Subwoofer Comparison

[rlal]

Hi subwoofer experts,

Recently I went for Axpona 2024 and I visited HSU room and I was amazed by the performance of HSU sub and room. Dr Hsu was using a entry level Onkyo receiver and room was amazing. He was using the top subwoofer model from HSU and his speakers. The room cost was less than 2500$ and it was really good.
I am impressed with his subwoofer model. I started looking at HSU and they give 5 year warranty on electronics and 7 year warranty on woofers. Overall I am impressed.
All other rooms were very expensive and there were only few rooms below 5K usd worth. I also realized that with less money it is possible to achieve good sound with smart choice and proper setup. Now I am getting upgrade itch.

I was thinking to add a high performing sub to my current setup. My current setup is Salk Silk towers, Rythmik 12 inch sealed subwoofer made by Salk ( thicker cabinet wall and more bracing than Rythmik stock models) and two infinity book shelf speakers as rear surround speakers. I dont use a center speaker. I tried few center speakers and I never got a good match with my Silk towers. After Dirac calibration with center speakers I get less SPL level compared to only left and right speakers at same volume level. When I switch off center speaker I get higher SPL at same volume level with just left and right front speakers hence I stopped using center speakers. I dont know why it is happening.
My AVR is Arcam 850. I was pretty happy with performance except for bass.


Can you guys suggest me a good subwoofer which will improve the performance? In general I like tight or refined bass and not room shaking bass. I am more interested in music than movies. But I do enjoy good bass in movies. Now I was checking the excel I dont see good option for sealed subs which are priced below 3k.

What is your opinion about HSU VTF-TN1 model? It is a ported sub but affordable. Will it match with my Rythmik subwoofer and will improve performance?

Can you suggest an excellent subwoofer for my present condition?

Thanks in advance.

 

[sweetchaos]

What is your opinion about HSU VTF-TN1 model?

Can’t wait for CEA-2010 data. I expect nothing less than perfection from such a well-performing brand. My guess is it will probably compete with Monoprice’s subs in terms of value for money, but we’ll know for sure with CEA data.

Will it match with my Rythmik subwoofer and will improve performance?

Can a 15” ported sub match the performance of a 12” sealed sub? Yes, and far exceed it in terms of SPL and frequency extension.

 

[rlal]

Thanks sweetchaos for your reply.
Any recommendation for a high preforming sealed sub?
I had bad experience with ported sub (one of popular brand) before hence asking.

 

[Tavus]

Did you see this in the Pioneer manual?

Yes . all speakers have been set to small.

 

[Tavus]

If it doesn't do EQ, then you try sub crawling to see if you can get the bass you want. If that's not an option, then try doing some manual EQ. I used a sealed Rythmik sub for my 2ch stereo in a medium size room, open to other areas and I had more than the bass I needed. Your SVS is quite powerful, so I strongly believe it is a placement/room issue.

I will try to do that, thanks,

 

[sweetchaos]

Thanks sweetchaos for your reply.
Any recommendation for a high preforming sealed sub?
I had bad experience with ported sub (one of popular brand) before hence asking.

My spreadsheet shows you which sealed subwoofers are on the leaderboard.

Since your sub is a 12”, I would be looking at 15” or higher for your upgrade.

If memory serves me right (I’m not on pc), I think the best performing sealed sub is JTR RS1:

JTR Captivator RS1 — JTR Speakers

www.jtrspeakers.com

 

[rlal]

My spreadsheet shows you which sealed subwoofers are on the leaderboard.

Since your sub is a 12”, I would be looking at 15” or higher for your upgrade.

If memory serves me right (I’m not on pc), I think the best performing sealed sub is JTR RS1:

JTR Captivator RS1 — JTR Speakers

www.jtrspeakers.com

JTR sealed seems very good but it is expensive. Can ported sub can be musical?
If so I can go with a ported one.

 

[ExPerfectionist]

After Dirac calibration with center speakers I get less SPL level compared to only left and right speakers at same volume level. When I switch off center speaker I get higher SPL at same volume level with just left and right front speakers hence I stopped using center speakers. I dont know why it is happening.

