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Neumann KH80 II / Genelec 8320 With USB in Future Product?

superbluecat

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I am a PC gamer who sometimes watch video and listen to music. Not being any professional in audio, I only decide to put active 2.0 speakers by the side of my 27-inch monitor. (A triangle of about 1 meter)
The audioengine HD4 I am currently using still has some hissing and port noise within 1 feet (though it is already much better than the previous pairs I returned, and does not cause bad sounds at 1 meter). Also the audio quality is not as good as the ideal monitor-level response according to some measurements I see online.

Therefore, I think I would seek an opportunity for future upgrade if brands like Neumann and Genelec can release 4-inch small speakers with digital input in the future.
I would think speakers like those will be ultimate graduation for Desktop PC system within 1-meter super-near field listening zero noise and vintage sound. (From my point of view, Larger speakers mean bulky, larger self noise, overwhelming bass and more $!)

However, what is a pity is that both KH80 DSP and 8020d/8320 has no digital input like USB and SPDIF.
I think it is awkward that Moutherboard does DAC, then DSP does ADC and DAC again, why not directly add a digital input interface?
Given that Neumann has released KH 120 II with SPDIF input very recently, is it like they will also release a KH 80 II likewise in the near future? Same questions for Genelec.
Even if I asked both customer service, they have got no story to tell me...

Thanks for discussion!
 
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superbluecat

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Pearljam5000

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It is even more expensive than 8020d themselves lol. Also anything plus speakers is bulky and takes more space... Nvidia GPU is already bulky enough
They're not going to add USB because they're professional monitors meant to be used in studios
 

Music1969

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However, what is a pity is that both KH80 DSP and 8020d/8320 has no digital input like USB and SPDIF.
Just get a USB DAC? Balanced output.

SMSL D-6? So cheap, so good.

So all the DSP on PC/Mac before the DAC?

Then you have great gaming and music setup.
 

soundwave76

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Or USB-AES interface which doesn't have a DAC at all. I use an old Matrix X-SPDIF box. Others exists as well.
 
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superbluecat

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Just get a USB DAC? Balanced output.

SMSL D-6? So cheap, so good.
Thanks, sounds like a good solution.
I am not in rush though, looking if there will be built in digital input interface for those brands in the very future upgrade. It is perfect if I do not need to add other large things.
 

Music1969

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Thanks, sounds like a good solution.
I am not in rush though, looking if there will be built in digital input interface for those brands in the very future upgrade. It is perfect if I do not need to add other large things.
SMSL D-6 DAC is tiiiny, you won't believe how small.

And the Genelec models with digital input are quite a lot more expensive.

The analogue models you mentioned + small balanced DAC will be much more cost effective.
 
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superbluecat

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SMSL D-6 DAC is tiiiny, you won't believe how small.

And the Genelec models with digital input are quite a lot more expensive.

The analogue models you mentioned + small balanced DAC will be much more cost effective.
Yeah It's not so big. However, I will see if KH80 II will be there; if it is there it shouldn't be a lot more expensive. Adding a DAC definitely adds more entropy to my devices, so as a PC folk, I prefer one over two things
 

holdingpants01

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I seriously doubt you'll hear any difference between analog or digital input, so I wouldn't wait if you want to upgrade your speakers. Also it's entirely possible that Neumann will never add digital input to the KH80. Take Genelec for instance, they include it from 8330 and up, but not on 8320 for some reason, possibly lack of space
 
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superbluecat

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I seriously doubt you'll hear any difference between analog or digital input, so I wouldn't wait if you want to upgrade your speakers. Also it's entirely possible that Neumann will never add digital input to the KH80. Take Genelec for instance, they include it from 8330 and up, but not on 8320 for some reason, possibly lack of space
KH80 already has DSP and a built in DAC within. Not the same case as 8320?
 

Music1969

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8320A has only analogue input for audio right?

It does have a DAC inside for DSP so yes it is double DAC'ing.

You have to pay quite a big jump in price for digital input (AES/EBU) Genelec - then you would need a USB to AES/EBU converter

But why not just add a small balanced DAC for cheaper Genelec
 
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superbluecat

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But why not just add a small balanced DAC for cheaper Genelec
I do not feel like easily making the decisions to go with KH80/Genelec 8020( + DAC)...
It's over 1000 bucks anyway, three to four times than my current AudioEngine; but AudioEngine has all of analog/USB/Bluetooth... From the PC DIY perspective I would consider that upgrade as a significant downgrade w.r.t input variaty. Even if bluetooth will not be there for professional speakers, at least I want digital input interface remained.

Take motherboard for example, I would not take a more overclocking one but cutting a lot of Thunderbolt/USB-C/DIMM/SSD down.
 
