Should I exchange my Philharmonic Audio HTs for Genelec 8361a's?

[jdg78]

I know it does not matter for sound, but next to the HT the Genelec looks really, really fugly. Extra fug by contrast. They might bring joy to my ears, but they offend my eyes.

Same. I would love to hear these someday, but I could personally never live with the aesthetics. Obviously this is all totally subjective and context specific, but I have a small/medium size pair of Genelec monitors in my living room system (G Three/8030c) and at that size I find they look rather stylish and fun (IMO). But when blown up to the scale of the 8361 the effect is almost comical...

I also would never put these in my living room. The good news is I have another pair of Philharmonic Audio HT towers in my living room (below.) But these 8361a'a are in my office, where only I see them. I don't hate the look for a private office. The harder part is finding a good stand for them.

Gotcha, makes sense. Well, that is quite the setup for an office system - you certainly don't mess around!

 

[Mort]

How nice not to have to worry about the aesthetic aspect...
Are the speaker stands listed by Genelec no good?

They are somewhat expensive ($750), boring as all hell and would put the acoustic axis above ear height. (33" for my LP).

Subjective impressions are good too

I'll say more after a few more days. My review headline is that the Genelec is less of an upgrade than I expected, compared to the HTs. For the retail price difference ($4.5k vs $10k) and the legendary quality of this manufacturer I expected more. That said it's also the finest sounding speaker I've ever heard, and one could spend way more and get way less. The sound quality itself is finely detailed and it's balanced full range, not just hot or boomy. The small price for that is the soundstage is narrower compared to the HTs and I do miss that.

 

[Esprit]

They are somewhat expensive ($750), boring as all hell and would put the acoustic axis above ear height. (33" for my LP).

They are height adjustable, right?
Aside from the price, you can tilt the Genelecs towards you (my Adams are on stands higher than the couch, but tilting them forward works fine and they are NOT coaxial).

 

[holdingpants01]

They are somewhat expensive ($750), boring as all hell and would put the acoustic axis above ear height. (33" for my LP).
View attachment 439265


I'll say more after a few more days. My review headline is that the Genelec is less of an upgrade than I expected, compared to the HTs. For the retail price difference ($4.5k vs $10k) and the legendary quality of this manufacturer I expected more. That said it's also the finest sounding speaker I've ever heard, and one could spend way more and get way less. The sound quality itself is finely detailed and it's balanced full range, not just hot or boomy. The small price for that is the soundstage is narrower compared to the HTs and I do miss that.

You can put them sideways and it would lower the twitter quite a bit. Price difference is less than that if you account for an amplifier. At this level diminishing returns come into play, in a typical room and good enough speakers you won't gain much if anything going with more expensive and technically better equipment, hence my first post was to keep HTs. As far as comparisons go it mostly shows how good HTs are

 

[PatriceA]

I do have 8361s on same stands as shown above (cables can run inside the tube ). They have the additional and major advantage (on top of height adjustment) of improved bass diffusion downwards and upwards.

 

[JeremyFife]

Aesthetics (personal): I love the look of philharmonics usually but there's a lot going on with these - too many drivers and things - and I'm surprised how good the Genelecs look in your setting.

Totally subjective, very personal, absolutely no use to you ... I'd have a hard time choosing!

Enjoy

 

[holdingpants01]

actually 8361A in white could fit the room really well considering they look like stormtrooper equipment anyway, I would say better than HTs

 

[Mort]

That's a great photo, ha. It looks like the speaker a stormtrooper would be issued. I definitely would get white if I were buying new.

 

[Mort]

They are height adjustable, right?

Yes but on the shortest setting it will be too high.

You can put them sideways, and it would lower the twitter quite a bit.

Yes. It changes the acoustic axis by 5" (From 12" to 7"). They are 2 feet wide, so they will really take up space like that, not sure it'll work.




Does GLM really not let you adjust the target curve much? All my curves are too flat with GLM.

 

[holdingpants01]

Does GLM really not let you adjust the target curve much? All my curves are too flat with GLM.

