Kef LS60 and Room correction?

[dako]

I've been looking to buy and pair of Kef LS60 and the only thing holding me back is the lack of room correction, PEQ and delay to subwoofer.
I've a Kef KF92 subwoofer so there is no inbult PEQ.

To solve this I'm thinking to purchase and miniDSP DDRC-24 to correct the subwoofer and are wondering if there is any other solution?
Solution: Kef LS60 sub out with low pass > miniDSP DDRC-24, Dirac correction, delay setting > Kef KF92. As I will high pass the LS60s with kefs highpass filter Im hoping to reduce chances of bass modes from the Kef LS60 and use the "Wall mode" trim.

Has anyone done this or have another solution?

If any one at Kef sees this, please at minimum include a PEQ and delay setting for the subwoofer.

 

[Vacceo]

I have configured my LS50 WII and KC62 with the KEF APP. The whole system sounds good enough, but I agree I´d prefeer extra parameters to adjust both elements. I think that if if you want that extra adjustment, a mini dsp will do just fine as you can also set the high pass and low pass on the APP.

Since we know KEF designers take a look around these forums, gentlemen, please, give us extra tools to adjust our active setups.

 

[dako]

I have an horrible room mode at 60hz and 100hz whitch is impossible to tame without room correction or a PEQ, as you can see its 13db at 60hz.

 

[Purité Audio]

You could use playback software Roon for example has very sophisticated PEQ.
Keith

 

[terryforsythe]

Has anyone done this or have another solution?

Although not a simple solution, I have room correction when streaming using Logitech Media Server (LMS) with the "Squeeze DSP" plugin. I run LMS on my NAS, which is where I have my music library stored, and use it to stream those FLAC files.

LMS also has plugins for Tidal, Spotify and Pandora, but they are a little clunky. When using Tidal I usually just stream from the Tidal Connect app and forego the room correction.

Squeeze DSP provides parametric EQs. In addition, you can load a FIR file and use that for room correction, which is what I did. I generated the FIR file using REW.

If you are interested in that, let me know and I will provide some useful tips to help.

 

[Open Mind Audio]

You could use playback software Roon for example has very sophisticated PEQ.
Keith

This works for me with my LS60s. I always listen through Roon and set their EQ (when I used it, which is not always). My wife prefers Spotify but also doesn't give a damn about room correction.

 

[GA16SE]

I've been looking to buy and pair of Kef LS60 and the only thing holding me back is the lack of room correction, PEQ and delay to subwoofer.
I've a Kef KF92 subwoofer so there is no inbult PEQ.

To solve this I'm thinking to purchase and miniDSP DDRC-24 to correct the subwoofer and are wondering if there is any other solution?
Solution: Kef LS60 sub out with low pass > miniDSP DDRC-24, Dirac correction, delay setting > Kef KF92. As I will high pass the LS60s with kefs highpass filter Im hoping to reduce chances of bass modes from the Kef LS60 and use the "Wall mode" trim.

Has anyone done this or have another solution?

If any one at Kef sees this, please at minimum include a PEQ and delay setting for the subwoofer.

By the way of DDRC-24, another option might be subwoofer integration with the DDRC-24 as shown in the application note

2.1 Sub integration + Dirac

miniDSP is a leading manufacturer of Digital Audio Signal Processors for the HomeTheater, Hifi, headphone and Automotive market. Join our large community of Audiophiles, Engineers and DIYers using our innovative products.

www.minidsp.com

I’m aware that there’s a disadvantage when using the DDRC-24 in conjunction with KEF LS60 speakers. As DDRC-24 only has analogue outputs, the audio signal is converted by the inner ADC of KEF LS60. To keep an only digital signal path, another miniDSP device is needed, e.g., SHD or SHD Studio.

 

[kemmler3D]

I've been looking to buy and pair of Kef LS60 and the only thing holding me back is the lack of room correction, PEQ and delay to subwoofer.
I've a Kef KF92 subwoofer so there is no inbult PEQ.

To solve this I'm thinking to purchase and miniDSP DDRC-24 to correct the subwoofer and are wondering if there is any other solution?
Solution: Kef LS60 sub out with low pass > miniDSP DDRC-24, Dirac correction, delay setting > Kef KF92. As I will high pass the LS60s with kefs highpass filter Im hoping to reduce chances of bass modes from the Kef LS60 and use the "Wall mode" trim.

Has anyone done this or have another solution?

If any one at Kef sees this, please at minimum include a PEQ and delay setting for the subwoofer.

LS60 + KC62s here. My personal solution is to get things close in the KEF Connect app, and then do correction of the whole system on a $100 mini-PC. Optical in/out goes to the PC, correct with EQ in EQAPO, and on to the LS60, with the subs connected wirelessly to the LS60s. I won't have delay settings for the subs separately, which is probably the weakness of that, but you can combine all of the speakers to smooth out the modes.

 

[NYfan2]

Or you use a MiniDSP DDRC-22D for the room correction, then you don't have an extra A-D conversion, use the sub out on the LS60 for the subwoofer.

I asked the question about PEQ to a KEF representative, his advice was to use Roon. Also KEF thinks that for the average user the settings in the app are enough, PEQ is on another level for the average user.

