Tekton M-Lore Speaker Review

[Eric Alexander]

"Botched measurements - the loudspeaker was tested on the tweeter axis and the loudspeaker was designed and intended for the listener to be directly on-axis to the 8" driver."

Nothing is botched. In far field listening, the acoustic axis doesn't make much difference. Besides, I am hoping you are not expecting listener ears to be locked in vise on the driver axis. It would also be unusual for the woofer to be reference axis given the fact that most of what it plays is omnidirectional.

I disagree. Anyone seated inside 15 feet should be listening to this model directly on-axis with the 8" driver.

 

[Eric Alexander]

So don't measure it against a well-developed set of standards? There are other speakers in the price range that meet these standards better, and customers who agree with these standards can save their money.

Would you like me to serve you up a speaker that would make you drool and slobber? Provide me with ten bullet point attributes of what your perfect speaker must possess and what the cost ($$$) needs to be.

 

[voodooless]

I disagree. Anyone seated inside 15 feet should be listening to this model directly on-axis with the 8" driver.

This says it doesn’t matter very much:

It also says that a bit higher than tweeter level is indeed optimal, so you could be correct on that. You can’t exactly call this a botched measurement though.

 

[_thelaughingman]

Furthermore, the Mini Lore is a $375 (delivered) loudspeaker hand-built in the USA. Can we see it for what it is? It's simply a fun loudspeaker for many people; let's try to see the Mini Lore for what it is.

I hate to say it but it sounds like a cop out that the Mini Lore at $375 should sound like an incongruous mess cuz they're cheap and maybe your more expensive speakers may sound better. Furthermore do you intend to say that the Mini Lore's are targeted for first time HiFi speaker buyers or beginners? It's a disservice to anybody stepping into this hobby to buy something that's not intended by its manufacturer to be their best product?

 

[Deleted member 21219]

Sound is subjective ...

No, sound is not subjective. Emotion is subjective. Preference is subjective. Enjoyment is subjective. But sound is not subjective. It can (and is) measured objectively with instruments, and compared to our ears, those are instruments of great precision.

One thing I don't quite understand. Given that there are two different sorts of listeners in the market (those who desire accuracy and those who don't care) and that there are also two different products on the market (those that make attempts at accuracy and those that do not), I can see that you are probably correct when you say that this speaker is a "fun" speaker ... and nothing more. That's acceptable to me (and probably some others) ... as long as there is no greater pretension. (IOW, as long as the product does not pretend to be something that it manifestly is not.)

Given that this is ASR, and given that the goal is accurate reproduction, I would expect ANY speaker, whether designed by one of our members here or designed by someone else, to suffer the same fate in a review if it measured the same as yours did. So no one is picking on you unfairly, and no one is denying your right to design and market a "fun" speaker.

But you must realize that you can't eat your cake and have it, too.

So ... why are you unhappy? What did you expect out of the review that it did not deliver?

Jim

 

[ahofer]

Would you like me to serve you up a speaker that would make you drool and slobber? Provide me with ten bullet point attributes of what your perfect speaker must possess and what the cost ($$$) needs to be.

So now you are a custom speaker maker? The mostly shared standards on this site are pretty well-developed. And I don't see any point in the speaker maker doing custom EQ, which is why I asked you the question above. However, let me take a shot at your proposal:

-Flat anechoic FR from 30Hz to 20KHz
-even directivity through the frequency range, as evidenced by a uniformly ascending sound power in a CEA 2034 and strictly uniform dispersion across 50-60 degrees (vertical and Horizontal), then dropping off steeply.
-Distortion below "strict" audibility thresholds (ie -100db or so) across the frequency range at 105db SPL and below (OK, we can accept a bit more at lower frequencies)
-No compression at 105db SPL or below relative to lower volumes
-less than $2000 pair
-(added) since we haven't hit 10 points yet, how about dynamic loudness, aka an output-appropriate Fletcher-Munson adjustment

IOW, better than a Genelec 8361 (particularly in compression and low end directivity) for substantially less. Unless I have missed something, you would absolutely impress the ASR community. If you are certain of your abilities have at it. Honestly if you made all those respective measures better than a Revel f228be at that price point you would still have top honors around here.

