2020 Corvette Convertible $66,400

[gikigill]

Tisk Tisk, your overwhelming desire to own something you never can drives you to lame attempts at insulting me. That's OK.
I do feel bad though the your hearing is so badly distorted you hear things the way you do.
I have no idea how you ever got in to music??? SAD

That was meant for Ron, not you but whatever.

 

[gikigill]

Obviously, living upside down has had an effect on your hearing.

Yup, it's made it better and more responsive to pitch and tune.

 

[gikigill]

I uh... I have a hard time putting the GLA45 AMG in the same class as other more AMG-y AMG cars.

Maybe it's just the ones I've seen here, but the two or three GLA45 AMG I've seen all look and sound like ricer cars.

0-100 in under 4.5 seconds. You decide the rest.

 

[Blumlein 88]

If this is gonna turn into some kind of hate thread, I'd like to suggest two targets. SUV's (please regulate them out of existence), and diesels. Hopefully the future won't follow the railroads and diesel-electric SUVs take over the roads.

I don't feel so bad about hating things, but hating on others is not really needed on the forum is it?

If you like diesels, or SUV's don't hate on me, just explain why I must be crazy wrong.

I've seen the idea people don't want their choice of an ICE regulated out of existence, but what about the vehicle that was regulated into existence? SUV's were basically regulated into existence by regulating real automobiles, and exempting SUV's as trucks. So the cars that once were large and luxurious mostly didn't happen at mass production levels, and SUV's snuck in the back door to replace big automobiles. Like your basic Chevy Impalas, Buicks, Ford LTD's stuff like that. Now we have Tahoes, Explorers, and others trying to get a piece of that pie. And alongside of it the rise of the fancy as any luxury car pickup truck (the most popular vehicle). I guess SUV's are just an adaptation of the truck for those that need something more sedan or wagon like. Oh, and to keep on topic, I'll take a Corvette, any Corvette over any of these. I'd also take a Tesla over any of them (except if it was a Tesla cybertruck abomination to wheeled things).

 

[gikigill]

A hybrid Corvette that can do 50mpg would be even more welcome. Case in point Mclaren P1 with a V8, continent crushing performance and 34mpg fuel consumption. The US is leading in electric tech so this would be the next logical step because contrary to popular opinion, those who buy luxury cars care as much or more about mpg.

SUVs are more complicated as they allow other cars to be subsided. GM needs to sell trucks/SUVs to afford to make the Corvette nowadays just like how the Cayenne saved Porsche. Not enough Corvette buyers to afford making the Corvette on its own.

That said, I will buy a Euro wagon than ANY SUV when I decide to have a kid over the next few years. Car like handling and maintenance is cheaper than SUVs.

BTW to those worried about the "lefties" here's the hippy Saudis/Chinese/Indians investing in renewables.

https://cleantechnica.com/2019/11/2...gawatts-of-renewable-energy-capacity-by-2022/

https://www.reuters.com/article/sau...e-drive-to-diversify-energy-mix-idUSL8N1HP10B

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/09/27/china-proposes-75-increase-to-2030-renewable-energy-target/

 

[DKT88]

I searched for "forum threads degenerate into climate change" thinking there would be a new term for this phenomena like some variant of Godwin's Law. I didn't find a new term, but this thread came up number 4 in the Google search.

 

[digicidal]

I'm as myopic as the next person when it comes to environmentalism... which is where all of the problems occur in these types of discussions. As someone who loves big-displacement power, throaty exhausts, and "spirited" driving (which legislators all refer to as "reckless, unsafe, or wasteful")... I don't want anyone touching that - since it's my personal catharsis (and makes earning all those taxes I pay a little more tolerable).

On the other hand, as someone who doesn't have (nor want) any children - I'm perfectly fine with regulated reproduction... or for that matter even forced sterilization. If it means subsidized vasectomies/hysterectomies vs. paying for your own - even better! Not a fan of sports... so lets get rid of all those as well. Golf courses - especially in the desert where I live... GONE! I could go on but you get the idea.

The problem with regulations is the same as with the waste involved in almost all consumer goods... everyone is in favor of them when they restrict or prohibit what other people like/want... but not when it's their hobby/recreation/ideology. Unless we all suddenly get comfortable with the idea of there being no recreational, luxury, "enthusiast", etc. products - then we're going down that road whether we like it or not.

And if that's the case... then I personally would prefer the final drive into the sunset to be an enjoyable one.

On a related side-note... I would definitely be willing to accept an EV-only world... if the trade-off was the complete elimination of speed limits!

 

[DKT88]

Golf courses - especially in the desert where I live... GONE!

The fireworks just started in Vegas, no I'm not on the strip! I wonder how long all the irrigated green can be sustained in the Vegas valley.

