Hegel H95 Review (Streaming Amplifier)

[voodooless]

He's telling you not to do that while cranking the analogue volume pot of the amplifier all the way up to 95%.

In fact, Hegel said why it was designed that way: to still be able to achieve high output with digital sources that basically do not have full-scale output. One could also see it as a natural compressor for higher dynamic range content

 

[abdo123]

see it as a natural compressor for higher dynamic range content

i think the word you're looking for here is amplifier. not compressor.

 

[voodooless]

i think the word you're looking for here is amplifier. not compressor.

No, the second line was more about content that does reach full scale, but also has high dynamic range. In that case, the amp will act as a compressor for those peeks that let it clip. Obviously all amps do this in the end

 

[Deleted member 40010]

There could always be the slight possible chance the first time you connected the H95 you accidentally wired one of your speakers in counter phase.
This would/could explain what you heard; lack of bass and really different sound.
When you tried it again you wired the speakers correctly later and voila 'normal' sound.

That was what I first suspected. Checked and triple checked the phase - I even played speaker polarity check test tones.

Anyway, I've taken it off topic. Despite all the chat about this the H95 still sounds very nice to me.

Cheers

 

[solderdude]

@amirm was feeding a digital signal and measuring the analogue outputs. How else should we supposed to use the amp???

Are you telling us that the digital input should never be fed full scale signal?

This was about a different plot and it already has been established that feeding the DAC 0dBFS and adjusting the Subwoofer out to 550mV is perfectly possible without the clipping alike distortion.

This and the 5W measurements are completely different things testing completely different aspects.

 

[solderdude]

I still don't really get it, he can still get 5W output by having full amplitude digital signal and bring the volume knob on the amplifier down.

It's very counterintuitive and frankly kind of borderline malicious tbh.

Let me put it this way:

Use a DAC with a somewhat high noise level like the one in the Hegel or say the Razor adapter.
Feed it a 0dB FS signal and the S/N ratio is say... -90dB (which is poor).
Feed the output signal to an amplifier that has lots of gain and set the volume control at say ... level '30' so that 5W output is achieved.
For arguments sake lets assume the amp has 100dB S/N ratio.
The output of the amp will have noise determined by the DAC and will be 90dB.

Now.. we use another method.
Set the 5W so that a specific input value is needed (so all amplifiers have a comparable gain).
Because the Hegel has a high gain the volume control is set at '95' which requires 157mV in analog input signal.
Now, at the same volume control level (so standardized gain) the DAC also needs to put out 157mV where 0dB FS is 2.4V (assumption not seen measurements other than 2.0V in '98' position)
To get the DAC to output 157mV it must be set at -24dB digital input level (coming from the mentioned 2.4V).
That causes the S/N ratio to also drop by 24dB so from 90dB to 66dB.

The 0dB line in the plot is dBr so the 157mV output is now 0dB.

Hope this explanation helps.

The measurement would have been more favorable if the digital input would have been 0dBFS and the volume control would have been dialed back 24dB. The S/N ratio (in this real world scenario) would thus be much better.

Alas, due to Amir wanting all amps to have similar gain for comparative reasons this resulted in the mentioned measurement.
The measurement is not wrong. It is comparable to other amps where gain was set in the same way but the incorporated DAC threw some dirt in the measurement which should be taken into account.

 

[killdozzer]

Why do you suddenly dislike the sound that you were happy with?

Thanks. All I need to know.

As much as I try, I can't seem to remember one single instance where acting like an A-hole helped anyone. Perhaps you could stop trying.

Can you be so easily led to another path simply by reading something?

Now, @amper42 I don't know you and you might be a very smart, bright, intelligent person otherwise, but this has to be the lamest reasoning I've come across. Take a step back and realize you're actually asking someone why should he learn by reading and after he learns something why should he act upon what he learned. Something that should be as human as it comes. The person you're asking these questions wanted sound AND quality. He was tricked on quality. Enough said.

Let me give YOU an example. You buy a house and really love it and enjoy it. You throw a party and a lot of people come. A wall collapses. And then you have this guy explaining how wrong you are to want to move since you used to enjoy it. (!?!?) Luckily, we're not there yet, we have a situation where an expert comes in time to save the day and says it's highly likely to have a wall collapsing. YES!! move right away, get rid of the sh... and just bring happy memories with you.

Your confusing input and output here.

Sorry, you seem to have no clue about what drives the price of a product.

And you're confusing your with you are. You really need to get off your high horse. A larger amount of effort is required where there's lack of skill and mastery. So you get an equation where the same performance with less knowledge and more effort deserves to get a higher value (going by your reasoning). A company may take 5 years just to do what Yamaha does in one week. Would it really be smart for them to ask for more money on account of effort? Effort is a new wishy-washy buzz word in the vein of equal outcome guarantee. It's under-performing and then going on about how you really put your whole heart into it.

