JBL 705P Studio Monitor Review

[TimVG]

You rarely hear of a Genelec failing in the field - there are in fact reliable active speakers out there.

 

[Frank Dernie]

I'm in the same camp, I'll keep my amps & speakers separate. I don't know what the problem is but seems all the active speakers & powered subs have a high failure rate. I'm keeping my fingers crossed on my 2 5yo HSU subwoofers don't let the smoke out any time soon. Having things separate also keeps the possibilities open to upgrade or modify the individual pieces as desired.

I have been lucky.
OTOH there is no DSP in my subwoofer or surrounds and centre since they are too old.
The Sub is a REL from the time when Richard Lloyd still ran his company.
The others are Meridian M33s which I bought used almost 20 years ago.

Never had a problem with any of them.

Digital kit is always being "updated" both hardware and software so none of it is going to be engineered to last as long as I am used to keeping stuff. The updates are not always upgrades IMO.
Just now I use a surround sound decoder to do room compensation. That may need to change more often.

 

[BDWoody]

Both my 705s are faulty now , the last ones now stuck in some kind of low volume/no bass situation.

That totally sucks...
Considering myself lucky with 9/9 of my 7 series (all B stock) still functioning perfectly.
Are you getting any warranty coverage?

 

[stevenswall]

Why are people going to separates over JBL being unreliable? Genelec exists, and seems to have beaten JBL at their own game based on the scores here.

 

[stunta]

Why are people going to separates over JBL being unreliable? Genelec exists, and seems to have beaten JBL at their own game based on the scores here.

For some reason I thought Genelecs were a lot more expensive. The JBL 708Ps have 8" drivers and I just looked up the Genelec 8050B and its about the same price. The other reason I went with the JBLs is that its supposed to be based on the M2 design and people here treat that as the ultimate speaker. I feel there is a lot of bias on ASR towards Harman products and I add to it.

There is also one more factor for me personally - Genelecs just look weird. Not that the JBLs are pretty, but they at least have a clean boxy shape.

 

[beefkabob]

Why are people going to separates over JBL being unreliable? Genelec exists, and seems to have beaten JBL at their own game based on the scores here.

Genelec is overpriced and offten has low db limits.

 

[stevenswall]

Genelec is overpriced and offten has low db limits.

Used 8260 monitors are $5k. Isn't that the same as the 708 new? Mine are a decade old. Still working well. Loud is something I wish I could bankrupt companies over. The only engineering mistake I see from Genelec is catering to the people who want loud, as their new speakers get louder, and are less accurate and less extended than their decade old 8260.

Guess I don't turn things up too loud either, because to me, one Devialet Phantom Reactor in a living room is stupidly, annoyingly, I hate my ears and I hate music and I never want to hear it again, loud.


That's only 98db or so max. Don't most Genelecs go louder than that?

Other than total volume, I'm not sure I buy the "dynamics" argument some make until I see evidence that non-JBL speakers dynamically compress things. Many seem to use Dynamics as a word to hide "I want big loud yes, more, much, such loud, boom wow!"

This could also be why few care about speaker hiss though.

 

[LDKTA]

Zero issues here with my 708s.

 

[richard12511]

Used 8260 monitors are $5k. Isn't that the same as the 708 new? Mine are a decade old. Still working well. Loud is something I wish I could bankrupt companies over. The only engineering mistake I see from Genelec is catering to the people who want loud, as their new speakers get louder, and are less accurate and less extended than their decade old 8260.

Guess I don't turn things up too loud either, because to me, one Devialet Phantom Reactor in a living room is stupidly, annoyingly, I hate my ears and I hate music and I never want to hear it again, loud.


That's only 98db or so max. Don't most Genelecs go louder than that?

Other than total volume, I'm not sure I buy the "dynamics" argument some make until I see evidence that non-JBL speakers dynamically compress things. Many seem to use Dynamics as a word to hide "I want big loud yes, more, much, such loud, boom wow!"

This could also be why few care about speaker hiss though.