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holdingpants01

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8320A has only analogue input for audio right?

It does have a DAC inside for DSP so yes it is double DAC'ing.

You have to pay quite a big jump in price for digital input (AES/EBU) Genelec - then you would need a USB to AES/EBU converter
8330 have digital input, so not that big of a jump in terms of price, however they are quite noisy so I wouldn't use them on a desktop in front of my face. KH80 are as good as you can get at this size, I really wouldn't bother about the lack of digital input, it's a non issue honestly, especially for this use case
 
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superbluecat

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8330 have digital input, so not that big of a jump in terms of price, however they are quite noisy so I wouldn't use them on a desktop in front of my face. KH80 are as good as you can get at this size, I really wouldn't bother about the lack of digital input, it's a non issue honestly, especially for this use case
From what I have searched, that is like KH 120 II. Those 5-inch are too large and suggested to be put over 1.5m separated.
That's why they are not suitable for PC Desktop in several aspects, and PC folks need those in smallest 3/4 inch models.
 
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bodhi

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Take motherboard for example, I would not take a more overclocking one but cutting a lot of Thunderbolt/USB-C/DIMM/SSD down.
These are speakers made for audio professionals, not PC gamers. The extra AD conversion has no audible effect on sound and it sure doesn't bother the professionals, why should it concern you?

Your other comments about bigger speakers having more self noise and overwhelming bass also don't make sense, especially if talking about SAM speakers with built in correction. I'm listening to the 8350s from 1,1m triangle and I have none of those problems. Even better, there are the 8351s. They are bigger, but realistically, how much useful extra space you get by going with smaller speakers? So what's left is that they cost more.

So, now we see that the limiting factor is budget. And then we can start questioning is it in any way reasonable to go with the one of the most expensive premium professional brand if one is trying to maximize the listening pleasure for money. Just get some bigger monitors from Kali Audio or JBL, connect to your motherboards headphone output and you are done.
 
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superbluecat

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These are speakers made for audio professionals, not PC gamers. The extra AD conversion has no audible effect on sound and it sure doesn't bother the professionals, why should it concern you?

Your other comments about bigger speakers having more self noise and overwhelming bass also don't make sense, especially if talking about SAM speakers with built in correction. I'm listening to the 8350s from 1,1m triangle and I have none of those problems. Even better, there are the 8351s. They are bigger, but realistically, how much useful extra space you get by going with smaller speakers? So what's left is that they cost more.

So, now we see that the limiting factor is budget. And then we can start questioning is it in any way reasonable to go with the one of the most expensive premium professional brand if one is trying to maximize the listening pleasure for money. Just get some bigger monitors from Kali Audio or JBL, connect to your motherboards headphone output and you are done.
Easy. Why suggesting me with large Kali and JBL? They have large hiss audible in a few meters. And why headphones in my own room? They harm ears.

I am exploiting zero-noise small monitor speakers within a few feet. Zero-noise, good sound and convenience are things PC folks can use of; what is wrong with that? Any regulations that PC DIYers are forbidden to make use of those speakers?

Also regarding the larger Genelec noise, some other people may also have questions. Larger ones have large noise because of much larger power gains in the amplifiers.
This hiss SPL at 10cm also suggests that larger model has larger noise within same series. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hiss-list-s-r.18050/ https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1n62hGAdKptSSKC74_fIT_R7DxFJ60YR2_O9C8x-vYQI/edit#gid=0
 

TheBatsEar

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Therefore, I think I would seek an opportunity for future upgrade if brands like Neumann and Genelec can release 4-inch small speakers with digital input in the future.
In my mind there is not much value in waiting for some future that may or may not come to pass, just for USB.
I also don't see much value in saving "money" and thus going to a smaller thing that is compromised again by using a 4" woofer.
1685006654919091.gif


I would think speakers like those will be ultimate graduation for Desktop PC system within 1-meter super-near field listening zero noise and vintage sound. (From my point of view, Larger speakers mean bulky, larger self noise, overwhelming bass and more $!)
I believe this to be the minimum in the near field:

However, what is a pity is that both KH80 DSP and 8020d/8320 has no digital input like USB and SPDIF.
Don't let your dreams be dreams, my dude.
Just mount a DAC with balanced output on the underside of your desk and nobody will be the wiser, there really is no need to wait just for USB.

Given that Neumann has released KH 120 II with SPDIF input very recently, is it like they will also release a KH 80 II likewise in the near future? Same questions for Genelec.
About that, the KH120 II makes a serious difference. If you have the space for it, i would get those. Not for the digital input, but for their larger woofer.
If it's just about the money, watch the gif above a few times. :cool:
 
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