Did you use Sound Character Profiler utility? It allows for 3dB boost with a shelf, but the cuts aren't limited, so you can effectively boost lows as much as you want by cutting from the other side

 

[Mort]

Did you use Sound Character Profiler utility? It allows for 3dB boost with a shelf, but the cuts aren't limited, so you can effectively boost lows as much as you want by cutting from the other side

Yes, but it's not the same curve because it's boosting the whole mid-region that way. It's a good hack, but I expect a full customizable curve from Genelec.

 

[holdingpants01]

Yes, but it's not the same curve because it's boosting the whole mid-region that way. It's a good hack, but I expect a full customizable curve from Genelec.

You can lower the top frequency to as low as you like and have no boost in the midrange, but that's already outside of their purpose, as "fully customizable curve" is not really needed in a studio. Automatic EQ part of GLM is just there to tame the room peaks, shelves are to adjust the extremes to a taste, it's pretty basic

 

[Mort]

Here are some impressions and my playlist. It's currently a toss-up but slightly leaning away from the 8361a.

With the Philharmonic HTs, I perceive and prefer the wider soundstage and a feeling that the sound is more ‘live’, moving and atmospheric. To me the sound is lighter, a bit spread out and pleasantly diffused. It improved some older, shit-production, hardcore-punk recordings. The HT’s have energy that is missing in the Genelec monitors.

What I am hearing is consistent with a wide directivity tweeter like the one on the HT Tower. Early reflections? Whatever it is, I like the effect a lot. My wife also consistently preferred HTs, which we have been using as our primary home system. (We may have developed a preference for the sound of the HT Towers.)

If there are negatives, the HT sound was a bit thinner and sometimes vocals feel a little recessed compared to the Genelecs. I also think it is harder to find an ideal speaker placement with the HTs. The perfect sweet spot is small.

By comparison, the Genelecs were much less fussy to position but had a somewhat smaller soundstage and a more refined presentation. The stereo center was consistently more focused and identifiable, which often made vocals feel ‘in-room’ and closer. The overall presentation felt very smooth and controlled but not pressured or closed like the way some describe monitors.

Clarity seemed better on the Genelec. I felt like I could more easily pick out details of instruments, locations and individual sounds in the music with the 8361a’s. I liked it a lot. That might be the necessary trade-off for the loss of the big soundstage of the HT’s.

This smaller soundstage does not make the sound feel small at all, in fact the room feels ‘fuller’ despite the 8361a’s narrower directivity. I felt more enveloped. I thought it might just spl, so I took 3db off the Genelecs and it was still there.

As far as power, they are both in the same range i.e. more than I need. I got the Genelec protection light to come on playing Billie Eilish ‘Bad Guy’ around 100db 6 feet (with ear protection.) The double 6.5” Purifi woofer on the HTs are rated 90db and they get loud. On them, my spl meter says 100-105db at same distance (with ear protection) from a ncx500 and I don’t hear any clipping. My sense is the Genelecs had some more to go but I didn’t go further. If I had to, I would say the Genelec sounded better (more balanced, effortless) at that high volume. Not that it matters.

 

[Behrelec 37]

I have had 1237a monitors in my living room for two years now,I also have Genelec's 8260a and 8340 small monitors, and the old 7071a subwoofer is still in use.I am especially super happy in my small living room listening to a lot of different types of music from all these models here in Finland. But these master series speakers are something absolutely beautiful when they sound when the Glm settings are fine-tuned.I would never change/buy 8361 speakers again and swap these 1237a speakers for these. Because the deep purity and authenticity of the layers of live sound reproduction is the power and pleasure of hearing these 1237a models is an incredibly wonderful experience every single day. And even better, when combined with the Genelec subwoofer, the big sound size becomes even bigger and more fulfilling.

 

[Behrelec 37]

My room now. Behrelec 37. Here in Finland.

 

[JustJones]

You can lower the top frequency to as low as you like and have no boost in the midrange, but that's already outside of their purpose, as "fully customizable curve" is not really needed in a studio. Automatic EQ part of GLM is just there to tame the room peaks, shelves are to adjust the extremes to a taste, it's pretty basic

View attachment 439450

Change the Profiler Preset to None instead of Manual and you have more control but you will need to set it for each monitor as it doesn't do it globally when set to None.