I don't really drool and slobber much.

 

[amirm]

I disagree. Anyone seated inside 15 feet should be listening to this model directly on-axis with the 8" driver.

Why?

 

[CleanSound]

I hate to say it but it sounds like a cop out that the Mini Lore at $375 should sound like an incongruous mess cuz they're cheap and maybe your more expensive speakers may sound better. Furthermore do you intend to say that the Mini Lore's are targeted for first time HiFi speaker buyers or beginners? It's a disservice to anybody stepping into this hobby to buy something that's not intended by its manufacturer to be their best product?

@Eric Alexander send in one of your more critically acclaimed speakers for review as you stated that you are open to do.

Have a sit down one-on-one discussion with Amir or Erin to discuss your design philosophies including that circular, moving mass array stuff you have patented.

Less taking and more action, so let's make it happen.

 

[CleanSound]

I can see that you are probably correct when you say that this speaker is a "fun" speaker ... and nothing more. That's acceptable to me (and probably some others) ... as long as there is no greater pretension. (IOW, as long as the product does not pretend to be something that it manifestly is not.)

So no one is picking on you unfairly, and no one is denying your right to design and market a "fun" speaker.

My concern is that I so happen to come across one of his videos on YouTube where he talked about his patent on that circular mid-range array, and it was very ambiguous and if I am honest, smells kind of fishy, so I Google search for this patent and read it. Boy, red flags of BS lit up.

As such, I am left believing all of his speakers are just Frankensteined stitched together with make believe physics. I recommend all potential Tekton customers (and doubters) to read that patent first.

Hence I would appreciate him having a detailed discussion about his design philosophy and decisions with someone like Amir or Erin.

 

[Deleted member 21219]

My concern is that I so happen to come across one of his videos on YouTube where he talked about his patent on that circular mid-range array, and it was very ambiguous and if I am honest, smells kind of fishy, so I Google search for this patent and read it. Boy, red flags of BS lit up.

As such, I am left believing all of his speakers are just Frankensteined stitched together with make believe physics. I recommend all potential Tekton customers (and doubters) to read that patent first.

Hence I would appreciate him having a detailed discussion about his design philosophy and decisions with someone like Amir or Erin.

Yes, I've heard a lot of comment on that array. However, this particular speaker is not one that makes use of that array. No matter what I or anyone else thinks about the patent, I wanted to restrict my post to the speaker under review here.

If Mr. Alexander bases this design on accuracy, then it will be judged on accuracy. If it is based on fun, seeing as he said ...

Can we see it for what it is? It's simply a fun loudspeaker for many people ...

then I don't understand why he is upset. But like I said; he can't eat his cake and have it, too. It's either one ... or the other.

Jim

 

[ahofer]

If Mr. Alexander bases this design on accuracy, then it will be judged on accuracy.

He seems to think the perfect measuring speaker (from an 'accuracy' point of view) is easily cooked up in his simulation software and produced at a low price point. That sounds like an outlandish claim to me. Speaker design to Toole/Olive standards is not as simple as EQ. I'm very curious to see what he comes back with here.

 

[CleanSound]

Yes, I've heard a lot of comment on that array. However, this particular speaker is not one that makes use of that array. No matter what I or anyone else thinks about the patent, I wanted to restrict my post to the speaker under review here.

If Mr. Alexander bases this design on accuracy, then it will be judged on accuracy. If it is based on fun, seeing as he said ...



then I don't understand why he is upset. But like I said; he can't eat his cake and have it, too. It's either one ... or the other.

Jim

Very fair.

But I guess my point is, if you see someone selling bottled "spring water" filled with tap water then turns around and sells you a cake. Would you not be suspicious of that cake even though he is not selling you the bottled "spring water?"

 

[Deleted member 21219]

But I guess my point is, if you see someone selling bottled "spring water" filled with tap water then turns around and sells you a cake. Would you not be suspicious of that cake even though he is not selling you the bottled "spring water?"

I can see your point.

