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Marantz SA-10 Review (SACD Player & DAC)

Rate this product:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 71 23.4%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 139 45.7%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 79 26.0%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 15 4.9%

  • Total voters
    304
We would need to test lower cost SACD players to see where SA-10 lands.
You may have a look down there...;)

PXL_20220424_121948252.NIG.jpg

 
Oppo went out of business 4 years ago. However you can find new ones for double, triple, quadruple the original price.
 
I would think that most of the inexpensive DACs available in the green or blue areas of Amir's charts would perform equal to, if not better than the SA10. However, it was not a poor performer, and is definitely a nice piece of audio jewelry. I most certainly wouldn't mind having one in my rack! :)

It may simply depend on your appetite to add yet another device and handful of cables to your setup though.
 
Hmm, post removed. I wonder, by whom and why?
 
You might link "catch all" Woody,
Not all know what your talkin bout. ;)
Yeah, I looked and didn't see any "catch all" forum.
 
You might link "catch all" Woody,
Not all know what your talkin bout. ;)

Good idea!

 
Jitter performance was disappointing:
Marantz SA-10 Measurements SACD Jitter USB DAC high-end player.png


The jitter components can easily be identified by frequency and sources found and eliminated. See how it was independent of which input is used so it means that the jitter is internally generated.

If you compare this to Marantz's SA-11s2 10 years earlier, you can see the noise floor is higher (could be the APxx555 vs what Stereophile uses) but the jitter spikes are lower in the older system since everything is under -120 dB

209Marfig12.jpg


 
Completely irrevelant as only 3 mechanisms are available worldwide for about a decade now: Toshiba HOP-1200, (CD/DVD/SACD) Sanyo SF-HD850 (CD/DVD) and Sony KHM-313 (CD only). Sony probably left the OEM market, Philips did it already in 2007(!). The SF HD-850
is so cheap that customers use it also for CD only. No matter if you buy Yamaha, Denon or Marantz, it is the Toshiba HOP-1200.
BTW, all 3 drives have no BSL motors. Just the same small Mabuchi motor that sells for 1$.



See above. Same drive, HOP-1200. They gave the complete unit including the tray a fancy name to make the customers believe
they built it from scratch but they did not. Ever wondered why you could see nice photographs of the mechanics two or three
decades ago but not today? The KHM-313 sells for $12 and spins in some Accuphase...
This is very good information. So many of our products are built like this and we don't really understand it until a factory catches on fire and a whole industry is affected.
 
A comparison:
This Sony Player, CDP-552/650 was Sony´s Flagship Model in 1985,
one of the first to provide digital output, Sony´s own linear magnetic transport,
made of die cast metal for the laser, no gear and a brushless disc-motor.
This transport was also used in cheaper players that did cost about $1200.

Top Notch back then.
Adjusted for Inflation the CDP-552/650 would cost about $7000 today, still cheaper than the Marantz.
I own one, still works. Not sure if the Marantz would in 37 years from now on...
 
This Sony Player, CDP-552/650 was Sony´s Flagship Model in 1985,
one of the first to provide digital output, Sony´s own linear magnetic transport,
made of die cast metal for the laser, no gear and a brushless disc-motor.
This transport was also used in cheaper players that did cost about $1200.

Top Notch back then.
Adjusted for Inflation the CDP-552/650 would cost about $7000 today, still cheaper than the Marantz.
I own one, still works. Not sure if the Marantz would in 37 years from now on...

That first Sony player was very well built, in every way too.
How much have you used that player? Is it still in every day use? Or is it just rare and occasional usage now?
Thirty seven years is a long time for a player.

It's just that your comparison to the Marantz SA-10 would also apply to most every player since that first Sony.
About the only thing to go bad in a good quality player is the laser. There are now few replacement lasers for old players.
It hits sacd players harder as the lasers tend to fail much sooner than cd player lasers.
I have a first generation Marantz sacd player, SA-8260, vintage 2003 or so. I replaced the laser in 2012, while they were still available. This player was still in everyday use until I bought a Ruby player a couple years ago.
 
The Sony was not much in use, but a Nakamichi-OMS-5EII is in daily use since 1990 - 32 years.
Of course the belt driving the laser (never seen this in other players) had to be replaced, one years ago i put in a
gear to replace the belt, see Images. Later, the heavy brass gear was replaced with lighter version made of POM.

