PS Audio PowerPlant 12 Review (AC Regenerator)

[antcollinet]

@Doodski This one has 3600 watts output and a huge capacitor bank and just might not sag at all if the mains sag . And it's my understanding that Mains can sag from time to time depending upon location, time, circumstances etc.

PowerPlant 20 – PS Audio

www.psaudio.com

I very much doubt these devices can do step up conversion (put out higher voltage than goes in) so if the mains voltage goes down for more than a few cycles, so will the output voltage.

 

[SIY]

"Why doesn't the reviewer disassemble $100,000 worth of test gear, cart it over somewhere, reassemble it, verify operation and calibration, do some tests, disassemble it again, cart it back home, reassemble it, and then once again verify operation and calibration, because someone doesn't want to bring their gear to be tested FOR FREE to his lab?"

This isn't a pocket voltmeter.

 

[Chrispy]

Somewhat why such gear is "unbelievable" in that you'd think they'd be super proud of the exemplary reports of third party testers.....but probably just having selling shilling is a better business model....and if you can't tell an audio review from a promotion....meh

 

[Chriz]

As far as I understand the intention/functioning of Powerplants (and what Paul repeatedly explained in his videos) two important aspects are:

1) clean up the delivered power by rebuilding the sinewave, and
2) provide an energy source with a "lower than mains" impedance, which is particularly relevant for high power amplifier applications. In other words, deliver more instantaneous power than what can be achieved from the mains.

To 1): this is clearly achieved, as can be seen from comparing your charts "raw AC in my lab" where the sine wave is chopped off with "Raw AC to PowerPlant P12", where this artifact is gone.

To 2): The measurements don't seem to address this claim at all, or try to prove/disprove it in any way. So to that extent, it would be interesting to see what the output behaviour of a high power amp would be, powered through the Powerplant, in particular in a high output power scenario.

Thirdly, but this may be the wrong forum for this question, have you listened to gear powered through the Powerplant?
Be that the A90 or, preferrably, a power amp speakter setup? Even with the A90, the review only speaks of measurements.

Thanks,
Chris

 

[amirm]

To 1): this is clearly achieved, as can be seen from comparing your charts "raw AC in my lab" where the sine wave is chopped off with "Raw AC to PowerPlant P12", where this artifact is gone

Do you listen to AC power or output of your audio gear?

 

[Chriz]

Do you listen to AC power or output of your audio gear?

Essentially, AC power, as any amplified signal is just modulated AC power.

 

[SIY]

Essentially, AC power, as any amplified signal is just modulated AC power.

Most amps I've worked with modulate DC.

 

[Chriz]

Most amps I've worked with modulate DC.

And where does the DC come from?

 

[Shorty]

And where does the DC come from?

Don’t you know? The amp’s power supply turns AC into DC. And Amir’s tests show that an amp doesn’t care if it receives chopped-of AC sine-waves or not.

 

[BDWoody]

Even has its own thread.

Speaker wires don't carry any energy (power).

Tell them when they try to sell you expensive cables. Very nonintuitive but true. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=The+great+misconcception+wire

audiosciencereview.com

 

[dasdoing]

If I bought a thing like that and heard the big diferences "users" claim to hear, first thing I would do is record a little with it on and off. if the diference is so big, you would prove it very fast this way.
I don't think Amir's conclusion of to why people hear diferences is right. they all claim substancial diferences. the only explaination is that all reviewers are into the scam

 

[pkane]

the only explaination is that all reviewers are into the scam

There are true believers, too. With how easy it is to fool the brain into hearing things that are not there, one can assume that it's not just consumers who are fooled.

One can't expect all (most?) consumers to understand electricity, electronics, psycho-acoustics. But audio reviewers and manufacturers that allow themselves to be fooled, like any average consumer, are incompetent in their chosen field. Whether they know it or not, they are complicit to a scam.

 

[voodooless]

But audio reviewers and manufacturers that allow themselves to be fooled, like any average consumer, are incompetent in their chosen field. Whether they know it or not, they are complicit to a scam.

That depends on what your definition of "chosen field" is. Like with any social media, the people are the product, not the audience. Usually, the goal is to sell advertising, not to give objective information.

 

[JustJones]

If I bought a thing like that and heard the big diferences "users" claim to hear, first thing I would do is record a little with it on and off. if the diference is so big, you would prove it very fast this way.
I don't think Amir's conclusion of to why people hear diferences is right. they all claim substancial diferences. the only explaination is that all reviewers are into the scam

Possibly or the more likely explanation they think they aren't subject to bias like a lot of audiophiles. I would ask have they heard these substantial differences in a blind comparison.

 

[pkane]

That depends on what your definition of "chosen field" is. Like with any social media, the people are the product, not the audience. Usually, the goal is to sell advertising, not to give objective information.

True, but that doesn't make them any less incompetent if they believe the fairy tales they are selling, and help propagate a scam in the process.

 

[voodooless]

True, but that doesn't make them any less incompetent if they believe the fairy tales they are selling, and help propagate a scam in the process.

The measure of competence here is how much money they make off it. It doesn't really matter if they believe it or not. The objective quality of the review is a totally different matter

 

[SIY]

And where does the DC come from?

I'd suggest you read the power supply sections of Art of Electronics, Radio Amateur's Handbook, or Radiotron Designer's Handbook. This will hopefully give you a clearer understanding of how they work.

 

[pinpoint_oxford]

I very much doubt these devices can do step up conversion (put out higher voltage than goes in) so if the mains voltage goes down for more than a few cycles, so will the output voltage.

Why not? It should be able to generate slightly higher voltage (e.g. if mains sags to 110V) with less output current, no? I see this behavior in my unit since the output remains steady despite fluctuations in input, and I have seen my mains go down to as low as 108V before.

If you want your thinking to really be challenged on this issue, consider this—electricity does not travel through wires.

I don't understand the all the science behind this, but I am aware of this principle, otherwise a transformer or motor could not possibly work if electricity never left the wire!

 

[LEFASR160]

And that means what?

@Chrispy The hypocrisy should be obvious. The theme you and the reviewer seem to be promoting is that only audiofools spend lots of money on so called high end products.

 

[Billy Budapest]

I don't understand the all the science behind this, but I am aware of this principle, otherwise a transformer or motor could not possibly work if electricity never left the wire!

Well, the electric fields and the magnetic fields are never in the wire to begin with. Current is in the wire, sure, but it is the intersection of the electric and magnetic fields that creates the electrical force.

But yeah, looking at a loudspeaker which is a type of electric motor, there is no physical connection between the voice coil and the magnet, so . . .