2020 Corvette Convertible $66,400

[Ron Texas]

The naked ape is ruthless, selfish and greedy. Those that become "successful" in our sense of the word tend to be the most ruthless, most selfish and most greedy IME. This means that all politicians and business leaders target voting at the next election and tomorrows share price above anything. Expecting them to be doing what is right in the long term is naive at best.

I am pretty pessimistic. Attitudes I see everywhere make it clear that enough people choose an excuse of their choice to deny facts so they can continue to live the way they like. It is probably already too late anyway.

Sounds like a Hobbsian to me. Internal combustion engines are not obsolete. Even a hybrid gets it's power from burning fuel. I do think we will see a lot of light hybrids with 15 to 30 hp electric motors.

@Sal1950 I know how a representative democracy is supposed to work, but we are seeing them malfunction all over the world. There has been push back by the people and hopefully the ship of state will sail straight again. Happy new year, it's 2020 and the shit will hit the fan.

 

[digicidal]

I would welcome benign despotism if it saves the planet.
Keith

In the spirit of science... I would appreciate an example of a "benign despot". I'll admit to not knowing every second of human history - but I'm coming up seriously short in this regard.

 

[Xulonn]

Riding on narrow many curved mountain roads [on] a Harley

This [very low quality] 2008 video of an Aprillia Scarabeo 250cc scooter passing Harleys on Mulholland Drive in the Santa Monica Mountains reminded me of my many weekends riding that same road on my Yamaha 650 twin in the early 1980's.

I've had friends with Harley bikes of all styles over many decades, but never got into the mystique of that marque. My Yammy was a poorer-handling - but a cheaper and far more reliable version of the Triumph, BSA and Norton vertical twins that I admired back then.

Oh yes - I did own a couple of Corvettes back in the 1960's and enjoyed them immensely. (Pics are same models and colors, but not my 'vettes.)

I commuted from Marin County to downtown San Francisco via bus and/or ferry in the 1990's for corporate network administration work - didn't even consider single-occupant private car for that commute.

 

[beefkabob]

Yeah, I'm not buying the benign despot thing. However, being 150 miles from the nearest city also doesn't mean you need a 7.3L V8 to buy groceries and drive the kids to school. Also regulations are not tyranny.

 

[digicidal]

Also regulations are not necessarily tyranny.

FTFY

 

[Xulonn]

In the meantime those who love the smell of spent fuel and the sound of a V8, enjoy the C8 'Vette, perhaps the last full-ICE-'Vette. You may now understand the feeling some have for their definitely passé Turntables and R2R or even tubes. The nostalgia is strong but the performances of those is surpassed by things as trivial as a $9 dongle from Apple.

This sentence really captures the parallels between HiFi and car nostalgia.

 

[Ron Texas]

Yeah, I'm not buying the benign despot thing. However, being 150 miles from the nearest city also doesn't mean you need a 7.3L V8 to buy groceries and drive the kids to school. Also regulations are not tyranny.

The 7.3L ford petrol motor is designed for heavy duty pickup trucks which are mostly commercial vehicles. They may get used for domestic chores too, but do you really expect people to have a different vehicle for every task? Ford explains this motor is more efficient at pulling heavy loads. The base engine is already 6.2L petrol.

There is no law in the US which prevents anyone from using heavy duty vehicles to run around town in. To do so would be regulatory tyranny. Perhaps you wring your hands at the thought of all this "unnecessary" CO2 being generated.

 

[Sal1950]

In the meantime those who love the smell of spent fuel and the sound of a V8, enjoy the C8 'Vette, perhaps the last full-ICE-'Vette. You may now understand the feeling some have for their definitely passé Turntables and R2R or even tubes. The nostalgia is strong but the performances of those is surpassed by things as trivial as a $9 dongle from Apple.

Oh absolutely, and I would never advocate government regulations to stop anyone from enjoying LP gear. I just have no interest in owning any. OTOH, The 2020 Corvette is one of the finest engineered sports cars ever built and doesn't deserve to be trashed or the desire to own one denigrated on a website devoted to scientific engineering. It's something to be admired for the advances that put it near the front of performance auto design.

 

[beefkabob]

FTFY

The term "regulation" becomes meaningless if you use it that way. That's just abusing language. It's "regulation" when you like it, and it's "tyranny" when you don't. Pithy, though, I guess.
I have experienced downsides of over regulation, but they're nothing like tyranny. To claim otherwise just shows a lack of understanding.
https://daily.jstor.org/white-supremacists-and-the-rhetoric-of-tyranny/

 

[Sal1950]

The term "regulation" becomes meaningless if you use it that way. That's just abusing language. It's "regulation" when you like it, and it's "tyranny" when you don't. Pithy, though, I guess.
I have experienced downsides of over regulation, but they're nothing like tyranny. To claim otherwise just shows a lack of understanding.
https://daily.jstor.org/white-supremacists-and-the-rhetoric-of-tyranny/

Now this is going TOO damn far bring racism into the discussion.
That's what you people always do!

