Should I exchange my Philharmonic Audio HTs for Genelec 8361a's?

[Behrelec 37]

 

[berjine]

Perfect setup for a back massage

 

[Sam Ash]

I'm sure they sound really good, enough to make up for the less than ideal aesthetics. Having said that, I do like the look of the ONE family. The subs have a modern industrial feel to them too.

A nice brass finish to those monsters would qualify them as props for the next Mad Max movie.

 

[Mort]

I do appreciate REW as a tool, are you using it in conjunction with a MiniDSP?

I am yes. i think it's always good to independently test the room and auto-dsp results.

I would also sometimes use rew to EQ a non-continuous section. Diraclive curtains are great but you can't have gaps.

 

[Mort]

I stopped A/B testing for a bit. There are great qualities of the 8361a that I overlooked because the directivity difference is so apparent in a quick A/B test that it just dominates all thinking. So I put the Philharmonic Audio HTs away for a while and spent the weekend listening only to the Genelec 8361a's.

It's been a very positive experience:

• There is a smoothness to these at almost any volume that impresses me.
• The bass is really beautiful and ample.
• Clarity makes listening more enjoyable and fun.

Another improvement is that the monitors are less sensitive and reactive to room placement. It's allowed me to reclaim some space (plus no subwoofers) in my small room, which I like.

I got them on digital fed straight from Wiim coax spdif- cute trick. Now I'm all GLM - no analog DiracLive or MiniDsp DAC anymore. Thanks to @holdingpants01 hack, I had better success with GLM room correction and can now get close to the target curve I liked in DiractLive (but not quite. ) I can live with it. The GRADE report was actually pretty helpful.

 

[kma100]

This is a good approach. I got the following advice which was very helpful in evaluating speakers:

"It is very important to spend a significant amount of time with either speaker without simply switching back and forth. You can not get any type of emotional involvement in this manner. My recommendation is to spend a full week listening to the speaker without doing any speaker switching. Listen to your favorite music and try not to focus so much on which one "sounds" better - but focus more on how you feel while listening to them. Close your eyes - can you picture where individual instruments are coming from? Take some notes on how you feel etc.."

As you are finding out, the back-and-forth can be jarring.

 

[Ilkless]

One small comment: the Philharmonic HTs are well-executed enough as a package -- especially after room correction -- that you should not be unduly concerned or self-conscious that you prefer them in your setup and room over the 8361A. Because I do know the pressure to conform can be strong

 

[Pearljam5000]

This is a good approach. I got the following advice which was very helpful in evaluating speakers:

"It is very important to spend a significant amount of time with either speaker without simply switching back and forth. You can not get any type of emotional involvement in this manner. My recommendation is to spend a full week listening to the speaker without doing any speaker switching. Listen to your favorite music and try not to focus so much on which one "sounds" better - but focus more on how you feel while listening to them. Close your eyes - can you picture where individual instruments are coming from? Take some notes on how you feel etc.."

As you are finding out, the back-and-forth can be jarring.

A speaker to me is like a woman
It doesn't take long to know if there's chemistry or not

 

[jonfitch]

Glm is capable of millions of different sound images and sound changes. Most of the people in the audio industry, 98 percent of them, really don't realize/and are super-aware as adults that GLM is a super versatile sound editing device, as if you walk through millions of mirrors in a hall of mirrors and you choose the mirror you like best from which the sound image is formed for yourself.

There is no limit to the level of saturation in terms of sound comfort because you can even copy the sound stage of other audio speaker manufacturers for yourself, if you are smart and are looking for the raw truth. Of course, this requires your good memory and the seriousness of changing the glm software to manipulate the sound image/rhythm/volume to your advantage. Q/gain and hz are symbio and with each modification the emphasis on the rhythm changes and thus the image in the mirror changes depending on how many steps you take?

The sound can also change in the other direction, i.e. become tense and tense, which is not a good thing.
Only by manipulating the sound can you get a satisfactory result if the automatic calibration is not to your liking.