Also an extra bearing for the cheap disc motor aded, Electrolytic Caps replaced about 15 years ago.
Laser had to be replaced (I bought replacement lasers in 2000) but it was my fault
as i accidentally zapped it by ESD. The rest works fine.
So maybe not fair towards the Marantz but a friend has exactly the same Nakamichi that runs flawless
and was never touched besides replacing the belt.
All adjustments were still textbook-perfect.
The old lasers last because they are cooled by the diecast laser housing.
It may also play a role that the light emitting area was bigger, the heat of the light was more evenly distributed.
Maybe someone with knowledge about laser emitting diodes and their evolution could chime in.
img-5590_1035712.jpg
newgear_1035713.jpg
img-5558_1035711.jpg
 
The Sony was not much in use, but a Nakamichi-OMS-5EII is in daily use since 1990 - 32 years.
Of course the belt driving the laser (never seen this in other players) had to be replaced, one years ago i put in a
gear to replace the belt, see Images. Later, the heavy brass gear was replaced with lighter version made of POM.

Also an extra bearing for the cheap disc motor aded, Electrolytic Caps replaced about 15 years ago.
Laser had to be replaced (I bought replacement lasers in 2000) but it was my fault
as i accidentally zapped it by ESD. The rest works fine.
So maybe not fair towards the Marantz but a friend has exactly the same Nakamichi that runs flawless
and was never touched besides replacing the belt.
All adjustments were still textbook-perfect.
The old lasers last because they are cooled by the diecast laser housing.
It may also play a role that the light emitting area was bigger, the heat of the light was more evenly distributed.
Maybe someone with knowledge about laser emitting diodes and their evolution could chime in.

Yes, Nakamichi was top quality for sure.
Chris, anatech over at DIYAudio, was a service technician for most everything for years. He knew the cd players from the 80's and 90's inside out. He always used to praise the quality of the Nakamichi players.
 
The Sony was not much in use, but a Nakamichi-OMS-5EII is in daily use since 1990 - 32 years.
Of course the belt driving the laser (never seen this in other players) had to be replaced, one years ago i put in a
gear to replace the belt, see Images. Later, the heavy brass gear was replaced with lighter version made of POM.

Also an extra bearing for the cheap disc motor aded, Electrolytic Caps replaced about 15 years ago.
Laser had to be replaced (I bought replacement lasers in 2000) but it was my fault
as i accidentally zapped it by ESD. The rest works fine.
So maybe not fair towards the Marantz but a friend has exactly the same Nakamichi that runs flawless
and was never touched besides replacing the belt.
All adjustments were still textbook-perfect.
The old lasers last because they are cooled by the diecast laser housing.
It may also play a role that the light emitting area was bigger, the heat of the light was more evenly distributed.
Maybe someone with knowledge about laser emitting diodes and their evolution could chime in.
View attachment 247293View attachment 247294View attachment 247295
Should be putting NSFW before you post these kind of pictures! Hehe
 
Should be putting NSFW before you post these kind of pictures! Hehe
Don´t worry, not easy to achieve.
Beside the gear you need a very precise late or CNC-milling machine
as it is crucial to have no play.

Chris, anatech over at DIYAudio, was a service technician for most everything for years. He knew the cd players from the 80's and 90's inside out. He always used to praise the quality of the Nakamichi players.

There is nothing special about the Nakamichi transports.
Smaller manufacturers like Nakamichi relied on Toshiba / CEC, Sony and Philips as suppliers.
The first generation of Naks had the same Toshiba HOP-32 kind-of lasers that were in almost every good player,
from Toshiba over Kenwood to Denon. Optics were top notch and the heavy Toshiba laser
could be even mechanically aligned in three axis.
I think the RF-Opamp for the diodes was on the OPH-32 itself,
so the weak current from the photodiodes traveled a short distance before being amplified.
An Idea that was much later re-introduced by Sony with the KSS-240
The second gen of my Mac is a Sony KSS-123A, RF-Amp already on the Main PCB, so the current has
to travel about 15-20cm before being amplified. Eye-pattern becomes more noisy.

BTW, I had very bad experiences in real life with Chris, anatech.
I asked him to collaborate to develop a solution for exchanging laser-diodes and he agreed happily.
He would figure a routine, I would produce/mill the means needed.

So I did ship anatech a BU-1 transport from Germany to Canada, including 10 Sharp diodes.
I also sent him money to buy a Sony CDP-102 that has the same BU-1 transport for reference.
This was maybe two years before Manolomos published @ diyaudio his findings how to swap the diodes.
But he did nothing and also never took part in the discussions @diyaudio.
After 2 years of patient waiting I asked him to send me the BU-1 and the player back,
there was still some of my money left to cover the shipment.
He acted like a prima donna and played offended, never sent my belongings back, so...
 
BTW, I had very bad experiences in real life with Chris, anatech.
I asked him to collaborate to develop a solution for exchanging laser-diodes and he agreed happily.
He would figure a routine, I would produce/mill the means needed.

I remember the thread and project you mention.
Then it just disappeared, and now I know why.
Pity. Too bad.
 
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