 

[Xulonn]

permission to go on the yard and even sometimes move the engines around the yard

I had a wonderful serendipitous opportunity to ride in the cab of a diesel locomotive during graveyard shift in the Emeryville/Oakland switch-yard area near San Francisco Bay back in the 1970's. A friend of my wife was giving private swimming lessons to the night supervisor at of the control towers, so we went there at about 12:30a.m. (I'm sure that the invitation to the yard was intended just for the buxom blond young friend of my wife - and that I was invited by her to minimize unwanted attention and interactions from the men in the freight yard.)

We walked to the tower in the center of the freight yard, and up the stairs to the control room. First we watched the supervisor as he worked on tasks based on a "green-sheet" computer printout to plan the moves in the yard, and we could see the switch engine working the yard from the tower, moving freight and tank cars back and forth to disassemble and re-assemble groups of them. A switch-engine crew came in for a coffee break and to pick up new instructions, and the supervisor asked if we would like to ride in the locomotive for a few rail car moves - and of course we accepted.

It ended up being - for me - a fascinating window into the daily workings of one of the most efficient ways to move freight. Everything was slow motion, and the brakemen stepped on and off the slowly moving rail cars and used the hand-brakes (stock daylight photo below) to help control the speed of the coasting cars, and they also decoupling cars and threw the rail switches. They signaled to the locomotive's engineer by swinging their dim lanterns in the dark night. (The methods for working the rail freight yards now are probably quite different today's with modern communications technology.)

 

[digicidal]

The term "regulation" becomes meaningless if you use it that way. That's just abusing language. It's "regulation" when you like it, and it's "tyranny" when you don't. Pithy, though, I guess.
I have experienced downsides of over regulation, but they're nothing like tyranny. To claim otherwise just shows a lack of understanding.
https://daily.jstor.org/white-supremacists-and-the-rhetoric-of-tyranny/

Wow... right to 200mph on that one. No. It's regulation when it applies unilaterally... and it's tyranny when it's used as a strategic means of suppression or restriction to a specific demographic/region/etc. Similarly (but inversely) subsidies can also be a vehicle for tyranny... or can be a viable means of support and benefit. It's the application that determines which.

 

[beefkabob]

"you people"

 

[Ron Texas]

This sentence really captures the parallels between HiFi and car nostalgia.

Comparing ICE to turntables is insulting both to traditional car fans and vinyl lovers. It's loaded with hidden value judgments.

 

[Ron Texas]

The term "regulation" becomes meaningless if you use it that way. That's just abusing language. It's "regulation" when you like it, and it's "tyranny" when you don't. Pithy, though, I guess.
I have experienced downsides of over regulation, but they're nothing like tyranny. To claim otherwise just shows a lack of understanding.
https://daily.jstor.org/white-supremacists-and-the-rhetoric-of-tyranny/

What a cute argument. White supremacists are bad. White supremacists hate regulation. All people who hate regulation are just as bad as white supremacists. That's the logic of the article and linking to it. You will do anything to muddy the waters.

 

[Xulonn]

And even at that time people were noticing just how dirty steam locomotives were and the effects on local air quality.

So of course, they preferred the much cleaner diesels... /snark

 

[beefkabob]

Wow... right to 200mph on that one. No. It's regulation when it applies unilaterally... and it's tyranny when it's used as a strategic means of suppression or restriction to a specific demographic/region/etc.

That's not regulation. That's tyranny. Stopping some dude from getting a big V8 is regulation. Stopping some dude from voting is tyranny. Making it a pain in the ass to build a backyard shed, buy a gun, or remodel a kitchen is regulation. Making it a crime to believe worship in a specific religion is tyranny.

 

[beefkabob]

Mischaracterizing my argument doesn't actually refute anything I've argued.

 

[Sal1950]

They signaled to the locomotive's engineer by swinging their dim lanterns in the dark night. (The methods for working the rail freight yards now are probably quite different today's with modern communications technology.)

My father worked for the Chicago and North Western Railroad as a laborer for 35 years after WW II. When I was still a little kid he took me to work one day while CN&W still had a couple steamers being using for switching at the California Freight Yards in Chicago.. The engineer on one was a friend and let me get in the cab and sit on his lap and operate one of the controls while we moved around the yard for a bit. Super Kool.
Later around 1970 I also went to work at CN&W after leaving the Army and worked as a switch-man. It was all manually controlled then as you describe, the coupling and uncoupling of the cars, breaking of freight cars, etc. Lots and lots of serious injuries in those days.

 

[Ron Texas]

So of course, they preferred the much cleaner diesels... /snark

View attachment 44282

I live near a rail line. There are 30 trains per day, nearly all are freight. In two years I have never seen smoke or smelled anything related to rail activity.