had poor schematics and poor support. I knew what I had and I appreciated it. It could have paid more but it was a labor of love that I enjoyed and found challenging like when a good involving puzzle is solved...

I used to repair radar. Raytheon, Furuno, they all had service and documentation that was professional, informative, and a good read. I later worked for a company that specialized in test and measurement gear, with documentation that was downright glorious. Outside of the details on how to fix broken product, there were sections on best practices, field service reliability, and electrical safety. I miss that too.

It's really nice when a company makes great devices and backs up the product with all of the other stuff that makes a product. That way, when things do go wrong it doesn't turn into a bunch of hand-wringing and tooth-gnashing like it did here with this PA5. This is an own-goal for Topping. Unlike true high end audio companies that can make tons of cash on a single high-margin sale, it seems Topping's business is to sell lots of bits of flotsam and jetsam, so it might be important to not loose large swaths of customers over a cheap device...

 

[IPunchCholla]

Just reporting that my PA5 is still working 100%. But I also have my fingers crossed every day, that it will, which sucks. In the meantime I have sold off my L30 and my D10s (also a Schiit Magnius to be fully upfront). I haven't had a single problem with a Topping product, but this thread has made me nervous enough to probably not buy any Topping product until they clarify what is going on with these amps, and if they take too long, maybe never. The reason I am hanging on to the PA5 is that it is very clean and has the power I need, while I look into DIY Purify and Hypex builds.

 

[Doodski]

I look into DIY Purify and Hypex builds.

You seem to be digging the assembling your own gear stuff.