-
WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!
Help me choose a pair of monitors (budget max €3500)
- Thread starter fmessier6
- Start date
Make them yourself like I did.
- Thread Starter
- #63
I'm just realizing that I did not put, among my options, the Dynaudio BM15A (€ 1.250).
Sounds really good on paper: (two-way), a giant 10'' driver, good price, range 40 Hz - 22 kHz. What am I missing?
EDIT: I checked and my HS8 actually have a better frequency range: 38 Hz - 30,000 Hz.
Ps. The Neumann KH310 will arrive on Tuesday and I will report back after some tests.
I really, really wanted to try the Quested V2018 but that would have meant ordering them, spending €5000 in advance and returning them if I didn't like the way they sounded.
Not possible at the moment, so I chose the Neumann, since - on paper - beat the Quested.
Some users also reported that the Quested were overheating like crazy. They are also expensive, and... well, heavy. They were probably going to crush my stands.
Sounds really good on paper: (two-way), a giant 10'' driver, good price, range 40 Hz - 22 kHz. What am I missing?
EDIT: I checked and my HS8 actually have a better frequency range: 38 Hz - 30,000 Hz.
Ps. The Neumann KH310 will arrive on Tuesday and I will report back after some tests.
I really, really wanted to try the Quested V2018 but that would have meant ordering them, spending €5000 in advance and returning them if I didn't like the way they sounded.
Not possible at the moment, so I chose the Neumann, since - on paper - beat the Quested.
Some users also reported that the Quested were overheating like crazy. They are also expensive, and... well, heavy. They were probably going to crush my stands.
Last edited:
a waveguide?
BrokenEnglishGuy
Major Contributor
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2020
- Messages
- 1,941
- Likes
- 1,163
Stands?
He also use vynil, no room correction I guess.
Horrifyingly bad directivity behavior?
A 10" midwoofer and a tweeter on a flat baffle are going to behave terribly unless you seriously damp first reflections. Plus, the exposed frame on the BM15's woofer causes some wacky tweeter behavior.
Danny Richie at GR Research (as much as I don't like him) pointed this out and a big piece of felt between the two helps it majorly.
Those Dynaudio look about as well engineered as the 80€ Edifier 1280T - although even those do at least make a half-hearted attempt at a waveguide.
And bass extension does indeed fall halfway in between typical 6.5" and 8" monitors.
And bass extension does indeed fall halfway in between typical 6.5" and 8" monitors.
- Thread Starter
- #69
- Thread Starter
- #70
The Right Neumann KH310 arrived today, B-stock from Thomann.com.
I am waiting for another B-stock to come up, if it doesn't I'll purchase the Left brand new in a few days.
I checked integrity and visible scratches but I couldn't find anything except a white dotted line at the bottom of the central part of the woofer (maybe glue?) Little white dots at the very centre of the picture.
So I did some left/right test with my HS8: I opened Winamp and panned hard left and hard right, but I think what Winamp is doing is feeding the R speaker just the R channel and not a mono downmix, because I was listening to Do You Wanna Know by Artic Monkeys and there was a guitar on the right channel that wasn't present on the left.
Unless the KH310 is that revealing, I'm assuming Winamp is feeding the right channel to the right speaker.
I played a couple of tracks and I'll get back tonight with a proper test. So far:
DETAIL/CLARITY: There's a level of detail that makes the HS8 pale in comparison, it feels like going back to cheap computer speakers. It definitely feels brighter, and more detailed. Good separation of all the elements as well. Hard to describe! I was feeling some fantastic separation that worked well in most of the track I listened to, the sole exception the track All Melody by Nils Frahm, where the HS8 gave a more cohesive sound to the piece.
Matching the same output level L/R to the HS8, the KH310 will come out as the winner even to some untrained ears.
BASS: Bass as I expected is not enough for my personal taste, but it is more pronounced than the HS8, even coming from a single speaker, I could hear the kick drum in this song by Fuck Buttons, and on the HS8 the same kick is present but lacks depth and bass.