 

[ckernel8]

My room now. Behrelec 37. Here in Finland.

I assume as a Finn you get 1237As for free

 

[jonfitch]

Here are some impressions and my playlist. It's currently a toss-up but slightly leaning away from the 8361a.

With the Philharmonic HTs, I perceive and prefer the wider soundstage and a feeling that the sound is more ‘live’, moving and atmospheric. To me the sound is lighter, a bit spread out and pleasantly diffused. It improved some older, shit-production, hardcore-punk recordings. The HT’s have energy that is missing in the Genelec monitors.

What I am hearing is consistent with a wide directivity tweeter like the one on the HT Tower. Early reflections? Whatever it is, I like the effect a lot. My wife also consistently preferred HTs, which we have been using as our primary home system. (We may have developed a preference for the sound of the HT Towers.)

If there are negatives, the HT sound was a bit thinner and sometimes vocals feel a little recessed compared to the Genelecs. I also think it is harder to find an ideal speaker placement with the HTs. The perfect sweet spot is small.

By comparison, the Genelecs were much less fussy to position but had a somewhat smaller soundstage and a more refined presentation. The stereo center was consistently more focused and identifiable, which often made vocals feel ‘in-room’ and closer. The overall presentation felt very smooth and controlled but not pressured or closed like the way some describe monitors.

Clarity seemed better on the Genelec. I felt like I could more easily pick out details of instruments, locations and individual sounds in the music with the 8361a’s. I liked it a lot. That might be the necessary trade-off for the loss of the big soundstage of the HT’s.

This smaller soundstage does not make the sound feel small at all, in fact the room feels ‘fuller’ despite the 8361a’s narrower directivity. I felt more enveloped. I thought it might just spl, so I took 3db off the Genelecs and it was still there.

As far as power, they are both in the same range i.e. more than I need. I got the Genelec protection light to come on playing Billie Eilish ‘Bad Guy’ around 100db 6 feet (with ear protection.) The double 6.5” Purifi woofer on the HTs are rated 90db and they get loud. On them, my spl meter says 100-105db at same distance (with ear protection) from a ncx500 and I don’t hear any clipping. My sense is the Genelecs had some more to go but I didn’t go further. If I had to, I would say the Genelec sounded better (more balanced, effortless) at that high volume. Not that it matters.

View attachment 439523

From the horizontal directivity measurements on Audioholics it doesn't look like the dispersion width is really much different compared to the Philharmonic HT approximately 70 degrees or so. I've listened to the Genelecs (8341, 8331) against many speakers with 40-50 degree horizontal dispersion and the Genelecs comparatively also sounded like they had "no soundstage" was the feedback I got from other people who participated in the listening, so the causal factor is not how wide the dispersion is.

I'm pretty sure this is a psychoacoustic effect that's caused by a bump in the power response between 500-800hz range on the Genelec the Ones, it's caused by wider dispersion in this range and extra energy in this frequency range that's causing it sound like the performance is right in front of you instead of sitting somewhere further back because it's making percussion instruments sound louder than normal. I did find EQing this range down a bit helping and making the soundstage seem bigger. Just a FYI.

 

[Behrelec 37]

ckernel8.

Not true. I have paid for every single Genelec I have had out of my own pocket. Of course, through the dealer here in southern Finland, I have bargained the price down a bit every time I have made a deal.

I do not work in studios and I do not do any music, or any work or hobby that is related to music or movies. or games. I only enjoy the digital sound of music and movies.

 

[Multicore]

Genelec should get creative with the looks. Hire a few painters to give some big The Ones a complete makeover. They could be classy, classical, groovy, Mondrian, waifu, impressionist, whatever they like ... Make a big thing of it on the web site and other marketing channels. Sell some as unique one-off The Ones but also a few YouTubes explaining techniques for custom paint jobs that don't void the warranty.

Those big frontal wave guides are just asking for it, don't you think?

Maybe you or someone else in the house would enjoy, for example, something like the Wedgewood Wild Strawberry design.