Jim

 

[thewas]

This says it doesn’t matter very much:
View attachment 348837
It also says that a bit higher than tweeter level is indeed optimal, so you could be correct on that. You can’t exactly call this a botched measurement though.

A better representation for such are the individual vertical measurements, as it can be seen at +10° not many flaws disappear compared to on-axis, just the presence region gets attenuated a bit:

Source of above plot: https://www.spinorama.org/speakers/Tekton M-Lore/ASR/index_asr.html

 

[Mojo Warrior]

I am expecting the members of the forum to extend courtesy to Mr Alexander. He has been courteous in voluntarily joining the discussion on this forum. He is a successful speaker designer and has shared his opinions. We have an obligation to keep the discussion civil. A challenge was accepted by Mr. Alexander, now we should wait to see the outcome of the challenge that was submitted by one of our members. I would be very disappointed to watch this thread devolve into a sycophantic rant similar to other so called audiophile forums.

 

[CleanSound]

I am expecting the members of the forum to extend courtesy to Mr Alexander. He has been courteous in voluntarily joining the discussion on this forum. He is a successful speaker designer and has shared his opinions. We have an obligation to keep the discussion civil. A challenge was accepted by Mr. Alexander, now we should wait to see the outcome of the challenge that was submitted by one of our members. I would be very disappointed to watch this thread devolve into a sycophantic rant similar to other so called audiophile forums.

Are you referring to my "challenge" issued to Mr. Alexander to (1) send in a pair of his critically acclaimed speakers for review, since the Lore is a design within a certain cost limitation (2) have an one-on-one technical discussion on Tekton's design theories with either Amir or Erin?

If that is what you are referring to, he did say he is "open" to it. But that's just talk right now and talk is cheap. . .hence, I am eagerly waiting for such "challenge" (I prefer to call it further investigation and design analysis/explanation) to occur.

 

[ahofer]

I am expecting the members of the forum to extend courtesy to Mr Alexander. He has been courteous in voluntarily joining the discussion on this forum. He is a successful speaker designer and has shared his opinions. We have an obligation to keep the discussion civil. A challenge was accepted by Mr. Alexander, now we should wait to see the outcome of the challenge that was submitted by one of our members. I would be very disappointed to watch this thread devolve into a sycophantic rant similar to other so called audiophile forums.

Is that prophylactic? I don’t see any devolution yet.

At any rate, he made the challenge. I just took a stab at accepting it (in a way that would guarantee at least a niche audience, if he could meet it)

 

[CleanSound]

Is that prophylactic? I don’t see any devolution yet.

At any rate, he made the challenge. I just took a stab at accepting it (in a way that would guarantee at least a niche audience, if he could meet it)

Oh that "challenge" of building a speaker to ahofer's spec.

Well, that's not that useful, because it's forward looking. There are probably thousands of pairs of Tekton speakers in the wild right now, according to Mr. Alexander, he's won, what? 19 best speaker awards now on the existing/past product line up?

So we need to know (1) the performance of the existing product line up, it doesn't have to a flat FR as Mr. Alexander claims that flat is not audiophile grade, but we want to know directivity, resonance, impedance, etc etc. (2) indirectly confirm or expose the credibility of those reviewers who gave it the best speaker awards, that is very important as they are influencers (3) the validity of Mr. Alexander's design theory, such as what is he basing the idea that flat FR is not audiophile grade and the science of such overtone/moving mass that warrants the use of circular tweeter aray for mid-range.

If everything Mr. Alexander claims holds water, then it's a win for the audiophile community, since we would have learn something new.

Mr. Alexander say he is "open" to it. I am eagerly looking forward to it.

 

[Eric Alexander]

The positions of the tweeter mid arrays in this one don't make really sense to me, as they could be placed quite closer to the middle high tweeter, now they unnecessarily imitate the positions of a normal MTM which doesn't fulfill the distances needed for a real D'Appolito.

Take a closer look... it pivots with a ball screw mechanism allowing the array to be directed/focused to the listening position.

 

[Eric Alexander]

Is that Bespoke Series made of sheet metal construction? That baby must resonate like a wash machine from the 1960s.