Revel M106 Bookshelf Speaker Review

[Dj7675]

Couldn’t pass up a deal on 3 of these... 3 M106 for $1400. Decided to replace the M16s on by LCR and have the M16 go to surround duty. Wasn’t really looking to upgrade but just couldn’t pass it up.

 

[Xyrium]

There are two potential problems. One is the sub revealing its location. The other is with destructive interference ("phase cancellation") between the wavefronts from the main speakers and the wavefront from the sub for listeners that are off to one side far enough for the two distances (the distance to the sub and the distance to either main speaker) to differ by a half-wavelength. At 300 Hz a half-wavelength is 3.75 feet.

Indeed, and you're supposed to localize them in such a system (if you could (equal loudness contour). As mentioned, most three ways (and the 4 way [Thanks Ron!] Salon2 interestingly enough) already do this. We're not talking about subs that you'd place in some random corner, they need to be on the same plane as the bookshelves in question. If you run HT, you'll need an additional pair of 12 or 15s (or greater) to do it right.

AFA cancellation, if you run/xover your subs up to your bookshelves in any fashion, you'll always run this risk if care isn't taken in optimizing phase.

In the end, I'd really like to see the next review of a bookshelf to contain a comparison using various hi-pass crossover points and slopes, to determine how much they improve performance, especially in the area of distortion. However, given the relief the midrange would receive, I'd imagine that everything aspect would improve. Localization of the sub below it would be welcome, but optimized.

 

[beefkabob]

105db at 2m.

105dB from what distance? If you sit 2m from the speakers then you need 111dB at 1m to get the 105dB at 2m, at 4m you need 117dB at 1m and so on. Double the distance and the SPL drops by 6dB.

 

[KaiserSoze]

105dB from what distance? If you sit 2m from the speakers then you need 111dB at 1m to get the 105dB at 2m, at 4m you need 117dB at 1m and so on. Double the distance and the SPL drops by 6dB.

I'm not entirely certain, but it occurs to me that the 6 dB for each doubling of distance is derived mathematically from the rate at which the surface area of a sphere (or maybe the volume ...) increases with respect to increase in the radius. As such, the rule applies correctly to a speaker standing atop a high tower outdoors, but less so in an indoor listening room. Especially with lower bass where the wavelength is long enough to fill the available space, the volume is not going to change much as you move further from the speaker. From mid-bass upwards the effect you describe applies, but it is difficult to generalize as to the extent, and it might be different at different frequency.

There is also the personal aspect of the question. For some people it is best for distortion to be measured at 86 dB at 1 meter; for other people it should be 96 dB at 1 meter, etc. For me personally, 96 dB at 1 meter is probably the shoe that fits.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Those are test tone audibility thresholds; the 20% was for audibility with “content” playing.

What if the "content" sounds a lot like test tones? This is somewhat analogous to the idea that narrow resonances aren't audible. If the fundamental note of a solo violin happens to coincide with a narrow but strong resonance, the resonance may not only be audible but potentially distracting enough to ruin the experience.

 

[KaiserSoze]

I got a deal on M106's, 1200 euro for a pair (imported from the UK). But that was after 2 months of looking for sales, they never go on sale in Europe. F36's are 1200 euro's a piece. F206 2000 euro's a piece. I asked for discounts on the M106 at a Dutch dealer, and the most they could give was 10% on MSRP. So its basically more a case of finding good deals on them, but its virtually impossible in Europe to get them.

I got a single SB2000 right now, looking for a second.

I am envious of the SB2000. Have you found anything about it that you're less than happy with?

 

[KaiserSoze]

Indeed, and you're supposed to localize them in such a system (if you could (equal loudness contour). As mentioned, most three ways (and the 4 way [Thanks Ron!] Salon2 interestingly enough) already do this. We're not talking about subs that you'd place in some random corner, they need to be on the same plane as the bookshelves in question. If you run HT, you'll need an additional pair of 12 or 15s (or greater) to do it right.

AFA cancellation, if you run/xover your subs up to your bookshelves in any fashion, you'll always run this risk if care isn't taken in optimizing phase.

In the end, I'd really like to see the next review of a bookshelf to contain a comparison using various hi-pass crossover points and slopes, to determine how much they improve performance, especially in the area of distortion. However, given the relief the midrange would receive, I'd imagine that everything aspect would improve. Localization of the sub below it would be welcome, but optimized.

A variable high-pass filter can be a useful test tool. With it bypassed you can turn up the volume (with some of your favorite music that has a lot of bass to include mid-bass especially) until you clearly hear that nasty distortion. If you have to turn it up past the point where you would ever ordinarily listen to your speakers then it is a non-issue. But if it is an issue, then you want to know how high in frequency and/or how steep the high-pass filter needs to be to eliminate the distortion, and the variable high-pass filter (or variable crossover) can do this for you without an actual subwoofer (which would likely just obfuscate the question).

 

[Koeitje]

I am envious of the SB2000. Have you found anything about it that you're less than happy with?

Build quality, I was expecting it to be more solid. It weighs less than a single one of the monitors I used before I got the M106. I think this sub would benefit a lot from a more solid enclosure. I've put a big potted plant on top of it to make it resonate a bit less.

 

[MZKM]

What if the "content" sounds a lot like test tones?

Very unlikely, you almost never have a single note playing in a song, equally one or narrow bandwidth. But yes, this is why 90dB DACs don’t get a recommendation from Amir even though its more than enough for 99% of musical content.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Build quality, I was expecting it to be more solid. It weighs less than a single one of the monitors I used before I got the M106. I think this sub would benefit a lot from a more solid enclosure. I've put a big potted plant on top of it to make it resonate a bit less.