Coldplay's Every Teardrop is a Waterwall is a pure joy to listen, and that's with just one speaker!
Bass is clear, present and recognizable. Again, good separation.
I think I would be happy with just 20% more bass overall, for movies and for effectively tracking low end in mixes without a sub.
Thanks for the advice in choosing these!
Question 1: When I'll pair the second Neumann speaker next week, will I perceive a louder and more present amount of bass?
Question 2: I was very curious about the Quested V2018, would it make sense to order it just to try it in my room or should I be set already with the KH310? This will get very expensive very quick, and I'll have to pick a pair and return them within 14 days.
I am waiting for another B-stock to come up, if it doesn't I'll purchase the Left brand new in a few days.
I checked integrity and visible scratches but I couldn't find anything except a white dotted line at the bottom of the central part of the woofer (maybe glue?) Little white dots at the very centre of the picture.
So I did some left/right test with my HS8: I opened Winamp and panned hard left and hard right, but I think what Winamp is doing is feeding the R speaker just the R channel and not a mono downmix, because I was listening to Do You Wanna Know by Artic Monkeys and there was a guitar on the right channel that wasn't present on the left.
Unless the KH310 is that revealing, I'm assuming Winamp is feeding the right channel to the right speaker.
I played a couple of tracks and I'll get back tonight with a proper test. So far:
DETAIL/CLARITY: There's a level of detail that makes the HS8 pale in comparison, it feels like going back to cheap computer speakers. It definitely feels brighter, and more detailed. Good separation of all the elements as well. Hard to describe! I was feeling some fantastic separation that worked well in most of the track I listened to, the sole exception the track All Melody by Nils Frahm, where the HS8 gave a more cohesive sound to the piece.
Matching the same output level L/R to the HS8, the KH310 will come out as the winner even to some untrained ears.
BASS: Bass as I expected is not enough for my personal taste, but it is more pronounced than the HS8, even coming from a single speaker, I could hear the kick drum in this song by Fuck Buttons, and on the HS8 the same kick is present but lacks depth and bass.
Coldplay's Every Teardrop is a Waterwall is a pure joy to listen, and that's with just one speaker!
Bass is clear, present and recognizable. Again, good separation.
I think I would be happy with just 20% more bass overall, for movies and for effectively tracking low end in mixes without a sub.
Thanks for the advice in choosing these!
Question 1: When I'll pair the second Neumann speaker next week, will I perceive a louder and more present amount of bass?
Question 2: I was very curious about the Quested V2018, would it make sense to order it just to try it in my room or should I be set already with the KH310? This will get very expensive very quick, and I'll have to pick a pair and return them within 14 days.
I think that you’ll be blown away when you listen to both monitors together. You have entered a whole new level of audio reproduction hence the required financial outlay. I think you’ll gain nothing with the Questeds. Just the hassle of having to arrange their return! I foresee a pair of subs in your future.
- Thread Starter
- #73
Thank you. I can't wait.
I would also love to to A/B test both speakers for fun but I'll need a monitor controller since my Komplete Audio 2 has only a L/R out, so I'll stick with these once the Left arrives.
The Neumann sub is a little on the expensive side, we'll see. I would love to purchase something with a footswitch to bypass the sub.
Thank you! I was waiting to have both speakers before taking some measurements.
- Thread Starter
- #74
One notable thing to mention is that the Neumann logo flashed red at least ten times during some audio peaks at moderate volume, which is absolutely annoying and distracting to see but... an useful feature I guess since it means that its protection system has been activated.
My settings:
Output level at 108 dB
Input gain at -5 dB
Maybe this can be prevented by lowering these values to baseline and raising the input on my sound card?
The manual mentions this: "To avoid this and achieve the desired output level, use larger loudspeakers or add a bass managed sub-
woofer to the system."
So nothing that can be done about this I guess? The volume wasn't even that loud to be honest, just enough to feel a decent amount of bass, but FAR from the speakers capabilities in terms of overall volume.