If I went against Ivanisevic in tennis I'd puke my lungs from effort, he OTOH would get results with no effort. perhaps you think you found some magic formula and look down on others, but you shouldn't cause it's not.

Having an amplifier with a sound quality that is good enough in the sense that I can not detect a difference between it and another (better measuring) amplifier, and do I want/need to use headphones, or not, are not mutually exclusive alternatives to each other. A customer may include them both, or one of them, or neither one of them in his/her purchasing criteria.

Your logic is completely wrong or rather it's an absence of logic. A simple fact that you can find an equally "pretty" amp that does not have all the shortcomings renders all your reasoning superfluous. It would only make sense if it was very, very cheap amp and you don't care cause you're going for the minimum investment that merely covers your few needs. In this case, however, it doesn't make sense. You don't buy expensive crap because you don't need it not to be crap. Imagine I visit you at your home and notice your dog left a huge turd in a corner and you go out of your way explaining how you don't use that corner so from your user point of view it's not a turd. And it's an old turd so to you subjectively it doesn't smell. Imagine saying you don't need your 200k car to go fast and then your wife's water breaks... Your head would be the next thing to break.

Subjective experience is not an end-all mode of existence. If it's a turd get rid of it and cut with the over-explaining. You shouldn't pay 2k for 200$ performance.

@UzbcuRA Don't pay any attention to spouters of misery, you're the hero of the thread. You learned, acted and moved on. The only sad thing is how rare that became, more rare than unicorns and this thread proves it. You're literally being questioned by people who are asking why you stopped using ivermectin after it was proven ineffective if you felt subjectively better? Today we have way too much people who continue acting upon BS after all the facts, that is what's truly post-truth about our moment in history. It's a good thing not everyone is this way and you are not. You should sell the Hegel precisely to those who still think it's worth it and do it fast without any discounts. These units will lose in value and you should drop yours as any smart person would do.

 

[solderdude]

That was what I first suspected. Checked and triple checked the phase - I even played speaker polarity check test tones.

Anyway, I've taken it off topic. Despite all the chat about this the H95 still sounds very nice to me.

Cheers

Then we can rule out the phase. This leaves but two conclusions.
1: The amp, for some inexplicable reason, had bass roll-off which repaired itself permanently.
2: Something to do with the brain.

Since nothing was measured and no reports from users having the same experience and knowing a little bit about electronics I would chalk it up to number 2.

 

[sarumbear]

This was about a different plot and it already has been established that feeding the DAC 0dBFS and adjusting the Subwoofer out to 550mV is perfectly possible without the clipping alike distortion.

This and the 5W measurements are completely different things testing completely different aspects.

They are but they both point to the same design error. Line outputs distort when the power amplifier is clipping.

 

[killdozzer]

After 47 pages I think it's safe to say we've arrived to the point where we can extrapolate the definition of an audiophool. I seem to remember we needed that for another thread so it's not going to waste.

Here goes:
An audiophool is a person who, while swearing by their hearing, hears improvement where there's none and doesn't hear distortion where there's some.

 

[Dogcoop]

As much as I try, I can't seem to remember one single instance where acting like an A-hole helped anyone. Perhaps you could stop trying.

Now, @amper42 I don't know you and you might be a very smart, bright, intelligent person otherwise, but this has to be the lamest reasoning I've come across. Take a step back and realize you're actually asking someone why should he learn by reading and after he learns something why should he act upon what he learned. Something that should be as human as it comes. The person you're asking these questions wanted sound AND quality. He was tricked on quality. Enough said.

Let me give YOU an example. You buy a house and really love it and enjoy it. You throw a party and a lot of people come. A wall collapses. And then you have this guy explaining how wrong you are to want to move since you used to enjoy it. (!?!?) Luckily, we're not there yet, we have a situation where an expert comes in time to save the day and says it's highly likely to have a wall collapsing. YES!! move right away, get rid of the sh... and just bring happy memories with you.


And you're confusing your with you are. You really need to get off your high horse. A larger amount of effort is required where there's lack of skill and mastery. So you get an equation where the same performance with less knowledge and more effort deserves to get a higher value (going by your reasoning). A company may take 5 years just to do what Yamaha does in one week. Would it really be smart for them to ask for more money on account of effort? Effort is a new wishy-washy buzz word in the vein of equal outcome guarantee. It's under-performing and then going on about how you really put your whole heart into it.

If I went against Ivanisevic in tennis I'd puke my lungs from effort, he OTOH would get results with no effort. perhaps you think you found some magic formula and look down on others, but you shouldn't cause it's not.