 

[digicidal]

The fireworks just started in Vegas, no I'm not on the strip! I wonder how long all the irrigated green can be sustained in the Vegas valley.

At the current rate and considering the state of Lake Mead... not very long at all. With the explosive growth and all the fountains, fake lakes, etc. I figure we've got less than another decade or two before rationing and/or costs become prohibitive. Of course, I don't plan on sticking around until it gets that bad.

I'm nowhere near there either (Henderson)... but I expect the fireworks and the barking dogs that accompany them to continue well into the morning. Thankfully I've got ear plugs.

 

[Sal1950]

So the cars that once were large and luxurious mostly didn't happen at mass production levels, and SUV's snuck in the back door to replace big automobiles. Like your basic Chevy Impalas, Buicks, Ford LTD's stuff like that. Now we have Tahoes, Explorers, and others trying to get a piece of that pie. And alongside of it the rise of the fancy as any luxury car pickup truck (the most popular vehicle). I guess SUV's are just an adaptation of the truck for those that need something more sedan or wagon like.

You got it right on the head D. The government and emission nazis regulated the large and comfortable vehicles we loved out of existence. So to fill market demand the manufacturers used lite trucks to give back people what they wanted. Last year the lite truck market in the US grew to 69%.
The US is not a dictatorship and people should be allowed to purchase the type of vehicle they really desire. Let the federal government do what they were created for, ensure we have a military that has the power to protect it's citizens from foreign threat and not be telling us what we can drive.

 

[Frank Dernie]

I'd like to suggest two targets. SUV's (please regulate them out of existence), and diesels.

I hate SUVs too, inefficient, heavy, dangerous (they fit low grip tyres to avoid roll-over), loathsome things.
Diesel I don't choose myself but outside the USA they are very common and the low down torque (and being more suitable for turbos than petrol engines) makes them a relaxed drive. My wife had a turbo diesel Golf and it was a nice economical cruiser.
I don't think hybrids, which I favour over either fully electric (too heavy, range anxiety, battery life) or ICE (just completely outdated in the world as is, even if not in the USA and Canada) will end up diesel electric since it is a heavy solution with high partriculate emissions, an Atkinson cycle petrol engine with electric motor is a light efficient more logical choice. Toyota have all the most intelligent solutions patented IMO.
The fact that it seems the best choice to me doesn't mean it will make it, of course since there is far more than sensible engineering in politics.

The naked ape is ruthless, selfish and greedy. Those that become "successful" in our sense of the word tend to be the most ruthless, most selfish and most greedy IME. This means that all politicians and business leaders target voting at the next election and tomorrows share price above anything. Expecting them to be doing what is right in the long term is naive at best.

I am pretty pessimistic. Attitudes I see everywhere make it clear that enough people choose an excuse of their choice to deny facts so they can continue to live the way they like. It is probably already too late anyway.

 

[Blumlein 88]

I hate SUVs too, inefficient, heavy, dangerous (they fit low grip tyres to avoid roll-over), loathsome things.
Diesel I don't choose myself but outside the USA they are very common and the low down torque (and being more suitable for turbos than petrol engines) makes them a relaxed drive. My wife had a turbo diesel Golf and it was a nice economical cruiser.
I don't think hybrids, which I favour over either fully electric (too heavy, range anxiety, battery life) or ICE (just completely outdated in the world as is, even if not in the USA and Canada) will end up diesel electric since it is a heavy solution with high partriculate emissions, an Atkinson cycle petrol engine with electric motor is a light efficient more logical choice. Toyota have all the most intelligent solutions patented IMO.
The fact that it seems the best choice to me doesn't mean it will make it, of course since there is far more than sensible engineering in politics.

The naked ape is ruthless, selfish and greedy. Those that become "successful" in our sense of the word tend to be the most ruthless, most selfish and most greedy IME. This means that all politicians and business leaders target voting at the next election and tomorrows share price above anything. Expecting them to be doing what is right in the long term is naive at best.

I am pretty pessimistic. Attitudes I see everywhere make it clear that enough people choose an excuse of their choice to deny facts so they can continue to live the way they like. It is probably already too late anyway.

I read this almost like I'm reading something I posted. That should either encourage me or perhaps alarm you.

The naked ape yes. The few people I've known in truly competitive endeavors seem to indicate competition brings out the very worst in people. And such people who are successful are special a-holes. Yet the naked ape in all of us adore them at the pinnacles of competition. That is from my perspective. You've been in a position to perhaps see more or see it differently.

