What is it with the KEF Blade (meta)?

[Opal]

I have heard the KEF Blade 1 meta now on several occasions and every time I'm impressed by the clean sound especially the lows.
For me it feels like that they are completely ignoring room modes (which should be physically impossible).
I heard KEF reference 5 meta, Kef R5 meta, KEF LS60 (these come close to the Blades) and Dynaudio Confidence 30 in the same room and with all these other speakers the bass is more boomy (room mode). I'm pretty sure no room correction was applied to any of these speakers (maybe a bit of eq was applied to the LS60).

Anybody have an opinion or explanation why the Blades have this ultra tight lows.

Abit of off topic but how are the confidence 30? Cant find measurements of them, very little discussion on them in ASR. How do the confidence series fares against the reference series?

 

[quattro98]

I haven't seen a lot out there, but did find this.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/dynaudio-confidence-30-loudspeaker-measurements

 

[steve59]

I would like to know if someone has the blade 1 the old one, or heard it somewhere, is the horizontal directivity too narrow? Can you share your experience? The new blade should be slightly wider

Soundstage is large wide and deep. I have noticed some changes when listening to different amps, and I suppose set up and room treatment could have some effect.

 

[NYfan2]

Abit of off topic but how are the confidence 30? Cant find measurements of them, very little discussion on them in ASR. How do the confidence series fares against the reference series?

Ofcourse subjective opinion but I liked the Confidence 30 a bit more then the Reference 3 that I heard, a better comparison would be the reference 5 because these are the same price as the Confidence 30. But like I said I heard the Reference 3 and most noticable difference was the bass that was a bit tighter on the Confidence but I have to say both are really good loudspeakers.
Although if I could spend € 20.000,- on a pair of loudspeakers I would spend 6000 more and get the Blade 2 and be very happy the rest of my life

 

[Pearljam5000]

Ofcourse subjective opinion but I liked the Confidence 30 a bit more then the Reference 3 that I heard, a better comparison would be the reference 5 because these are the same price as the Confidence 30. But like I said I heard the Reference 3 and most noticable difference was the bass that was a bit tighter on the Confidence but I have to say both are really good loudspeakers.
Although if I could spend € 20.000,- on a pair of loudspeakers I would spend 6000 more and get the Blade 2 and be very happy the rest of my life

You'd need to add subs .So why not save some more and get Blade one meta

 

[NYfan2]

You'd need to add subs .So why not save some more and get Blade one meta

Blade one is € 35000,- for a set overhere, that's € 9000,- more then the Blade 2 so that's a big gap.

 

[Ciobi69]

I built 2 18 inch subs that would crash most of the commercial stuff for 2.5k without the amp
The driver is also top class. Bms18n862 95 db efficiency's

 

[steve59]

For music in a stereo system subs aren't needed or even wanted in most conventional built homes. The amount of rattling ductwork is more distracting I got with full 20 hz bass using a sub than any lack of bass from the typical floorstanding 3 ways.

 

[Purité Audio]

Fix the ducting then, bass is fun, personally I want to hear everything on the record.
Keith

 

[steve59]

Fix the ducting then, bass is fun, personally I want to hear everything on the record.
Keith

Have you heard the Blade 1 with solid amps driving them? nothing about the presentation says "more bass please".

 

[MAB]

For music in a stereo system subs aren't needed or even wanted in most conventional built homes. The amount of rattling ductwork is more distracting I got with full 20 hz bass using a sub than any lack of bass from the typical floorstanding 3 ways.

If I had rattling ductwork, my mains would drive me crazy. But I don't have rattling ductwork, if I did it would be #1 priority to fix the rattles, subwoofer or no. The goal of subs isn't crank bass and rattle the ductwork, it's to put the subs in your room where subs make sense acoustically, and have your mains where they make sense acoustically, and end up with smooth bass. Those best place to reproduce bass and the best place to put mains are almost always completely different.

I used to fix customer's rattling houses, we used a beat up Velodyne sub and a tone generator placed it in the center of the room, ran sweeps, identified the rattles and fixed them. I would get a speaker and do some sweeps and fix your ductwork, even if you don't have a sub!

 

[AdamG]

Have you heard the Blade 1 with solid amps driving them? nothing about the presentation says "more bass please".