EDIT: At a medium amount of volume, I also experienced audible distortion from the woofer on this piece (I used a non compressed FLAC version) Kiasmos - Swept (Tale Of Us Remix). The HS8 did just fine.
It's difficult to describe it but it looks like the woofer wasn't able to reproduce the kick drum correctly at a listening volume.
I captured this with a microphone: https://voca.ro/1f2VPCtUVLwm
My settings:
Output level at 108 dB
Input gain at -5 dB
Maybe this can be prevented by lowering these values to baseline and raising the input on my sound card?
The manual mentions this: "To avoid this and achieve the desired output level, use larger loudspeakers or add a bass managed sub-
woofer to the system."
So nothing that can be done about this I guess? The volume wasn't even that loud to be honest, just enough to feel a decent amount of bass, but FAR from the speakers capabilities in terms of overall volume.
EDIT: At a medium amount of volume, I also experienced audible distortion from the woofer on this piece (I used a non compressed FLAC version) Kiasmos - Swept (Tale Of Us Remix). The HS8 did just fine.
It's difficult to describe it but it looks like the woofer wasn't able to reproduce the kick drum correctly at a listening volume.
I captured this with a microphone: https://voca.ro/1f2VPCtUVLwm
Last edited:
Couple things:
1, set it to 94dB. It's significantly lower noise that way. Increase output from your DAC.
2. You will get approximately 6dB additional level from adding a second speaker.
Also... You may just be sitting in a modal null and pushing your speakers much harder for that perceived low end.
1, set it to 94dB. It's significantly lower noise that way. Increase output from your DAC.
2. You will get approximately 6dB additional level from adding a second speaker.
This is surprising; I have never once seen the red light flash even with bass heavy content at room shaking volume. In fact... that piece you linked from Kiasmos, no issue whatsoever making things shake in my room. Totally clean doing so.
Also... You may just be sitting in a modal null and pushing your speakers much harder for that perceived low end.
Last edited:
- Thread Starter
- #77
Thank you. Should I increase the input gain, even slightly? If I crank my Komplete Audio 2 to 10, the max volume is generally ok, but for some quiet pieces you can feel it is not enough.
Of course we're still talking about a single Right speaker here, and I fully understand this is a suboptimal situation. I'm talking about volume without accounting (as you mentioned) the volume gain from having two speakers.
Maybe you could try powering off the left speaker and see how a single one behaves? Mine shows the problem I recorded in the previous message even at medium amount of volumes, both from the FLAC and YouTube. You can see that the woofer is having a hard time with the kick.
I can get it to make that sound at very high levels on one speaker. I can't get it to the point where I could stand being in the room to do it for two.
- Thread Starter
- #79
Same issue in Why So Serious? by Hans Zimmer, from the Dark Knight soundtrack, from 03'30''.
Given mostly the same audio level, the HS8 sounds fine (albeit with slightly less bass information and presence), while the KH310 manifests some kind of distortion that sounds like the sound of a heartbeat, with less bass and more midrange.
This is the second time I'm encountering this issue in less than 72 hours of having the speaker. I believe that in the presence of a specific definite bass frequency or information, the KH310 simply cannot reproduce it at mid-high levels without this heartbeat-like audible distortion. Sorry, it's hard to describe.
Given mostly the same audio level, the HS8 sounds fine (albeit with slightly less bass information and presence), while the KH310 manifests some kind of distortion that sounds like the sound of a heartbeat, with less bass and more midrange.
This is the second time I'm encountering this issue in less than 72 hours of having the speaker. I believe that in the presence of a specific definite bass frequency or information, the KH310 simply cannot reproduce it at mid-high levels without this heartbeat-like audible distortion. Sorry, it's hard to describe.
Can you record it? You'll gonne need a UMIK-1 or similar measurement mic anyway.
We have to wait until you can recheck in stereo if two KH310 can handle this. Otherwise you're a candidate either for the KH420s or at least one sub.
Similar threads
