Moondrop x Crinacle DUSK

[carlcamper]

So it does work with the USB-C iPhones? The app as well?

It works and uses the default EQ in the DSP cable. Unfortunately, the Moondrop Link app in the Apple App Store doesn’t work with it.

 

[CedarX]

So it does work with the USB-C iPhones? The app as well?

I believe it has been mentioned before, but FreeDSP, CDSP, and all these DSP-enabled IEMs, are UAC-1 or UAC-2 compliant. They work (as in "playing music with whatever current DSP setting applied") with any source that support a UAC-1 or UAC-2 device: iOS, Android, Windows, MacOS, Linux, RaspPI, PlayStation, etc. Adapters may be needed: Lightning to USB-C for my old iPhone 12, USB-A to USB-C for my Laptop.

The app is a completely different story, it is Android-only and, I think, it relies on HID USB interfaces exposed by FreeDSP. That's the part I found unreliable with common "no device detected" issues. Technically, Moondrop should be able to develop a Chrome Extension, similar to the Qudelix one. I don't know about iOS and the MFI cert. thing (the Qudelix app on iOS communicates via BT, not USB).

Personally, I don't compare FreeDSP to something like EqAPO, or a Qudelix 5K: it is just not the best way to "fiddle" and develop a PEQ for a given IEM IMO. It is not even intended to be connected/disconnected from one IEM to another. I think FreeDSP needs to be seen for what it is... as an upgrade cable: you develop your PEQ target using something else (Amir's recommendation, AutoEQ, your own target... test it using Roon, EqAPO, Qudelix, a DAP, whatever...), and when you are satisfied with the results, you load these settings onto FreeDSP. Sure you have to take into account or "adapt" to FreeDSP constraints/limitations (+3/-12 dB gain, with only integer values, etc.). That's what Crinacle had to do with Dusk, and he is not hiding the constraints & difficulties in his video. But in the end, the main point is that your PEQ profile carries across whatever USB-C source you want to use with your FreeDSP-enabled IEM, you no longer depend on a SW (Roon, EqAPO...) or intermediate HW (DAP, Qudelix 5K).
I think that's the whole point of FreeDSP, CDSP, and any of those DSP-enabled IEM's. Yes, they have limitations and issues, but for me, it's enough of a game changer to accept and deal with these issues. I have several FreeDSP cables (and CDSP) that I leave attached to their respective IEMs, and I really don't use the app that often. I find the USB-C connection more ubiquitous than a 3.5mm plug and in addition, there is nothing preventing me to refine and explore the EQ further by adding filters into EqAPO or my DAP on top of the EQ loaded into FreeDSP. But I understand, it may not work for everybody.

 

[MacClintock]

It works and uses the default EQ in the DSP cable. Unfortunately, the Moondrop Link app in the Apple App Store doesn’t work with it.

Thanks, at least that. So when intending to use it with an iPhone, you have to use a possibly noisy update cable with a an external DAC and fixed EQ, to get what the $25 7Hz Salnotes x Crinacle Zero 2 and an $9 Apple dongle do out of the box.

 

[CedarX]

Thanks, at least that. So when intending to use with an iPhone you have to use a possibly noisy update cable with a an external DAC and fixed EQ, to get what the $25 7Hz Salnotes x Crinacle Zero 2 and an $9 Apple dongle do out of the box.

I'm with you on this: I haven't bought Dusk, because I don't see the value it brings over something like Moondrop May or, as you said, 7Hz Zero:2. But I have zero problem with somebody valuing the higher end built, accessories, Crinacle endorsement and so on...

 

[RedCometZero]

Thanks, at least that. So when intending to use with an iPhone you have to use a possibly noisy update cable with a an external DAC and fixed EQ, to get what the $25 7Hz Salnotes x Crinacle Zero 2 and an $9 Apple dongle do out of the box.

The Dusk, without the EQ cable, follows Crinacle's target at least as well as the Zero2 does. It does so better with the EQ cable, but it's not inferior to Zero2 without. Whether that, the higher build quality, smaller nozzle, and better accessories are worth the price delta is another question, but it doesn't need the EQ cable to match the Zero2.

 

[staticV3]

The Dusk, without the EQ cable, follows Crinacle's target at least as well as the Zero2 does. It does so better with the EQ cable, but it's not inferior to Zero2 without.

The Dusk needs the DSP preset to match the Zero:2 in target adherence.
Analog vs Analog, the Dusk is worse in that aspect I would say.

 

[MacClintock]

The Dusk needs the DSP preset to match the Zero:2 in target adherence.
Analog vs Analog, the Dusk is worse in that aspect I would say.
View attachment 364178 View attachment 364177

Exactly, the graphs were shown several time already in this thread.

