Magico S3 NFS Spinorama and comparison to Revel F228Be

[richard12511]

I was watching this Magico factory tour video by Audiophile Junkie on youtube, and about 18 minutes in, I think they show a Klippel lazer vibrometer comparison between a Magico A5 and Revel F228Be. The Magico speaker does look quite a bit better by comparison, though it is more expensive.

They also show a CEA-2034 spin of the Magico S3 starting at 21:40, and damn it looks smooth. Supposedly that's a 16 hour NFS measurement, so the resolution is probably really high.

I have a tendency to view these ultra high end speaker manufacturers(Kharma, Wilson, Magico, OMA, Ares Cerat, etc.) with major skepticism, but it seems like Magico is actually really following the science, and probably pretty legit. The fact that they have and use an NFS(and other Klippel products) in the design process is a good sign. $750,000 is more than I could ever afford(or want to spend on a loudspeaker), but it wouldn't surprise me if the Magico S9, with it's dual 15" woofers is among the best 2 channel setups in the world. I'd love to see an S9 spin. I've seen a picture of the S9 being measured by an NFS, so I know they have it .

Link to S3 NFS CEA-2034

Link to Magico vs Revel Vibrometer comparison

 

[dfuller]

Magicos are wildly overpriced, but that is damn good. Textbook perfect.

 

[sweetchaos]

If I was paying this much money, it better be textbook perfect.

And no, I’ll never pay this much for a speaker.

 

[amirm]

Very cool to watch. And yes, they are one of the exceptions in high-end speakers to put this much emphasis on measurements and design.

 

[Sancus]

My biggest problem with these cost-no-object stereo setup is always going to be: OK, so what have you accomplished? Your measurements can be as perfect as you want them to be, the speakers can have cardioid bass, hell they can have Dirac ART style magic that eliminates all SBIR.

Still going to sound a lot worse than a multichannel system that costs 5% of the price. Sinking massive amounts of money into stereo doesn't produce results no matter how good the speakers are.

But yeah, I wouldn't call Magico snake oil just really bad price-to-performance.

E: Also, for the extreme end of things, if you're talking $1M+ budgets for audio I'd actually look into commissioning perfect recordings of my favourite pieces that may have less than perfect stereo-only recordings available, because at that point literally renting a good studio and a well known orchestra for a day IS in your price range.

 

[MarkS]

My biggest problem with these cost-no-object stereo setup is always going to be: OK, so what have you accomplished? Your measurements can be as perfect as you want them to be, the speakers can have cardioid bass, hell they can have Dirac ART style magic that eliminates all SBIR.

Still going to sound a lot worse than a multichannel system that costs 5% of the price.

Unless you listen only to recordings that were multi-channel miked at the source and then released as multi-channel (of which there almost none), I disagree.

 

[Axo1989]

My biggest problem with these cost-no-object stereo setup is always going to be: OK, so what have you accomplished? Your measurements can be as perfect as you want them to be, the speakers can have cardioid bass, hell they can have Dirac ART style magic that eliminates all SBIR.

Still going to sound a lot worse than a multichannel system that costs 5% of the price. Sinking massive amounts of money into stereo doesn't produce results no matter how good the speakers are.

But yeah, I wouldn't call Magico snake oil just really bad price-to-performance.

E: Also, for the extreme end of things, if you're talking $1M+ budgets for audio I'd actually look into commissioning perfect recordings of my favourite pieces that may have less than perfect stereo-only recordings available, because at that point literally renting a good studio and a well known orchestra for a day IS in your price range.

People with enough disposable income to buy luxury (other Magicos, like the S3 shown on the NFS at ~20:00) or Veblen goods (like the big M9) really do like them to be well made, at a level higher than say a Genelec 8381, which is utilitarian. If use-value includes certain aesthetics and haptics, then “price-to-performance” is too limited to cover the relevant value space.

As for stereo vs multi-channel, a much longer discussion, but Magico won’t mind at all if you want more than two.

 

[Sancus]

Unless you listen only to recordings that were multi-channel miked at the source and then released as multi-channel (of which there almost none), I disagree.

There are thousands of multichannel albums recorded and mixed for release as multichannel. Well over 10,000 now that Atmos has become a thing actually, I'm not even sure what the count is anymore. Not all of them are good, but most of them sound much better than stereo.

E: I dont want to turn this into the multichannel thread. But "no content" is just a straight up myth, people need to stop parroting it.

 

[thewas]

There are thousands of multichannel albums recorded and mixed for release as multichannel. Well over 10,000 now that Atmos has become a thing actually, I'm not even sure what the count is anymore. Not all of them are good, but most of them sound much better than stereo.

E: I dont want to turn this into the multichannel thread. But "no content" is just a straight up myth, people need to stop parroting it.

Also for example Toole is a big fan of some good upmixers

https://www.harman.com/documents/HowManyChannels_0.pdf

Horn Speakers - Is it me or.......

Who records stereo or multich with "1-mic 1-track 1-channel"??? That's called mono Indeed. It's very challenging to record mono thus. Like Dilbert and his database: https://dilbert.com/strip/1992-09-08

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[MarkS]

Exactly zero of the ~500 recordings I own (on CD and LP) were recorded multi-channel.

Toole may like the gimmick of upmixing, but I have no interest in bothering with it.

 

[Pearljam5000]

There are thousands of multichannel albums recorded and mixed for release as multichannel. Well over 10,000 now that Atmos has become a thing actually, I'm not even sure what the count is anymore. Not all of them are good, but most of them sound much better than stereo.

E: I dont want to turn this into the multichannel thread. But "no content" is just a straight up myth, people need to stop parroting it.

So you're limited to 10,000 albums ?

 

[amirm]

So where was it said that the comparison was said Revel speaker? And what are they saying is the same price? Which Magico speaker costs the same?

 

[thewas]

Wish all audiophiles would have experienced at least once a good multichannel setup, then they would know what they are missing. By the way due to current space limitations I also just have stereo systems but I also know what I would do if I had the choice.

 

[GXAlan]

So where was it said that the comparison was said Revel speaker? And what are they saying is the same price? Which Magico speaker costs the same?

I agree. Pure internet speculation that it is Revel.

The A5 is $25k, YT comments confirms it’s not Sonus Faber. The Revel isn’t in that price range.

The driver spacing is off, but it could be something like the Sony SS-AR1 or something silly like that.

 

[Soniclife]

Hey @amirm, when are you buying a crane so you can measure really big speakers , don't let simple physics hold you back.

 

[changer]

Agreed, the most valuable information for this forum and @amirm is in the second video at 25 minutes!

 

[fpitas]

It's a sad comment on our hobby that we expect Magico to be mediocre like so many other high-end brands.

 

[RayDunzl]

At the Florida Audio Expo in 2021, the big Magico room was the only setup that activated some lust in my lust neuron.

They weren't playing loudly, but the music was just - hard to explain, of course - floating in the room, not "coming" from anywhere.

Woof.

Magico M9 (I think) Nope, M6.

Not enough lust was activated to do anything more than file the experience away in my stare and compare neuron, though.

Listened to my stuff when I got home, it's good enough.

Multichannel? I don't think I care.

 

[RayDunzl]

Aren't the two videos in the original post the same?

I think we're missing somthing.

 

[LearningToSmile]

Aren't the two videos in the original post the same?

I think we're missing somthing.

They're timestamps to two different parts of the same video, so if you hit play it will start from the moments @richard12511 mentioned in the opening post.