 

[Mnyb]

room correction PEQ and proper bass management , where's the option for that

 

[Mnyb]

LS60 + KC62s here. My personal solution is to get things close in the KEF Connect app, and then do correction of the whole system on a $100 mini-PC. Optical in/out goes to the PC, correct with EQ in EQAPO, and on to the LS60, with the subs connected wirelessly to the LS60s. I won't have delay settings for the subs separately, which is probably the weakness of that, but you can combine all of the speakers to smooth out the modes.

Soo if you place a low latency sub close to the speakers , you can manage it good enough with an external solution ?

 

[kemmler3D]

Soo if you place a low latency sub close to the speakers , you can manage it good enough with an external solution ?

"good enough" is up to you, but I think it should be fine. My room is not huge though, so I don't need delays or anything. One overall EQ should work. Haven't had a chance to actually set this up yet, it's just my current plan. I'll post results once I get around to it.

 

[Mnyb]

"good enough" is up to you, but I think it should be fine. My room is not huge though, so I don't need delays or anything. One overall EQ should work. Haven't had a chance to actually set this up yet, it's just my current plan. I'll post results once I get around to it.

thankyou it would be very interesting to hear about it .

I’m still a bit baffled ( pun intended ) by kefs decision to build one of the most well thought out speakers i ever heard off and then just hack the sub integration ?

 

[Purité Audio]

Sub integration is included with the KEF ‘connect’ app,

 

[kemmler3D]

kefs decision to build one of the most well thought out speakers i ever heard off and then just hack the sub integration ?

The sub integration in the app is pretty good compared to any set of "dumb" speakers you might get. There are options for polarity, gain, low and highpass... not terrible.

IMO the lack of PEQ and advanced sub integration probably has to do with customer support. How would the room measurements get done? Will they ship a mic with the LS60s? What about all the people who don't own a mic stand and have no clue how to measure? They will 99% make the sound worse, not better.

Think about the brands that actually support full room correction... MiniDSP, which fully specializes in this stuff, and high-end AVRs that either automate the process, (Sonos also fits this description) or that are intended to be handled by professional installers.

A feature that requires real knowledge or expertise to use is not one they're going to want to support, so it's also not one they're going to build in as a high priority. It would have to be buried / hidden, in which case you have to ask yourself why you're building the feature at all?

It could even be the case that KEF wanted to build such a feature, and the retailers (like Crutchfield or Best Buy) asked them not to. After all, is Best Buy prepared to answer questions about how to correct room modes? Because they would be getting those questions, trust me.

 

[Purité Audio]

Wouldn’t it be interesting to know if that were really the case, I am sure I have mentioned how the U.K. Kii distributor didn’t mention to many of his retailers that Kiis now had PEQ for those exact reasons.
Keith

 

[kemmler3D]

Wouldn’t it be interesting to know if that were really the case, I am sure I have mentioned how the U.K. Kii distributor didn’t mention to many of his retailers that Kiis now had PEQ for those exact reasons.
Keith

At my old company, we built a 5-band graphic EQ into a portable speaker. It was appreciated by a lot of our customers with nostalgia for those 90s bookshelf systems with lots of blinking lights, and since it wasn't for correcting the sound so much as "seasoning to taste" it wasn't a big support burden for us.

However, when units would come in for service, the EQ settings (if they had been changed) were very often what I'd call stupid. Like all bands maxed out, or the bass maxed out and everything else at minimum.

People trying to improve sound with EQ with no prior experience are mostly doing it by chance, and the outcomes are what you'd expect. I imagine KEF and everyone else in the industry thinking about shipping EQ realizes this... when something is supposed to be truly hi-fi, (LS60) rather than just something you adjust for the hell of it (EQ in the Spotify app) I can understand not wanting to offer it.

More than that, I can understand not wanting to answer questions about it, or take returns because of it.

 

[Purité Audio]

You can see the exact same pattern now that the Eversolo streamers have PEQ, customers asking what is a ‘good’ EQ to add!
Keith

 

[Mnyb]

The sub integration in the app is pretty good compared to any set of "dumb" speakers you might get. There are options for polarity, gain, low and highpass... not terrible.

IMO the lack of PEQ and advanced sub integration probably has to do with customer support. How would the room measurements get done? Will they ship a mic with the LS60s? What about all the people who don't own a mic stand and have no clue how to measure? They will 99% make the sound worse, not better.

Think about the brands that actually support full room correction... MiniDSP, which fully specializes in this stuff, and high-end AVRs that either automate the process, (Sonos also fits this description) or that are intended to be handled by professional installers.

A feature that requires real knowledge or expertise to use is not one they're going to want to support, so it's also not one they're going to build in as a high priority. It would have to be buried / hidden, in which case you have to ask yourself why you're building the feature at all?

It could even be the case that KEF wanted to build such a feature, and the retailers (like Crutchfield or Best Buy) asked them not to. After all, is Best Buy prepared to answer questions about how to correct room modes? Because they would be getting those questions, trust me.

If they just added distance and delay/settings ? I forse problems integrating with subs that have quite a processing delay like arendals that have 8ms probably dues the peq built into thier sub

 

[Ron Texas]

One of the advantages of the LS60 is they really don't need subs.