Which nearfield upgrade(s) from Tuk Kanto, DX7 Pro, SVS 3000 Micro? $5k AUD / $3k USD

[mechkbfan]

Speakers: Tuk Kanto (https://www.kantoaudio.com/powered-speakers/tuk/)
DAC/Amp: Topping DX7 Pro (https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-dx7-pro-dac-and-headphone-amp-reviewed.9446/)
Subwoofer: SVS 3000 Micro with SoundPath (raised with feet)
Source: PC running Linux with Cantata & MPD using local MP3/FLAC files
Room: Carpet & 5m x 4m x 2.5m but I'm sitting at a PC desk in corner (not my house, so can't do sound treatment)
Location: Speakers ~110cm away from me on each side of PC monitor
Volume: ~60db majority of the time (according to Sound Meter on Android phone but seems about right)
Budget: $5,000 AUD / $3,000 USD (unfortunately don't get as great deals in Aus)
Music: Metalcore, post-rock, electro (sometimes used for movies & gaming but not prioritising that)
Sound Preference: Fun / punchy / V shaped (Fostex TH900 are my fav headphones but also enjoy HD6xx)

Why
Had this setup for ~4 years, and because it's a hobby for me & enjoy trying new things such as trialing a reference sound
i.e. I'm ready to upgrade one or two components

My biggest issue with current setup is consistent loudness (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-loudness_contour)
I've got the settings tuned so that it sounds best to my ears about 60db.
However once I start pushing a high volume, say 70db, the bass becomes unbalanced (i.e. even as a basshead, it becomes unpleasantly overpowering)
Right now I have to go into SVS app and change it in there which is annoying

Few ways I've seen this addressed that I'd likely be fine with
- Loudness buttons/knobs for low volume listening
- Automatic ones but they seem out of my budget
- Find an eq that can handle this for me (preference for software over hardware from $ perspective)

Current Plan
Replace the Tuk's with something a bit more neutral like Neumann KH120A or Genelec 8030C (or 8040D)

Get best reference sound I can with using a calibration for 20Hz-20Khz. See if I enjoy that more than my current preferences, if not, EQ to my tastes
e.g. https://www.minidsp.com/products/acoustic-measurement/umik-1

Admittedly I haven't researched this much yet but seems loudness could be handled by DSP
e.g. miniDSP Flex looked interesting (https://www.minidsp.com/products/minidsp-in-a-box/flex)

Or do a "dumb" approach with replacing the DX7 Pro with Yamaha A-S301 for loudness control

Loudness Control on Yamaha A-S301 Measurements

Have you ever been interested in what the Loudness Control knob does on Yamaha A-S301 amplifier exactly? It is used to compensate for perceived loudness in some way according to the equal loudness curves (after D.W. Robinson and R.S. Dadson, 1956) when listening to music at lower volumes...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Not sure if adding a second 3000 Micro or replacing it would do anything meaningful but open to being wrong

Suggestions
All ideas / recommendations welcome (except room modifications/changing location).
I'm not locked into anything. Just seeing what I don't know that I don't know or helping me choose between Neumann or Genelec (seems like there's no bad choice there)

Related Posts
Maybe helpful for others that are also interested / similar position to me
- https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/desktop-nearfield-speakers-£1k-budget.49452/
- https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/best-nearfields-under-5k-all-in.52390/
- https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...earfield-listening-that-sound-exciting.39705/

 

[staticV3]

All RME ADI-2 versions have equal loudness control built-in.

If that's something you struggle with on your current setup, then exchanging the DX7 Pro for an ADI-2 may well be worth it.

 

[mechkbfan]

Thankyou, I wasn't familiar with them

Looks pretty good

Review and Measurements of RME ADI-2 DAC

This is a review and detailed measurements of RME's new ADI-2 DAC. This is a spin off from their highly regarded ADC/DAC combo, the ADI-2 Pro. I have purchased the Pro for my testing but a member was kind enough to loan me the DAC only version reviewed here. I will measure and post any...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[staticV3]

Thankyou, I wasn't familiar with them

Looks pretty good

Review and Measurements of RME ADI-2 DAC

This is a review and detailed measurements of RME's new ADI-2 DAC. This is a spin off from their highly regarded ADC/DAC combo, the ADI-2 Pro. I have purchased the Pro for my testing but a member was kind enough to loan me the DAC only version reviewed here. I will measure and post any...

www.audiosciencereview.com

RME have excellent customer support, long-term software support, and they keep adding new features via free firmware updates.

It is one of those rare brands that truly listen to feedback and commit to their products.

Many people on ASR swear by them as their endgame DACs.

 

[lowkeyoperations]

Step 1 imo is to buy Dirac Live and install it on your PC. Only then will you discover what upgrades you need and only then will you actually hear the upgrades.

Having nearfield monitors on a desk will be causing major problems around 150hz. Being near a corner or walls will be causing problems all over the place from 50-300 hz.

I think if you got Dirac live you would laugh out loud at what you were previously listening to. Once you have it any further money spent on upgrades at least you might hear them.

Dirac can also have custom settings for different filters. So you can for example have different bass boost setting for different playback volumes for example.