Hi Steve,

Just to be clear. They are not full range speakers. Try as they might. They are measurably deficient below 60Hz and down 5 dB or more at 35hz. So I’m agreeing with @Purité Audio and would pair them with nice capable Subs. But, I am a Basshead and I typically desire more bass than some. The first part is Objective the latter is my subjective preference. If they sound good to you without a sub. Terrific. That does not change the fact that they are not by design or advertising Full Range Speakers. Some rooms will help them dig deeper and some rooms will hinder room mode gain benefits. To me they scream Style over substance. JMHO.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Hi Steve,

Just to be clear. They are not full range speakers. Try as they might. They are measurably deficient below 60Hz and down 5 dB or more at 35hz. So I’m agreeing with @Purité Audio and would pair them with nice capable Subs. But, I am a Basshead and I typically desire more bass than some. The first part is Objective the latter is my subjective preference. If they sound good to you without a sub. Terrific. That does not change the fact that they are not by design or advertising Full Range Speakers. Some rooms will help them dig deeper and some rooms will hinder room mode gain benefits. To me they scream Style over substance. JMHO.

So it's a fashion speaker and not an audiophile one ?

 

[Purité Audio]

Have you heard the Blade 1 with solid amps driving them? nothing about the presentation says "more bass please".

If the speakers are causing parts of the room to resonate then you need to fix the room, screw the ducts down or damp them, I advise everyone to enjoy completely full-range reproduction but low frequencies can and do excite the room .
Keith

 

[Purité Audio]

So it's a fashion speaker and not an audiophile one ?

It’s a very well designed loudspeaker.
Keith

 

[Ciobi69]

For music in a stereo system subs aren't needed or even wanted in most conventional built homes. The amount of rattling ductwork is more distracting I got with full 20 hz bass using a sub than any lack of bass from the typical floorstanding 3 ways.

when you learn that subs are not only for reproducing better the bass extension but for fixing the room nulls

 

[MAB]

So it's a fashion speaker and not an audiophile one ?

By KEF's own measures, Blade Meta One are not bass-monster speakers, not even close (KEF's anechoic measurements published in their white-paper, I added lines to the graph for clarity):

https://images.salsify.com/image/upload/s--7J5Tne26--/89223f28d213a5abfbad9a9a7ba24e7be864c8cf.pdf

Not a problem, the point isn't to have the most bass, it is to have the best bass. For sure, the Blades will rattle your ductwork if it isn't in good shape, but they are not going to reproduce that lowest octave, it doesn't seem to have been a design objective. Even if they had extension to 20Hz, so many reasons to get subs... The speakers' performance, and the room, and the sound at the listening position will all benefit from having subs.

 

[thewas]

So it's a fashion speaker and not an audiophile one ?

The Blades, similarly to other large well engineered passive hifi louspeakers, are tuned to be not anechoically flat in the bass so that in typical living rooms and placements a relatively neutral bass response is achieved due to the room gain. The other way around, loudspeakers/monitors which are tuned to be anechoically flat in the bass usually need some room EQ as otherwise the bass can be excessive, here for example a 8361 which would have without EQ a 15 dB peak:

Source of above image: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...elec-8361-w371-evolution-or-revolution.14410/

 

[Pearljam5000]

The Blades, similarly to other large well engineered passive hifi louspeakers, are tuned to be not anechoically flat in the bass so that in typical living rooms and placements a relatively neutral bass response is achieved due to the room gain. The other way around, loudspeakers/monitors which are tuned to be anechoically flat in the bass usually need some room EQ as otherwise the bass can be excessive, here for example a 8361:

Source of above image: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...elec-8361-w371-evolution-or-revolution.14410/

Thanks
So for an untreated room
What is better passive or active ?

 

[MAB]

The Blades, similarly to other large well engineered passive hifi louspeakers, are tuned to be not anechoically flat in the bass so that in typical living rooms and placements a relatively neutral bass response is achieved due to the room gain. The other way around, loudspeakers/monitors which are tuned to be anechoically flat in the bass usually need some room EQ as otherwise the bass can be excessive, here for example a 8361:

Source of above image: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...elec-8361-w371-evolution-or-revolution.14410/

This is an excellent point.
8361's are shipped with EQ set to anechoic flat, and the bass right out of the box without EQ is exactly as you describe; excessive. The assumption is the end user will either manually EQ with or use GLM to get the bass performance flat in the room they are used.