I'm glad they're starting to favor loudness over extension, as to me it's far more important. Extension is basically meaningless for me, as I cross to subs at 100hz, and no speakers could ever get close to the quality of bass I have right now(mainly due to positioning). However, I do care about accuracy. I suppose I'm ok with trading a little accuracy for more spl, though not sure where I draw the line there, as both are super important to me.

This does kinda highlight the need for having multiple lines(which I think Genelec does a good job of), though, as people have different wants/needs.

 

[stevenswall]

For some reason I thought Genelecs were a lot more expensive. The JBL 708Ps have 8" drivers and I just looked up the Genelec 8050B and its about the same price. The other reason I went with the JBLs is that its supposed to be based on the M2 design and people here treat that as the ultimate speaker. I feel there is a lot of bias on ASR towards Harman products and I add to it.

There is also one more factor for me personally - Genelecs just look weird. Not that the JBLs are pretty, but they at least have a clean boxy shape.

Yes, the M2 was great for it's time and controlling dispersion horizontally... But that's literally old news these days and they are resting on their laurels now, as can be seen by the 8341, which is ~4 steps down from being a flagship, beating all the Harman speakers on here I've seen so far.

Looks wise, that's too bad. A sphere or Genelec style cabinets seem to be the best.

JBL, Focal, Adam, Dutch & Dutch, and many others use box shaped cabinets that are more likely to reflect internal sound and resonate, and purposefully, willfully, omit using coaxial drivers, because they do not care about vertical dispersion, diffraction, and internal reflections being minimized. I can understand for normal speakers, but not flagships.

In the case of the M2, they charge you to stuff the internal volume full of bracing to make extra sure their massive woofer can't go too low, because they'd rather solve their self made problem with bracing and thicker wood, which seems to me like the east, non-ideal way to deal with it.

The Phantom, a lifestyle speaker product, could teach their engineers things in several areas. I can only imagine competent engineers from Devialet making a $20,000 set of Phantoms, yet Devialet gets shunned even though those who have heard them really appreciate them and they seem to measure well.

The bias towards JBL seems justified relative to companies that just stick drivers on boxes without waveguides. Relative to an edge to edge waveguide that melts into the cabinet and has a virtually seamless surface from half way back on the speaker all the way to the middle of the tweeter, (the Genelec 8260) they all fall short, including the JBL M2 if it's just a scaled up, too expensive, louder 708p. I'd probably choose the 708p and get subs since bass extension on the M2 does not seem proportionate to the size.

 

[stevenswall]

I'm glad they're starting to favor loudness over extension, as to me it's far more important.

Never had a speaker that was too quiet unless it was a Bluetooth speaker. Seems like everything these days used as intended goes loud enough to cause long term hearing damage.

Maybe for someone mixing and mastering a film for cinema need that loudness, but I think most of those people, most live sound engineers, and most people who churn out pop hits and best selling albums, are destroying generations of art with their incompetence and love of loud at all costs.

 

[LDKTA]

Used 8260 monitors are $5k. Isn't that the same as the 708 new? Mine are a decade old. Still working well. Loud is something I wish I could bankrupt companies over. The only engineering mistake I see from Genelec is catering to the people who want loud, as their new speakers get louder, and are less accurate and less extended than their decade old 8260.

Guess I don't turn things up too loud either, because to me, one Devialet Phantom Reactor in a living room is stupidly, annoyingly, I hate my ears and I hate music and I never want to hear it again, loud.


That's only 98db or so max. Don't most Genelecs go louder than that?

Other than total volume, I'm not sure I buy the "dynamics" argument some make until I see evidence that non-JBL speakers dynamically compress things. Many seem to use Dynamics as a word to hide "I want big loud yes, more, much, such loud, boom wow!"

This could also be why few care about speaker hiss though.

It’s called personal preference and preference is inviolate. I love Genelec loudspeakers too but I wouldn’t replace my 708s with the 8050s (I say the 8050s because they are two-ways with an 8” woofer and are at the same price point). All of the loudspeakers mentioned are designed well and at these levels of performance/behavior, you’d be splitting hairs. It’ll always come down to personal preference.