Interesting. According to SVS spec it weighs 39 lbs. The most stable subs are probably the ones with a single downward-facing driver and dual opposing passive radiators. A more solid enclosure might have some benefits but wouldn't keep it from wanting to scoot around except by virtue of the added mass, and the big potted plant you put on top of it seems a very good way to take care of that. Now I'm going to have to add a big heavy potted plant to my wish list for audio gear.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Very unlikely, you almost never have a single note playing in a song, equally one or narrow bandwidth. But yes, this is why 90dB DACs don’t get a recommendation from Amir even though its more than enough for 99% of musical content.

Well, I suppose I must have missed something. You posted a table that indicated that the threshold of audibility for harmonic distortion at 100 Hz is between one and two orders of magnitude lower than you said it is, i.e., between .2% and 2% depending on the loudness and the order of the harmonic component, vs. the 20% you stated. This was conspicuous, but no one pointed it out, so I did. Subsequently you explained that the true value is much greater than the values in the table because the values in the table apply only to test tones as opposed to real content. This leaves me wanting to ask two questions. First, why did you bother to post the table given that you were going to end up arguing that the numbers in the table have no meaningful bearing on the actual threshold for real content? Second, where did you come up with the 20% figure? Does it involve some well-defined and well-researched algorithm applied to the numbers in the table, or does it come from somewhere else entirely?

 

[MZKM]

Well, I suppose I must have missed something. You posted a table that indicated that the threshold of audibility for harmonic distortion at 100 Hz is between one and two orders of magnitude lower than you said it is, i.e., between .2% and 2% depending on the loudness and the order of the harmonic component, vs. the 20% you stated. This was conspicuous, but no one pointed it out, so I did. Subsequently you explained that the true value is much greater than the values in the table because the values in the table apply only to test tones as opposed to real content. This leaves me wanting to ask two questions. First, why did you bother to post the table given that you were going to end up arguing that the numbers in the table have no meaningful bearing on the actual threshold for real content? Second, where did you come up with the 20% figure? Does it involve some well-defined and well-researched algorithm applied to the numbers in the table, or does it come from somewhere else entirely?

It comes from some human audibility studies or ”musings” that I have seen. This is why 1% THD is used for clipping in many specifications, as that’s around the audible threshold with content playing in the treble. Thankfully nowadays many are transitioning to 0.1% or lower.

I posted the table to show absolute audibility thresholds for those that care about those.

 

[Koeitje]

Interesting. According to SVS spec it weighs 39 lbs. The most stable subs are probably the ones with a single downward-facing driver and dual opposing passive radiators. A more solid enclosure might have some benefits but wouldn't keep it from wanting to scoot around except by virtue of the added mass, and the big potted plant you put on top of it seems a very good way to take care of that. Now I'm going to have to add a big heavy potted plant to my wish list for audio gear.

Yes, by more solid I mean just more mass. I can feel it resonating pretty hard, until I put something on top.

 

[daftcombo]

Subjective comparison of the M106 VS Focal Aria 906 at the end of this article:
https://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/768-focal-aria-906-loudspeakers

 

[Chromatischism]

Interesting. According to SVS spec it weighs 39 lbs. The most stable subs are probably the ones with a single downward-facing driver and dual opposing passive radiators. A more solid enclosure might have some benefits but wouldn't keep it from wanting to scoot around except by virtue of the added mass, and the big potted plant you put on top of it seems a very good way to take care of that. Now I'm going to have to add a big heavy potted plant to my wish list for audio gear.

Don't compromise...just get a Rythmik. Plant optional.

 

[Voo]

Subjective comparison of the M106 VS Focal Aria 906 at the end of this article:
https://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/768-focal-aria-906-loudspeakers

imo, the revels all need eq...very clinical. but thats why people like them.

 

[Chromatischism]

Subjective comparison of the M106 VS Focal Aria 906 at the end of this article:
https://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/768-focal-aria-906-loudspeakers

I guess that reviewer prefers that kind of sound.

ASR Focal Review: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/focal-aria-906-speaker-review.14085/

Soundstage: https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/i...&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

Compared to the Revel: https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/i...&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

What I see when comparing the Soundstage/NRC measurements is that the Focal should have a stronger presence in the upper bass, vocal, and instrumental range, then be smoother through 2-3 kHz off-axis, which is important to avoid reflections annoying you, then have a little more energy through the 5-10 kHz range off-axis that would give it a touch of sparkle. I'm also noting that the measurements on the Focals look closer to those of the Buchardt S400 than the Revels do. I haven't heard the Revels but I would be more interested in hearing the Focals, just looking at these measurements. Which is interesting, because some other speakers of theirs are known for having too much zing up top, so I had previously written them off.

 

[ttimer]

Subjective comparison of the M106 VS Focal Aria 906 at the end of this article:
https://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/768-focal-aria-906-loudspeakers

Not surprising. Preference ratings don't show that "everyone prefers the higher rated speaker". They only show that "more people like the higher rated speaker". The reviewer is one of those who doesn't.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Don't compromise...just get a Rythmik. Plant optional.

Damn ... I had my heart set on a big plotted plant.

 

[GXAlan]

I also own 4 way JBL 250ti which I think weigh around 130lb each which have 15 inch woofers in them .

You should crowdfund for the pallet and freight shipping needed to get this on the Klippel NFS. The XPL90 did pretty well for a vintage speaker, and it would be great to see a 250Ti.