Isn't GLM just based off of REW?

 

[Behrelec 37]

Jonfitch

How would I know?I'm just a big music/movie consumer who has been using glm software for my own benefit in my living room/bedroom for many years by manipulating the software manually/by ear, which any glm owner can do as well. Ask the people at genelec who work for that company. I have nothing to do with that company.

 

[BenB]

This is a good approach. I got the following advice which was very helpful in evaluating speakers:

"It is very important to spend a significant amount of time with either speaker without simply switching back and forth. You can not get any type of emotional involvement in this manner. My recommendation is to spend a full week listening to the speaker without doing any speaker switching. Listen to your favorite music and try not to focus so much on which one "sounds" better - but focus more on how you feel while listening to them. Close your eyes - can you picture where individual instruments are coming from? Take some notes on how you feel etc.."

As you are finding out, the back-and-forth can be jarring.

I would caution against this approach as described. It sounds like a good way to end up with the speaker that you happened to be listening to when you had a better week for other reasons.
Of course, I do see some merit in longer listening sessions. If you do spend a week with each speaker, I would advise that you take note of your most positive and negative experiences. At the end of the two weeks, perform a head-to-head A/B comparison between the speakers playing the most impactful content.

 

[kma100]

Sure. The point is that spending time with one speaker helps. Of course you have to use some judgment to make sure that you are not affected with recency bias! Switching back-and-forth and back-and-forth makes it harder to evaluate as @Mort observed.

 

[MKR]

Sure. The point is that spending time with one speaker helps. Of course you have to use some judgment to make sure that you are not affected with recently bias! Switching back-and-forth and back-and-forth makes it harder to evaluate as @Mort observed.

Speaking from some recent (and ongoing) significant experience in a similar situation (trying to decide between two very different driver types), it can be a frustrating process … one of the main things I have learned in the process is how very short our acoustic memory is! Certainly key differences stand out and you can remember these differences generally, but the specifics can be elusive to recall, even minutes after listening. And I do think both types of listening sessions are needed … long periods of time with same speaker, which is important to be sure a speaker is enjoyable in the long-term, and to better cement acoustic memory. And also sessions that allow for relatively fast switches between speakers to more easily sense differences between them. Another thing I have learned is well engineered designs (flat FR, constant directivity) sound more similar than different even with very different drivers! YMMV as always, just my observations.

 

[Esprit]

Isn't GLM just based off of REW?

It has nothing to do with it.

 

[Behrelec 37]

In my opinion, the Genelec 1237a and 1238a have identical sound image structure and rhythm/melody. The difference between them is most clearly seen in the larger power layers of the sound pressure, and through the growth of the sound image, the 1238a has a larger sound image of about a few meters in width and height in favor of the 1238a.The bass is also slightly larger in power and size than in the 1237a.Otherwise, these are almost identical brothers.The 1238a plays live recordings, for example in club interiors, quite believably and very beautifully and vividly, which no other speaker brand has ever convinced my ears. Outdoor recordings are also frighteningly convincing.


These master series speakers also draw a very clear sound image if the source material offers it. These master series speakers sound both beautifully at mouse quiet or at very high volumes, really clean, without losing any of the sound. Bluray movies come out digitally super super super beautifully and clearly. I recommend connecting directly to the bluray player and admiring how many details come out, as much as each person distinguishes their surroundings in real life. These speakers cannot be broken by playing at all! and the sound image and glm rhythm emphasis can be modified even until you are bored with them for the rest of your life.

Just for your information, the 1237 a costs around 10,000 euros a pair here in Finland. And this 1238 a costs around 15,000 euros a pair.The GLM package either comes with it or depends on how the seller and the store are agreed upon.I don't sell anything myself, but I just thought I'd tell you what the prices are for these master series products, in case no one here knows. An even better collection, namely the 1234s, which are larger in size, are around 35,000 euros a pair, which is then your absolute passion, like a beautiful woman embracing the listener's ears with her beautiful warm lips. Because these will already make your head go crazy with endless joy. I'm completely convinced of that. And you won't get bored.