You don’t buy the “dynamics” argument? What? Do you not realize just how important dynamics are when it comes to sound reproduction? Do you not realize just how dynamic live music is? Compression also exists and it sucks. There’s nothing to buy into... Genelec loudspeakers are also designed to be very dynamic.

Others also care about residual noise... some more than others (like yourself) it’s all about priorities and preferences though at the end of the day. The Genelec’s also have residual noise. If it isn’t audible to someone, why should they stress themselves out about it? They shouldn’t.

As for QC, I’d definitely agree that it should be better. Once upon a time, it was. However, the company does offer a five year warranty and their customer service is exceptional. Again, it’ll come down to what you expect, what you want and what you like. It honestly just sounds to me as if you have it out for JBL and I’m not exactly sure why... No company makes a *perfect* loudspeaker.

 

[richard12511]

Never had a speaker that was too quiet unless it was a Bluetooth speaker. Seems like everything these days used as intended goes loud enough to cause long term hearing damage.

Maybe for someone mixing and mastering a film for cinema need that loudness, but I think most of those people, most live sound engineers, and most people who churn out pop hits and best selling albums, are destroying generations of art with their incompetence and love of loud at all costs.

Most of the speakers I own don't get near loud enough for me(Infinity Beta 20, Revel M105, JBL 305, JBL 308). They all start to sound too loud as you get up around 100db at the mlp. Based on your adjectives "stupidly, annoyingly, I hate my ears and I hate music and I never want to hear it again, loud" describing the Phantom, I suspect this is what's happening to you too. I get that exact same sensation with all of the speakers I mentioned above, but I never really feel that with my JTRs. At some point I do have to turn them down, as I can see by the spl meter on my phone that I'm damaging my ears, but it never gets painful like it does with the other less dynamic speakers.

Don't get me wrong, though, I do think there's probably a design tradeoff between max output and accuracy, and I'm not sure where I would draw that line, as I do care about both. I really don't care about extension, though.

 

[LDKTA]

Yes, the M2 was great for it's time and controlling dispersion horizontally... But that's literally old news these days and they are resting on their laurels now, as can be seen by the 8341, which is ~4 steps down from being a flagship, beating all the Harman speakers on here I've seen so far.

Looks wise, that's too bad. A sphere or Genelec style cabinets seem to be the best.

JBL, Focal, Adam, Dutch & Dutch, and many others use box shaped cabinets that are more likely to reflect internal sound and resonate, and purposefully, willfully, omit using coaxial drivers, because they do not care about vertical dispersion, diffraction, and internal reflections being minimized. I can understand for normal speakers, but not flagships.

In the case of the M2, they charge you to stuff the internal volume full of bracing to make extra sure their massive woofer can't go too low, because they'd rather solve their self made problem with bracing and thicker wood, which seems to me like the east, non-ideal way to deal with it.

The Phantom, a lifestyle speaker product, could teach their engineers things in several areas. I can only imagine competent engineers from Devialet making a $20,000 set of Phantoms, yet Devialet gets shunned even though those who have heard them really appreciate them and they seem to measure well.

The bias towards JBL seems justified relative to companies that just stick drivers on boxes without waveguides. Relative to an edge to edge waveguide that melts into the cabinet and has a virtually seamless surface from half way back on the speaker all the way to the middle of the tweeter, (the Genelec 8260) they all fall short, including the JBL M2 if it's just a scaled up, too expensive, louder 708p. I'd probably choose the 708p and get subs since bass extension on the M2 does not seem proportionate to the size.

If that’s all you think the M2 is then you have A LOT to learn. You should probably start with the transducers used in the M2.

The Devialet’s are very small and expensive. Who shuns them? I’m a fan but I’d never bother purchasing a pair because I know what else is available for the price.

