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You might reasonably view the 8010As as a design exercise to see how much you can fit into a small package. Otherwise, you'll often see pros using 8030s in a travel situation (see Genelec 8030.LSE Broadcast Pak and Triple Play).
But these speakers are also marketed to the home theater / room ambience crowds as the G One and 4010A respectively. When you think about those situations, shooting for around 80 Hz before significant rolloff makes sense because they will usually be paired with a subwoofer. Who wants to invest an equal amount of money in full-range surrounds unless you're working in a mastering facility (or simply have a mega budget)?
They don't need a sub for typical desktop use. They have a very satisfying balanced sound with just enough bass. This is unlike many small speakers that sound tinny without a sub, and boomy with one.
Yeah, I see what you mean, they do seem to have 25Hz lower, not 40. I misread where it starts to fall off.I don't understand how you worked out that they give 15dB lower SPL? Max SPL doesn't seem a whole lot different from these Genelecs as far as I can tell (from the limited data we have). And the iLouds seem to have about 25Hz lower bass extension, not 40Hz.
You keep saying it's not $700 good, but what other speaker is this small with actually competitive measurements? Form factor isn't worthless. On this forum at least, I've seen nothing remotely this small that gets all too close to a preference rating of 5.Again, nothing really does holding it to a low enough max SPL output. The point being as always, they're good, just not $700 good from what I see.
Yeah, I see what you mean, they do seem to have 25Hz lower, not 40. I misread where it starts to fall off.
As far as the difference in max SPL, looking at it more closely than I did before, the Genelec's response seems to be around 87dB, where the iLoud's seems to be around 75dB. I worked it out by, discounting the bass roll off, mentally drawing a perpendicular-to-x-axis line of best fit for each speaker's response, and making that the dB level it's at the max SPL. Did I miss something?
Sort of. Are the built-in amps restricting how accurately you can measure max SPL somehow? What's arbitrary about the level- what determines the level at which they're measured at if it's not just cranked to max?Ah yes, I see what you've done. Since these are active speakers, the decibel levels at which Amir and @napilopez chose to measure them are entirely arbitrary (i.e. it's not like a passive speaker where we typically input 2.83V to determine the sensitivity). So there's no point comparing the absolute levels that these two speakers were measured at. Does that make sense?
Sort of. Are the built-in amps restricting how accurately you can measure max SPL somehow?
It's a long story...Interesting perspective. I at least partly agree, but am curious as to how you arrived at it?
Ahh, gotcha. I just assumed it's standard to measure max SPL in tandem with frequency response.No no, it's just that napilopez didn't measure the iLoud's max SPL at all. He just measured the speaker at an arbitrary level of around 75dB.
However, iLoud claims on their website that the speaker's max output (defined as 10% THD) is equivalent to around 88dB/1m @ 100Hz.
Amir measured the 8010 to be producing a slightly lesser amount of distortion at a slightly lower SPL (86dB). Assuming the iLoud's specs are accurate (a big if!), I'm inferring that the two should have similar max SPLs.
Ahh, gotcha. I just assumed it's standard to measure max SPL in tandem with frequency response.
Yeah, the max SPLs should be very similar then- which is nice. The iLouds are definitely an even easier sell now that I know I could crank them to even louder levels in portable setups I have planned for them!
Ah yes, I see what you've done. Since these are active speakers, the decibel levels at which Amir and @napilopez chose to measure them are entirely arbitrary (i.e. it's not like a passive speaker where we typically input 2.83V to determine the sensitivity). So there's no point comparing the absolute levels that these two speakers were measured at. Does that make sense?
Sort of. Are the built-in amps restricting how accurately you can measure max SPL somehow? What's arbitrary about the level- what determines the level at which they're measured at if it's not just cranked to max?
You keep saying it's not $700 good, but what other speaker is this small with actually competitive measurements? Form factor isn't worthless. On this forum at least, I've seen nothing remotely this small that gets all too close to a preference rating of 5.