I'm with you on this: I haven't bought Dusk, because I don't see the value it brings over something like Moondrop May or, as you said, 7Hz Zero:2. But I have zero problem with somebody valuing the higher end built, accessories, Crinacle endorsement and so on...

Sure, no contradition here. The Dusk looks better, no doubt, but it is more an argument in direction of jewelery (maybe comfort and fit, but also debatable) than sound quality.

 

[Chromatischism]

The Dusk needs the DSP preset to match the Zero:2 in target adherence.
Analog vs Analog, the Dusk is worse in that aspect I would say.
View attachment 364178 View attachment 364177

Is diffuse field the correct target to compare to here?

 

[staticV3]

Is diffuse field the correct target to compare to here?

Diffuse field is not the target response.

 

[Chromatischism]

Diffuse field is not the target response.

Well it literally says Diffuse Field Target *shrug*

 

[MacClintock]

Well it literally says Diffuse Field Target *shrug*

That is just the name they are using, with some arbitrary tilt. This is done, as for the B&K 5128 up to now no approved target exists. I think Sean Olive is working on one. There are people claiming that this is a better way and it should also correspond to the desired tilt of speakers in a room. But there are a lot of things to be clarified still and many seemingly endless threads on this topic here on ASR already. While the B&K 5128 appears to have a more realistic pinna and ear canal, without all the research done on the G.R.A.S it is not too telling. But we will see.

 

[Chromatischism]

That is just the name they are using, with some arbitrary tilt. This is done, as for the B&K 5128 up to now no approved target exists. I think Sean Olive is working on one. There are people claiming that this is a better way and it should also correspond to the desired tilt of speakers in a room. But there are a lot of things to be clarified still and many seemingly endless threads on this topic here on ASR already. While the B&K 5128 appears to have a more realistic pinna and ear canal, without all the research done on the G.R.A.S it is not too telling. But we will see.

Ok. I think what I was getting at is I wasn't aware Crinacle was targeting Diffuse Field with his IEMs. He has his own target, called IEF, which would make more sense in the context of "target adherence".

 

[carlcamper]

Here is a recording of the artifact that Listener was pertaining to from the Headphones.com Discord, and happy to say I don't hear it in my Dusk DSP cable from several USB-C sources including an Apple iPhone 15 Pro Max, a Poco F3 Android Phone, and a Dell dock connected to a Dell Latitude Windows 11 laptop.

SNAPS_-_DSP_Matched_Insertion.wav

 

[Somafunk]

Here’s quite a critical review of the dusk with it’s audible digital artefacts from Headphones.com website

Link to review here

 

[carlcamper]

Here’s quite a critical review of the dusk with it’s audible digital artefacts from “Listener” @ Headphones . com website

Not getting the artifact on mine, see my post before yours

 

[Somafunk]

Not getting the artifact on mine, see my post before yours

I’m late to the party yet again.

 

[carlcamper]

I’m late to the party yet again.

No worries, so it’s either a bad batch, its picky on usb-c sources, or it triggers on certain versions of songs (i tested the track on both Spotify lossy and Apple Music lossless)

 

[CedarX]

No worries, so it’s either a bad batch, its picky on usb-c sources, or it triggers on certain versions of songs (i tested the track on both Spotify lossy and Apple Music lossless)

The FreeDSP cable is built around an arm-type chip (with a DAC or powerDAC I don’t know). It is designed for mobile use, and I would not be surprised if there is some battery saving feature. The exact conditions where the artifacts happen may not be entirely known…

For example, is it right after you plug the cable and only once? Or the opposite, is it after a long pause, when the cable wakes up? Does the previous track matter (sampling rate change)?

I haven’t heard the artifacts either, but I would not dismiss it…

 

[preload]

Has anyone listened to these yet? How do they sound in comparison to know IEM's that were all familiar with? I think we've already debated the measurements to death.

 

[JayTee]

Has anyone listened to these yet? How do they sound in comparison to know IEM's that were all familiar with? I think we've already debated the measurements to death.

May as well use this as my first post since nobody else is chiming in. I can't really answer the comparison but...
The >12khz spiciness in analog 'mode' is very very unpleasant to me. Bass is thunderously good but you have to almost squint to get past the spiciness.
Conversely, with the DSP default eq setting, which i think is a straight up correction the Dusk sounds absolutely beautiful. I've compared to the zero 2s and all i can say is i enjoy the dusks more.
However, my (because i'm sure this may be a QC issue) cable is noisy at times. Digital squelchy unpleasantness. I'll be very interested in how it measures.
Hope that helps.