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Help? designing a DIY loudspeaker

computer-audiophile

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My reason for sharing is to say that a person should focus on the aspect of speaker design that they are interested in.
Agreed, that's exactly how I see it. I just didn't understand the close relationship of the design with Genelec, who produce particularly sophisticated professional loudspeakers with a development effort of many man-years.

BTW: As a classical music listener, I don't attach much importance to sub-bass. I'm more in tune with Paul W Klipsch, who once said: 'the midrange is where we live'.
 

Fredygump

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Agreed, that's exactly how I see it. I just didn't understand the close relationship of the design with Genelec, who produce particularly sophisticated professional loudspeakers with a development effort of many man-years.

BTW: As a classical music listener, I don't attach much importance to sub-bass. I'm more in tune with Paul W Klipsch, who once said: 'the midrange is where we live'.
Well, you have a habit of being insulting, don't you think?

I hope someone else understands! The close relationship with Genelec is obvious. I am copying the physical driver arrangement Genelec is using in the W371A. And then I added a coaxial driver to make it full range, which is what Genelec did in the 8381A.

What you are looking at is actual audio science taking place. I built it, I tested it, and I described what I found.

It would be nice if someone else chose to try it too, because then they could confirm what I am finding and maybe move the design forward.
 

DanielT

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Has it been mentioned in the thread that there are DIY kits available? That could be an option, or? An example, among many kits, the Visaton Nimrod more or less a copy (in appearance, style) of the Wharfedale Linton 85th. Compare the shape of the baffle on them, for example. Both riding on the vintage design look craze:
LINTONHeritageMahogany_2.jpg




nimrod_1400x.jpg


nimrod_fs_200709_b-1.gif





 

computer-audiophile

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Has it been mentioned in the thread that there are DIY kits available? That could be an option, or? An example, among many kits, the Visaton Nimrod more or less a copy (in appearance, style) of the Wharfedale Linton 85th. Compare the shape of the baffle on them, for example. Both riding on the vintage design look craze:
View attachment 320136



View attachment 320133

View attachment 320134




Hi Daniel

I had a quick look (I hope I am not wrong)

The price for the NIMROD kit: 619 Euros
The price for the Wharfedale Linton 85: 499 Euros.

This would strengthen my thesis that a DIY-copy of mass-produced loudspeakers is usually not worthwhile.
 

DanielT

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Hi Daniel

I had a quick look (I hope I am not wrong)

The price for the NIMROD kit: 619 Euros
The price for the Wharfedale Linton 85: 499 Euros.

This would strengthen my thesis that a DIY-copy of mass-produced loudspeakers is usually not worthwhile.
That may be true, but we don't know if those Visaton Nimrod are better, or much better than Wharfedale Linton 85. Or for that matter worse, I should add. :)

Okay kit to find out If you will like to carpentry, assemble speakers. Then maybe you should try a cheap kit, for example::)

 

DanielT

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This would strengthen my thesis that a DIY-copy of mass-produced loudspeakers is usually not worthwhile.
But the joy of discovery combined with the construction itself plus learning along the way cannot be mistaken when it comes to ppataki. That in itself can be worth a lot.:D

Some examples:



 

DanielT

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Depreciation of DIY. You should keep that in mind if you are considering to sell the things you have made at some point in the future.

I'm not the one selling them. I just took these as examples. Seller wants $90 for both:

fd392bca3715750002719bfecc5f3d07.jpg

I am selling my self-constructed bass modules built with Peerless XXLS10. In oak veneer and
intended to be connected with a separate filter and amplifier.
Very limited use and in good condition.

Height: 53 cm
Depth: 55 cm
Width 32 cm



They seem well built. Had I been in the market for bass modules, they could certainly be an option.:)
How much did the Peerless XXLS10 cost? $150 each? And just the build material for two bass modules costs a decent amount of money.
 
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Paweł L

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There's an old project from Polish DIY site based on the sb15ncac30-8 version and Satori ringdome tweeter.

Somewhat simple X-over, maybe even too simple, I didn't build or hear the design (lack of RLC trap to cut the cone resonance, but maybe not really needed), the designer said he tried more complicated x-o for flatter freq resp and things didn't really sounded that great. The enclosure can made in BR or closed box version.
 

D!sco

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this all started from an idea of using the Hivi 3.1kit + a speaker stand with Dual opposing subs now it's just spiralled out of control tbh im lost in the sea of confusion and options
Honestly what are you looking for that this doesn't provide? More driver surface area? Higher SPL? Lower distortion?

My only reason for wanting to replace these is to try narrower dispersion patterns. And, honestly "I want to build X thing" is probably the worst way to go about building a speaker. Always have a design goal in mind. Low IMD, deep extension, who cares how large enclosures, whatever. There has to be an idea besides making a speaker or all you'll get is mess.
 

DanielT

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Honestly what are you looking for that this doesn't provide? More driver surface area? Higher SPL? Lower distortion?

My only reason for wanting to replace these is to try narrower dispersion patterns. And, honestly "I want to build X thing" is probably the worst way to go about building a speaker. Always have a design goal in mind. Low IMD, deep extension, who cares how large enclosures, whatever. There has to be an idea besides making a speaker or all you'll get is mess.
Tip:


Here you can choose the waveguide with dispersion that suits you:
Screenshot_2023-10-31_200126.jpg



 

D!sco

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none of those fit any of my current drivers
 

MAB

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Hi Daniel

I had a quick look (I hope I am not wrong)

The price for the NIMROD kit: 619 Euros
The price for the Wharfedale Linton 85: 499 Euros.

This would strengthen my thesis that a DIY-copy of mass-produced loudspeakers is usually not worthwhile.
I never did it to save money... rather for learning, satisfaction, and the end product suits my ego.;)
That being said, I built a pair of JBL M2 clones for about $3500 US (including DSP and amps), and the $25000 savings covered pretty much every bad and wasteful audio expenditure I ever made.
 

JiBé

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Unless you really really really want to learn about speaker designing, I'd say just buy some. There's a lot of actual engineering.
 

Dave Bullet

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The driver choices are fine. All good drivers.

You may only need one PR per side - given a single PR has at least twice the swept volume of 2 x SB15s.

A UMIK-1 is fine for measurements. I use one myself for speaker design.

I'd recommend doing some box modeling with 2 x SB15s and a single SB16 PR per side. VituixCAD may be able to model this combination (it's my preferred box, diffraction and active/passive crossover design tool).

Actual impedance measurements are not needed for crossover design - you can use manufacturer impedance measurements.

You CAN get close to reality with using manufacturer FR data - but there is a lot more systematic manipulation you need to apply to get this done correctly. It actually becomes easier to just measure. I prefer Room EQ wizard (REW) for frequency response measurements.

Are you planning to go active / passive for the crossover?
 

Flaesh

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DIY-copy of mass-produced loudspeakers is usually not worthwhile.
[perhaps an unusual example] It seems there are hundreds of copies and clones of JBL M2; a matching subwoofer SUB18 is also a good job for the home carpenter.
But it will be around 500~ euros per driver. (May be more now)
 
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