“JBL, Focal, Adam, Dutch & Dutch, and many others use box shaped cabinets that are more likely to reflect internal sound and resonate, and purposefully, willfully, omit using coaxial drivers, because they do not care about vertical dispersion, diffraction, and internal reflections being minimized. I can understand for normal speakers, but not flagships.” It’s clear that you’re serious... but seriously. Tradeoffs. Coincident drivers are not perfect in any way shape or form. And if you truly think these companies don’t care about what you’ve mentioned, it is because you’re delusional. Mistaken and misinformed. It isn’t easy or simple to design loudspeakers of such a high caliber. Do you legitimately think the designers don’t think about vertical dispersion? Diffraction? Internal reflections? Get real.

I get it, Genelec is great... but the bias is strong with you.

 

[stunta]

I am very interested in hearing both sides of the story, but I am afraid personal attacks are going to derail what could be an informative argument. Please don't gang up on @stevenswall, instead, gang up on Genelec

 

[LDKTA]

I am very interested in hearing both sides of the story, but I am afraid personal attacks are going to derail what could be an informative argument. Please don't gang up on @stevenswall, instead, gang up on Genelec

He isn’t being ganged up on but he is saying things that are rather ridiculous. Genelec doesn’t need to be ganged up on either, they produce absolutely lovely loudspeakers.

There are no sides, it is apparent that JBL Pro has QC issues and it needs to be addressed accordingly.

 

[beefkabob]

Used 8260 monitors are $5k. Isn't that the same as the 708 new? Mine are a decade old. Still working well. Loud is something I wish I could bankrupt companies over. The only engineering mistake I see from Genelec is catering to the people who want loud, as their new speakers get louder, and are less accurate and less extended than their decade old 8260.

That's only 98db or so max. Don't most Genelecs go louder than that?

Other than total volume, I'm not sure I buy the "dynamics" argument some make until I see evidence that non-JBL speakers dynamically compress things. Many seem to use Dynamics as a word to hide "I want big loud yes, more, much, such loud, boom wow!"

This could also be why few care about speaker hiss though.

98db isn't going cut it for me. My 705p are rated for 101db continuous, and they do not get quite loud enough.

A pair of 708p is 4000 new at full price. They can probably be had new for less, and b-stock is half that price and essentially new. They go on b-stock sale every few months. So $2000 vs $5000 is quite significant. No way am I spending 5k on used speakers without a warranty.

Loud is good. Every been to a concert? They play loud. It allows dynamics, yes. Sure, the 705p will be loud enough if I'm listening nearfield, but I don't usually listen to music that way.

And the worst hiss the 705p make is only audible at those very nearfield distances. Beyond 1 meter, nature is louder.

Maybe for someone mixing and mastering a film for cinema need that loudness, but I think most of those people, most live sound engineers, and most people who churn out pop hits and best selling albums, are destroying generations of art with their incompetence and love of loud at all costs.

That seems to mix up recording loudness for overall volume. Recording loudness is when they just boost all the lows to the level of the highs, getting rid of dynamics and clipped throughout much if not all of the music. This kind of loudness is actually helpful in a loud car or with crappy headphones, which is what most people use. It sucks on a good stereo though. Overall volume can have very quiet lows and very loud highs.

Interestingly, one of my favorite songs was processed so that the very, very quiet start was made louder. Otherwise it wouldn't be audible on most stereos. The side effect is that the start has a lot of background hiss, as the noise floor had to be massively raised.

 

[Frank Dernie]

I get it, Genelec is great... but the bias is strong with you.

I did rather get the feeling that here JBL and Revel are worship fodder and others, even the ones better than them, get faint praise, or critiscised in some way.
If there is any bias here it is very, very strongly pro anything Harman and anything which follows the suggestions of one single (if extremely good) book.

 

[beefkabob]

At least a couple JBL products have been shown to be flawed to horribly flawed. I'm not worried about bias since the numbers speak for themselves. I'd like to see measurements of maximum sustained power vs distortion, a la databass. Say 20 tones showing distortion at different db at 1m.

 

[TimVG]

Guess I don't turn things up too loud either, because to me, one Devialet Phantom Reactor in a living room is stupidly, annoyingly, I hate my ears and I hate music and I never want to hear it again, loud.

Having owned the 708 and the 705, I find the Genelec 8030C gets plenty loud in my living room. I was actually a bit surprised about that part of the 8341 review.