 

[lowkeyoperations]

I used to own Neumann KH120a mki and they are great little speakers. I upgraded from them to Amphion One15s which I have found to be a significant improvement, but I’m using mine for mixing rather than simply enjoyment (although I do also enjoy listening to them).

In Australia the mkii KH120s are significantly more expensive than the mki though.

 

[mechkbfan]

It is one of those rare brands that truly listen to feedback and commit to their products.

Fantastic. Could be what I'm looking for.
I've been a little overwhelming looking at room correction, how it applies in my situation, what devices can/should I use

Looks like it's getting discussed here, so if went with this could keep my setup simple

REW and RME: How to Generate EQ tailored for RME ADI-2 using REW?

I have performed my first measurement with UMIK-1 and REW. I need your help to understand how to generate & translate my EQ measurements into RME parameters. I could not find a way to generate EQ according to RME parameters and capabilities. I tried using Generic EQ with 7 filters but didn't...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[mechkbfan]

Step 1 imo is to buy Dirac Live and install it on your PC.

Thanks. Room correction does seem that's a healthy first step

REW vs Dirac Live

miniDSP is a leading manufacturer of Digital Audio Signal Processors for the HomeTheater, Hifi, headphone and Automotive market. Join our large community of Audiophiles, Engineers and DIYers using our innovative products.

www.minidsp.com

Dirac Live sounds like the better solution from my initial reading

I'm big on open source software, and I thought REW was, but it's actually freeware

Open Sourcing REW?

Hello, Thanks for developing Room EQ Wizard -- it is an amazingly comprehensive suite of tools to do anything with DRC under the sun. I was wondering if you've ever considered releasing the software under an open source license. I think this has several benefits: Ability for others to...

www.avnirvana.com

Looks like Dirac is another rabbit hole to go down but whatever is easier between it and REW into my system will be pivotal

 

[mechkbfan]

In Australia the mkii KH120s are significantly more expensive than the mki though.

Quick google got me $1100 vs $1500 AUD each

My outcome for this setup is to buy something, enjoy it for the next 5 years, then repeat again, so the extra $800 is within budget and I wouldn't have the "I wonder..." in the back of my mind.

 

[lowkeyoperations]

Thanks. Room correction does seem that's a healthy first step

REW vs Dirac Live

miniDSP is a leading manufacturer of Digital Audio Signal Processors for the HomeTheater, Hifi, headphone and Automotive market. Join our large community of Audiophiles, Engineers and DIYers using our innovative products.

www.minidsp.com

Dirac Live sounds like the better solution from my initial reading

I'm big on open source software, and I thought REW was, but it's actually freeware

Open Sourcing REW?

Hello, Thanks for developing Room EQ Wizard -- it is an amazingly comprehensive suite of tools to do anything with DRC under the sun. I was wondering if you've ever considered releasing the software under an open source license. I think this has several benefits: Ability for others to...

www.avnirvana.com

Looks like Dirac is another rabbit hole to go down

Dirac Live is quite simple to set up.
I’m using a Mac, so maybe slightly different, but it needs a piece of software to host it as a plugin.

I’m using AudioHijack in my studio and SoundSource in my lounge room (1 license gives you two separate, simultaneous installations!).

The software runs through the measurement process, generally with a Umik calibrated mic. Once the measurements are made you can adjust the “house curve” to suit your preference. I’ve got the full range option, although it seems some just use the below 400hz option.

Definitely check it out

 

[mechkbfan]

I’m using a Mac, so maybe slightly different, but it needs a piece of software to host it as a plugin.

Downloads - Dirac

Download Dirac Live on your computer or mobile and optimize your sound. Available on Android, iOS, Window, and MacOS.

www.dirac.com

No Linux support just yet, but I'm happy to dual boot to Windows for measurements but question is how to get those corrections applied
e.g. if there's a plugin for Linux, that's great. Or do I look at a device that integrates with what I've got (https://www.dirac.com/online-store/)

Also seen people add loudness curves to Dirac Live

Setting Up Dirac Live Loudness Curves on Denon / Marantz AVRs

I go through the process I took to configure my Cinema 50 for Equal-Loudness Curves with Dirac Live. You can do the same with your Denon or Marantz AVR.

simplehomecinema.com

Got 7 pages of Room Correction in Linux to read through in mean time

Room correction - Linux

Hi, I'm on Linux and I'm producing music on Linux. For room correction I used the Sonarworks plugin that was supported by Sonarworks for ~2-3 years now. The measurement part was done with Windows. I bought SW last year and suddenly this year they dropped Linux support. The plugin is still...

www.audiosciencereview.com

So much to learn. Thankfully not in a rush

 

[mechkbfan]

Adding Dirac Live to my existing system as the first step would involve

Buy MiniDSP Flex + UMIK-1 + license

MiniDSP Flex DSP Processor Ideal For Subwoofer Correction + Speaker Tuning

The miniDSP Flex is the third generation of the compact 2-in, 4-out audio processors, featuring a 400MHz Sharc DSP audio processor and a toolbox for subwoofer or multiway speaker tuning.

www.customht.com.au

Reading the manual (https://docs.minidsp.com/product-manuals/flex/index.html) seems I'd go with standard RCA version

First option would be PC via USB to MiniDSP Flex straight to sub & speakers via RCA as they're already powered speakers
Keep DX7 Pro as headphone DAC entirely separate
But then to swap between headphone/speakers, it'd be using my OS

Second option would be PC via USB to DX7 Pro, then digital connection to MiniDSP Flex, which then goes to speakers & sub
Headphones still to DX7 Pro
But then to swap between headphone/speakers, I'd be using the DX7 Pro

Does that seem right?