 

[Kain]

In my opinion, the Genelec 1237a and 1238a have identical sound image structure and rhythm/melody. The difference between them is most clearly seen in the larger power layers of the sound pressure, and through the growth of the sound image, the 1238a has a larger sound image of about a few meters in width and height in favor of the 1238a.The bass is also slightly larger in power and size than in the 1237a.Otherwise, these are almost identical brothers.The 1238a plays live recordings, for example in club interiors, quite believably and very beautifully and vividly, which no other speaker brand has ever convinced my ears. Outdoor recordings are also frighteningly convincing.


These master series speakers also draw a very clear sound image if the source material offers it. These master series speakers sound both beautifully at mouse quiet or at very high volumes, really clean, without losing any of the sound. Bluray movies come out digitally super super super beautifully and clearly. I recommend connecting directly to the bluray player and admiring how many details come out, as much as each person distinguishes their surroundings in real life. These speakers cannot be broken by playing at all! and the sound image and glm rhythm emphasis can be modified even until you are bored with them for the rest of your life.

Just for your information, the 1237 a costs around 10,000 euros a pair here in Finland. And this 1238 a costs around 15,000 euros a pair.The GLM package either comes with it or depends on how the seller and the store are agreed upon.I don't sell anything myself, but I just thought I'd tell you what the prices are for these master series products, in case no one here knows. An even better collection, namely the 1234s, which are larger in size, are around 35,000 euros a pair, which is then your absolute passion, like a beautiful woman embracing the listener's ears with her beautiful warm lips. Because these will already make your head go crazy with endless joy. I'm completely convinced of that. And you won't get bored.

Is it possible to wall mount or stand mount the 1237A/1238A or are they primarily designed to be flushed mounted in a wall? I checked Genelec's website and it seems no mounting accessories are available for the 1237A/1238A.

 

[Behrelec 37]

Kain.

Don't set limits on yourself. As I've said, these master series speakers work very well, either on stools or wall-mounted.

My own stands are ALREADY! 30 years old, to which 1037a pairs were connected so that they would reach over the mixing desk. Genelec no longer sells/makes them. I bought them used from an audio store and put them on my 1237a speakers, which are exactly the same size as the 1037a/b/c pair speakers. Although the 1237a are a little heavier speakers. The through bolts just had to be added a couple of cents longer and reinforced bolts, because the original ones are shorter.

Of course, Genelec no longer makes any separate stands for master speakers, so I am a unique person in all of humanity in this regard, using them in my home living room, AND I AM VERY AWARE OF IT.

But there is always the option to have such stands made at a welding shop, and then powder-coat them in the desired col

 

[Behrelec 37]

The 1237a has black plastic buttons in the middle on the sides, which when removed with a knife are plastic with internal threads in the wooden case, and thus several cm bolts go through the case wall from the outside if you want to attach racks to them. Sound does not pass through them at all. Apparently they are well protected inside the speaker case?

 

[Mort]

Update:

I've decided to keep the 8361a Genelec monitors. I do love my Philharmonic Audio HTs and will keep a pair for my living room. For critical nearfield(ish) listening I prefer the 8361a's. There really is no comparison between the two unless one insists on very wide directivity. Bass response is less an issue than I expected.

The original deal fell through because I did not want to part with the E15 Rythmik subwoofers. Instead of a trade I bought an open box set of 8361a's for $8200 from Sweetwater with the original warranty. I'll sell off other stuff to make it up.

Here's what I'm hearing. Looks good, sounds great.

 

[Multicore]

Wow. Congrats

The fact you had two sets of PA HT made this a lot easier, I expect.

When you say

really is no comparison

I guess that means they are very different and jenny is the better. Can you describe? And try not to be too technical because Idk what dispersion sounds like.