Your logic is completely wrong or rather it's an absence of logic. A simple fact that you can find an equally "pretty" amp that does not have all the shortcomings renders all your reasoning superfluous. It would only make sense if it was very, very cheap amp and you don't care cause you're going for the minimum investment that merely covers your few needs. In this case, however, it doesn't make sense. You don't buy expensive crap because you don't need it not to be crap. Imagine I visit you at your home and notice your dog left a huge turd in a corner and you go out of your way explaining how you don't use that corner so from your user point of view it's not a turd. And it's an old turd so to you subjectively it doesn't smell. Imagine saying you don't need your 200k car to go fast and then your wife's water breaks... Your head would be the next thing to break.

Subjective experience is not an end-all mode of existence. If it's a turd get rid of it and cut with the over-explaining. You shouldn't pay 2k for 200$ performance.

@UzbcuRA Don't pay any attention to spouters of misery, you're the hero of the thread. You learned, acted and moved on. The only sad thing is how rare that became, more rare than unicorns and this thread proves it. You're literally being questioned by people who are asking why you stopped using ivermectin after it was proven ineffective if you felt subjectively better? Today we have way too much people who continue acting upon BS after all the facts, that is what's truly post-truth about our moment in history. It's a good thing not everyone is this way and you are not. You should sell the Hegel precisely to those who still think it's worth it and do it fast without any discounts. These units will lose in value and you should drop yours as any smart person would do.

WOW!!!

 

[VoRAT]

As much as I try, I can't seem to remember one single instance where acting like an A-hole helped anyone. Perhaps you could stop trying.

I’m sorry, but I didn’t realise that asking someone why they suddenly disliked an amplifier they bought via audition was “A-hole” behaviour. I was genuinely interested.

 

[solderdude]

They are but they both point to the same design error. Line outputs distort when the power amplifier is clipping.

I would agree it is a design error but only when the line-out is used in ways it was not intended to be used. It does not happen in normal usage nor when other Hegel amps or sensitive SWers are used.
The word line-out on the back is incorrect (fail by Hegel) and the assumption an undistorted 2V would be available is very logical. This, besides the stupid way Hegel implemented it, is confounded by the third stupidity of Hegel which does not specify the output levels.

It's a fail in many ways ... but... when used as intended (so not as a separate DAC with 2.4V out at 100% volume) it is much less of a fail is what I am trying to convey.

 

[killdozzer]

I’m sorry, but I didn’t realise that asking someone why they suddenly disliked an amplifier they bought via audition was “A-hole” behaviour. I was genuinely interested.

Maybe I made a mistake, but let's see if I did. The guy was feeling down because of a bad choice and then you implied he should have his head examined. You asked him why and when he said maybe it's a question for a therapist, you said that's all you needed to hear.

Am I wrong? I'm open to the possibility.

 

[amper42]

I’m sorry, but I didn’t realise that asking someone why they suddenly disliked an amplifier they bought via audition was “A-hole” behaviour. I was genuinely interested.

I find the forum ignore button useful to quiet the roar of aggressive abusive posters. Click on their icon, press ignore and let the moderator eventually deal with them. Your screen no longer displays the spew of garbage.

 

[VoRAT]

Maybe I made a mistake, but let's see if I did. The guy was feeling down because of a bad choice and then you implied he should have his head examined. You asked him why and when he said maybe it's a question for a therapist, you said that's all you needed to hear.

Am I wrong? I'm open to the possibility.

I implied nothing of the sort. He obviously didn’t want to answer my question, so I left it at that. Do you need a Monday hug or something?

 

[killdozzer]

I find the forum ignore button useful to quiet the roar of aggressive abusive posters. Click on their icon, press ignore and let the moderator eventually deal with them. Your screen no longer displays the spew of garbage.

Ah, you're trying to master the technique of asking questions and not hearing the answers you don't like. We really need more people like you. All of a sudden, it's no mystery to me you wouldn't learn and improve your decision making.

Guess what, I never used the ignore button, not even on members like you. I even read your entire post dumb as it may be. Go figure.

 

[killdozzer]

I implied nothing of the sort. He obviously didn’t want to answer my question, so I left it at that. Do you need a Monday hug or something?

Well then I was wrong and I apologize! (I'm still suspicious, why would you say all you needed to hear was that he needs to see a shrink??) Maybe it's a miscommunication.

 

[Dogcoop]

Ah, you're trying to master the technique of asking questions and not hearing the answers you don't like. We really need more people like you. All of a sudden, it's no mystery to me you wouldn't learn and improve your decision making.

Guess what, I never used the ignore button, not even on members like you. I even read your entire post dumb as it may be. Go figure.

I will use the ignore button, even though you don’t.

 

[VoRAT]

Well then I was wrong and I apologize! (I'm still suspicious, why would you say all you needed to hear was that he needs to see a shrink??) Maybe it's a miscommunication.

It was a bit of an odd answer on his part. I’m suspicious, I suppose.