 

[staticV3]

Second option would be PC via USB to DX7 Pro, then digital connection to MiniDSP Flex, which then goes to speakers & sub
Headphones still to DX7 Pro
But then to swap between headphone/speakers, I'd be using the DX7 Pro

Does that seem right?

The DX7 Pro has no digital output which you could connect to the miniDSP Flex.

Adding Dirac Live to my existing system as the first step would involve

Buy MiniDSP Flex + UMIK-1 + license

MiniDSP Flex DSP Processor Ideal For Subwoofer Correction + Speaker Tuning

The miniDSP Flex is the third generation of the compact 2-in, 4-out audio processors, featuring a 400MHz Sharc DSP audio processor and a toolbox for subwoofer or multiway speaker tuning.

www.customht.com.au

Reading the manual (https://docs.minidsp.com/product-manuals/flex/index.html) seems I'd go with standard RCA version

A DDRC-24 would give you Dirac for 250USD less.

 

[mechkbfan]

The DX7 Pro has no digital output which you could connect to the miniDSP Flex.

True, oversight from me. I confused myself when checking out ADI-2-Pro FS R BE and it's flexible I/O setup

https://manuals.plus/topping/dx7-pro-dac-and-headphone-amp-manual

So yes, lot's of inputs but only XLR & RCA output on the back of the DX7 Pro

A DDRC-24 would give you Dirac for 250USD less.

Thank you. I had been overwhelmed by their product line but often saw Flex shared

Someone was kind enough to put a comparison table

Planning upgrade from MiniDSP DDRC-24 to Flex even SHD

Hello everyone, I'm new for this lovely community!There are few desk setup speakers question to ask you! My current setup is Mac> DDRC24> pair of Genelec 8010A, and I am planning to upgrade to flex or even SHD. 1.Does anyone own those? Please tell me your experience! 2.How's big different...

www.audiosciencereview.com

In saying that, it's only $60 AUD difference from the only Australian store I can find

MiniDSP DDRC-24 DSP Processor with Dirac Live

Meet the highly anticipated "reboot" of the best-selling miniDSP 2x4 digital audio processor - the miniDSP 2x4 HD! This compact device is packed with tried and tested audio processing features including versatile parametric EQ, Butterworth and Linkwitz-Riley crossovers, advanced biquad...

www.customht.com.au

MiniDSP Flex DSP Processor Ideal For Subwoofer Correction + Speaker Tuning

The miniDSP Flex is the third generation of the compact 2-in, 4-out audio processors, featuring a 400MHz Sharc DSP audio processor and a toolbox for subwoofer or multiway speaker tuning.

www.customht.com.au

As well, someone else mentioned they found the presets for adjusting their sub.
I figured this would be an acceptable way to handle my loudness issue.
e.g. preset 1 for low volume, preset 2 for normal, preset 3 for loud

 

[staticV3]

In saying that, it's only $60 AUD difference from the only Australian store I can find

The DDRC-24 includes a Dirac license.
With the Flex, it's an optional 200USD add-on.

 

[mechkbfan]

Much appreciated @staticV3, you've given me some great advice & corrections

Overall I'd like to do things once and do them right, so the extra features of the Flex over the DDRC-24 is worth the additional cost
In saying that, I'm sure I'd be happy with the DDRC-24

I almost started going down rabbit hole of SHD Studio and getting Neumann/Genelec at same time in balanced but decided against it

I'll spend a little bit more time researching other peoples configs with Flex, see what their criticisms, etc. are and sleep on it before ordering tomorrow

Edit:
Flex 8 looking good for simplicity with using headphones as a preset.
I saw this cool post about getting speakers & headphones working with 4 but it's got more equipment than I need
Also don't see a way to make it work with my DX7 Pro or m9xx. So would have to connect them directly to PC still

Minidsp Flex Review (Audio DSP)

Hello everyone, I have a Minidsp Flex unbalanced version. Can I use its analog input for measuring my other DACs' performances, can I make FFT or Jitter analysis? Thanks,

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[mechkbfan]

Thanks again. Ordered MiniDSP HT + UMIK-1 and license once it arrives

Couldn't see any reason to pick 8 over the HT (outside cost)

Won't upgrade to Neumann KH120 II just yet. Play around with room correction, enjoy it for a while, then go for it and appreciate the difference.

 

[mechkbfan]

Minor update for those in future.

Had some extra cash so jumped on some KH120 II's on sale

Neumann KH120 II Monitor Review

Do they know what it is and is it just related to certain batches Difficult to say if they are not prepared to acknowledge the issue.

www.audiosciencereview.com

Quite impressed by the MiniDSP software.