I don't know if you've read Mark Donahue's book, "The Unfair Advantage", but it seems very good, insightful to those not so highly competitive, and allows one to judge a little less harshly. Yet, heck, that idea should have been transparently obvious in the first place. If one didn't get brainwashed by certain parables growing up the ideas in Donahue's book would be so obvious as to be not worth commenting upon.

BTW: thanks for your commenting upon this.

 

[Juhazi]

I searched for "forum threads degenerate into climate change" thinking there would be a new term for this phenomena like some variant of Godwin's Law. I didn't find a new term, but this thread came up number 4 in the Google search.

Google personalizes it's searches, you know! Your tracks are easy to follow...

 

[Frank Dernie]

I don't know if you've read Mark Donahue's book, "The Unfair Advantage", but it seems very good, insightful to those not so highly competitive, and allows one to judge a little less harshly. Yet, heck, that idea should have been transparently obvious in the first place. If one didn't get brainwashed by certain parables growing up the ideas in Donahue's book would be so obvious as to be not worth commenting upon.

I think good engineers can be successful in their field without screwing over everybody else, unlike most entrepreneurs and businessmen.
In fact, of the people I know who have been succesful the "professional", scientists and engineers, have got where they are without screwing anybody. The people with businesses have not...

 

[renaudrenaud]

Few words. I do not want to debate, seems some people are too sensible and use terms like Nazi. Sal, really, you cannot write this. Do you know how many people the Nazis had killed?
Anyway. Each time I was seeing the tittle of the thread I was feeling bad. This is Audio Science Review, so what a car is doing here?
Because, excuse me for that, but I think we are going to die because of the car.
I think I do my part, using bikes since 2011. No tv, no mico wave oven, no freezer; local shopping with the bikes, class D amplifier and a system eating less than 15W.
I do not want debate on the subject because I am here reading this website for my pleasure, I do not want to be agressive to anybody and also I do not want to feel some agression against me.
I try to understand the position of the others. We you live in foreign countries with a large cultural distance with our native country, you have to understand how other people think and act.
But Sal, the Nazi term is very difficult to read for some people.
Happy new year.

 

[Thomas savage]

There's been a ton of reported posts in this thread, if we could watch out for subjects that cause unnecessary division in what is ment as a fun thread I'd be most appreciative.

Thanks

 

[JJB70]

I think part of the problem is that EVs are presented by some as the automotive equivalent of chunky sweaters and sandals, cars for those who spend their spare time singing kumbya and going on climate protests.
The people I know who have gone electric are all keen drivers and would normally be called petrol heads if they hadn't gone electric. OK the Jaguar IPace is a bit SUV-ish (I am also not a fan of SUVs) but it is a staggeringly good car and blends brutal performance with fantastic every day usability, sweet handing and very cheap running costs. Range is perfectly adequate for most people and for longer trips people adapt their route planning and seem to manage fine. I am struggling to think of another non-EV that comes close.
The Tesla Model 3 is another seriously fast sweet handling car which costs peanuts to run, is practical and is actually cheap to buy relative to equivalent ICE cars of similar performance.
It's not about saving the world, when I have driven EVs (even the more prosaic ones like the Nissan Leaf and KIA eNiro) I have came away asking myself why I would still want an ICE as they are so nice to drive.
ICE enthusiasts clearly see EVs as a threat to the ICE and they are, not because of some sort of organic tofu conspiracy but because I think electrification is a superior technology. In an audio context it is like vinyl vs digital, lots of people still love and prefer vinyl but most audio is digital and few on this board would deny that digital is superior.
I have spent my life with combustion machinery. In the mid-90's I was in the DU works in Aioi for the first start of the Sulzer 12RTA96, the most powerful diesel ever built at that point. I have worked in engine design and emissions abatement in electricity generation paid my mortgage for a while. I love engines, but they are rapidly becoming yesterdays technology. The new Corvette is a fantastic car, but I see it as being the automotive equivalent of aircraft like the F8F Bearcat and Sea Fury, the closing and perfect last hurrah of an obsolete technology. GM will be no different to other high performance car producers in that they will be looking at hybrid and fully electric future performance cars because that is the direction of technology.

 

[LTig]

There's been a ton of reported posts in this thread, if we could watch out for subjects that cause unnecessary division in what is ment as a fun thread I'd be most appreciative.

Thanks

I understand your point, but want to remind that the fun of rich people in a few rich countries may have serious negative consequences for many poor people in poorer countries.

 

[Purité Audio]

Seriously considering not owning a car.
Keith

 

[beefkabob]

The ipace will outcorner most sports cars then rise up and go off road. Amazing car. Really not suv like at all.

After owning three evs, seeing a performance ice makes me feel ambivalent at best. The corvette would be a far better car as an ev. The Honda E is going to be an amazing car. Too bad it's not coming to America.