Besides, think of all the overpriced portable bluetooth junk out there. Some definitely are in this price bracket, with a similar compactness to a pair of 8010As, while possessing a guaranteed-worse sound than the 8010As.
There is a brand tax you're paying with this. Which I guess is fine, but not really in the realm of good discussion if you're talking about value comparisons.
...and not as compact. Let alone that 3.9 is quite far from 5.1. The Genelecs are double the price, but that doesn't really warrant a need for double the score. Score just isn't linear with price enough for that to be feasible in general. Also, the the 6.6 score of the Vanatoo with a sub being 1.4 off from the Genelec's 8 is quite significant for those caring more about tonality in the mid to high ranges than bass extension.
I'm not sure what makes you think portable bluetooth speakers just suddenly "stop" at $200. Much much more premium options exist- and they're silly boutique stuff pivoting off of the layman's attraction to supreme convenience.As for "overpriced bluetooth junk" those are speakers that are in the $100-$200 dollar range, so I don't actually expect them to rival a Genelec or be all that impressive from the get-go, but if I wanted impressive performance, I wouldn't be looking for 3-inch woofers.
The value comes from the size. Nothing else exists that sounds as good that is as small as the 8010A. I guess like my lack of care for connectivity on a speaker, you simply differ in how you value form factor.Simply not seeing the value from a performance standpoint, nor from a features standpoint really..
The issue here is that in genelec, size = money. It's not that smaller makes it more valuable. It's that it's the only option. They don't have anything cheaper larger and better. So for this pricr range genelec doesn't have anything to offer for higher SPL....and not as compact. Let alone that 3.9 is quite far from 5.1. The Genelecs are double the price, but that doesn't really warrant a need for double the score. Score just isn't linear with price enough for that to be feasible in general. Also, the the 6.6 score of the Vanatoo with a sub being 1.4 off from the Genelec's 8 is quite significant for those caring more about tonality in the mid to high ranges than bass extension.
I don't attach much value to connectivity options. Competent dongles that aren't that obtrusive can fill the niches that the Vanatoo offers like Bluetooth for very very cheap.
I'm not sure what makes you think portable bluetooth speakers just suddenly "stop" at $200. Much much more premium options exist- and they're silly boutique stuff pivoting off of the layman's attraction to supreme convenience.
$200+: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=portable+bluetooth+speaker&rh=n:172282,p_36:1253507011&dc&qid=1603156484&rnid=386442011&ref=sr_nr_p_36_5
$700+: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=portable+bluetooth+speaker&rh=p_36:70000-&qid=1603156471&rnid=386442011&ref=sr_nr_p_36_5
When you factor in that those are mono, even a single 8010A becomes an extremely appealing portable speaker, with some jerry-rigging of batteries, bluetooth, and such.
You could even use a Minirig portable sub for bass extension: https://minirigs.co.uk/speakers/minirig-subwoofer-3
The value comes from the size. Nothing else exists that sounds as good that is as small as the 8010A. I guess like my lack of care for connectivity on a speaker, you simply differ in how you value form factor.
True, Genelecs are indeed more expensive the bigger (and louder) you go. However, in terms of general product landscape tangibility for the consumer, there's really nothing else as small that performs as well as the 8010A. That's what I meant by the value in its compactness- I didn't mean it relative to the rest of Genelec's line.The issue here is that in genelec, size = money. It's not that smaller makes it more valuable. It's that it's the only option. They don't have anything cheaper larger and better. So for this pricr range genelec doesn't have anything to offer for higher SPL.
Hence. I don't think the point that it's this good and small. No, it's the only option. We can't get this good but cheaper or larger. SPL sacrifice is probably essential to make this good level of performance in a sense.
That is subject to the people not from genelec. Many people don't care about size(some do I know, I mentioned earlier in this thread), thus this doesn't appeal to them. It's fine.True, Genelecs are indeed more expensive the bigger you go. However, in terms of general product landscape tangibility for the consumer, there's really nothing else as small that performs as well. That's what I meant by the value in its compactness, not relative to the rest of Genelec's line.