The one that should be removed is the AV7705 that got the higher number only because it was measured at much reduced voltage (half iirc). The standard Amir uses is 2 V for unbalanced and 4 V balanced.
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Denon AVR-X4800H AVR Review
- Thread starter amirm
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The one that should be removed is the AV7705 that got the higher number only because it was measured at much reduced voltage (half iirc). The standard Amir uses is 2 V for unbalanced and 4 V balanced.
ivo.f.doma
Active Member
OK, I'm not even buying. I was just pointing out the fact that Denon is lying. That is all.
If you are willing to accept when manufacturers lie to their customers, that is your decision. I don't accept it.
I think we're aligned. However it seems to be both more simple as well as cheaper to just exchange one 8-channel DAC for another and do some software changes. From the 8500 until the A1 they now use DAC's in stereo setup. I guess they have a reason for this as two or three multi channels would be cheaper.Who is that other reviewer? General statements about using 2 vs 8 channel dacs, that 2 ch is better, would make no sense ("would" because I don't know what's been said about it). The reference class flagship ES9038Pro is also a 8 channel DAC. Going by the specs, the PCM1690, if implemented well should do better or at least as good as the PCM5102A. In terms of price, yes, I hear you the first time and I have been saying the same since the rumor about the use of PCM5102A, that D+M wouldn't do such as thing, but they did, proving me wrong.Someone, forgot who, suggested may be they got the "binned" pieces, if so that's good news but realistically, reaching SINAD of 96 dB is fantastic but why not go with those that offers much higher SINAD such as 100 dB typical in the first place? Again, I am not one who believe in a 100 dB SINAD chip will sound better than a 93 dB SINAD one. Audible or not, I just prefer the best possible spec at a given price point. Overall, I would have no regret if I had bought a AVR-X4800H or Marantz C40. My only counter point to yours is only about the 1690 vs the 5102A, that on paper, one doesn't seem better than the other, for the application. By the way, the Denon AVR-X5200W, measured by Gene on Audioholics, had excellent measurements and Denon/Marantz were using the PCM1690 at the time.
We may never know why D+M picked that chip went that route despite the potentially higher cost to them. If I were to guess, as I said before, perhaps they got a deal from TI that they could not refused, keep in the mind those PCM5100 series chips have been around for a very long time.
hi all,
despite having read the whole post, I continue to be undecided whether to buy a denon x4800h or a x3800h.
my system consists of 7 klipsch reference 2022 speakers (central, front, atmos and rear) and svs pb3000 subwoofer. the room is about 30m2.
given the price difference of around €800, which one do you recommend?
despite having read the whole post, I continue to be undecided whether to buy a denon x4800h or a x3800h.
my system consists of 7 klipsch reference 2022 speakers (central, front, atmos and rear) and svs pb3000 subwoofer. the room is about 30m2.
given the price difference of around €800, which one do you recommend?
3800, if it has the features you need.
Sure, but the software doesn't provide mathematical wizardry to assist - that is reserved for DLBC & ART
Thank you for your reply. I should simply connect it to the tv and ps5 via hdmi 2.1 for games and movies. So the price difference wouldn't be justified in my case? the x4800h is not worth it?
D&M make a lot more of the more economical AVR's and Integrated amps etc...Who is that other reviewer? General statements about using 2 vs 8 channel dacs, that 2 ch is better, would make no sense ("would" because I don't know what's been said about it). The reference class flagship ES9038Pro is also a 8 channel DAC. Going by the specs, the PCM1690, if implemented well should do better or at least as good as the PCM5102A. In terms of price, yes, I hear you the first time and I have been saying the same since the rumor about the use of PCM5102A, that D+M wouldn't do such as thing, but they did, proving me wrong.
We may never know why D+M picked that chip went that route despite the potentially higher cost to them. If I were to guess, as I said before, perhaps they got a deal from TI that they could not refused, keep in the mind those PCM5100 series chips have been around for a very long time.
Perhaps they are binning the DAC chips shared across the entire range, and cherry picking the best for high margin products...
I opted for the 4800. It has a couple additional features which I am hoping will make it sound better. Also a little extra power for the atmos and surround. I believe the price difference is robbery but what are you going to do? I finnally have a closing date on my home and should be installing my system by the end of next month.
my doubt is if the x4800h is worth that price difference or if i would get the same quality with the x3800h
Yes, I mentioned that another member suggested that as a possibility too. Just that no one knows 100%...but all can have fun speculating.
Could you please point me to where Denon & Marantz consumer's website mention the DACs used in their receivers and processors?
Again, if the 3800 can do everything you want, then the price difference you pay would be for better build quality, and how much that is worth is largely a subjective thing, though in general the higher end models tend to have a higher profit margin for the manufacturers.
Where did you see that they lie about 8 X 5102, was it in the Masimo video? If they did, it was likely true, because the 4800's dac board(s) has to cover a total of 15 channels. The PCM5102A is a two channel IC, so they do have to use 8 pieces. The z2/3 and will likely be covered by another 3 PCM5100 like they did with the previous year models.
That's why I'm asking him to point to where D&M mentions the DACs used because as far I know, D&M stopped publishing DAC specifications a couple of months after the AKM factory fire, right after they switched from AKM to TI DACs.
ban25
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Given the circumstances, they had to re-design in a hurry to get stock back on the market. The engineers were already familiar with the TI DACs from their prior use in Zone 2 / 3 and they already had a supply agreement in-place. So, if time-to-market was critical, the choice they made to use the PCM5102A makes the most sense, at least to me.
Ok so the x3800h it has better value for money and can safely drive klipschs in 7.1.2
What are the sensitivities of your Klipsch speakers, or model numbers so I can find out. And seating distances?
In any case the difference in power output between the two is less than 1 dB, that's insignificant.
Good point.
seating distance 4m,
this is the specification of front speaker
https://d2um2qdswy1tb0.cloudfront.net/product-specsheets/Reference-R-600F-Spec-Sheet.pdf
this is the central one
https://d2um2qdswy1tb0.cloudfront.net/product-specsheets/Reference-R-50C-Spec-Sheet.pdf
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