You can always adjust the volume level of the center channel speaker. I think overall, most people have it up +1~+2 above the "calibrated" level. And besides, it's not about the volume, which you can always adjust -- it's about having dialog, SFX, and other sound that is supposed to be coming from the screen or center stage actually come from a sound source there.

The main challenge with center speakers is getting something voice-matched with the L/R speakers. Plus a lot of people don't angle it at the listening position (just point it straight at knees/shins below the TV). And auto-EQ helps, as a lot time center speakers can have drastically altered output due to being in TV cabinets, on shelves, etc. (exaggerated or missing lower-mids, etc. that alters voices).

 

[Willem]

If you want a clean sub for music, I would suggest two things: first, keep the sub that you have and add a second one rather than replace what you have. Selling gear usually does not make much financial sense, and two subwoofers almost always produce a cleaner sound because the frequency response suffers less from room modes. In that system, I would suggest - following Floyd Toole's advice - to get a sealed sub as the second one. Subwoofers do not have to be identical, so depending on your budget and your space, you could either get a second on that is smaller, and use it primarily to obtain flatter/cleaner response, or get a bigger one, and use it not only to achieve that smoother response, but also have more spl and extension.

 

[rlal]

If you want a clean sub for music, I would suggest two things: first, keep the sub that you have and add a second one rather than replace what you have. Selling gear usually does not make much financial sense, and two subwoofers almost always produce a cleaner sound because the frequency response suffers less from room modes. In that system, I would suggest - following Floyd Toole's advice - to get a sealed sub as the second one. Subwoofers do not have to be identical, so depending on your budget and your space, you could either get a second on that is smaller, and use it primarily to obtain flatter/cleaner response, or get a bigger one, and use it not only to achieve that smoother response, but also have more spl and extension.

I am planning to add another sub rather than replacing it with a new bigger one.
In general I like sealed subs over ported as I like tight mid bass and I don't like the rumbling or room shaking bass.
At this point I am planning to get VTF-TN1 Subwoofer from HSU. It has the flexibility to use it as ported as well as sealed. This one is 15 inch and my Rythmik is 12 inch.
HSU called this variable tuning. I was little worried using both will help or not.

 

[ExPerfectionist]

If you can integrate the second sub well, get the phase correct, etc., it can improve performance and headroom. But the actual setup and proper integration can be pretty tricky.

 

[rlal]

If you can integrate the second sub well, get the phase correct, etc., it can improve performance and headroom. But the actual setup and proper integration can be pretty tricky.

I hope Dirac live will take care of it.

 

[rlal]

Does any one compared Rythmik FV15HP vs HSU 15" ported sub?
Just wondering how HSU sub will perform compared to servo subs?

Thanks.

 

[radix]

Yes . all speakers have been set to small.

Ok. You could try setting it to PLUS and see if that is more to your liking. Please also make sure the settings on the sub are reset to their defaults to make sure there's no EQ or bad cross over frequency from the prior owner. I don't remember what frequency your AVR crosses at, but you want to make sure the sub is set higher.

 

[TOR]

Kanto Sub8 measurement here:

Kanto ORA Powered Desktop Speakers & sub8 Review

Kanto’s new ORA powered desktop speakers push their technology further than ever by introducing an active crossover and other innovations. What does this do to the sound? Read on to find out.

www.audioholics.com

Another rare sub measurement. I guess not to many people interested in measuring small sub...

 

[Tavus]

Hey here is an update. Found out why my Sb13 didn't sound good.
It was netflix fault! Their dune audio quality is bad, it lacked bass in almost every scene.
To test out why my sub suck, I bought a new Blu-ray player cause my old one died and loaded up my copy of blade runner 2049, and the sub came to life. The bass was great, was loud and exiting, what I was looking for.

The conclusion here is the subs good and Netflix audio is bad.

 

[radix]

Hey here is an update. Found out why my Sb13 didn't sound good.
It was netflix fault! Their dune audio quality is bad, it lacked bass in almost every scene.
To test out why my sub suck, I bought a new Blu-ray player cause my old one died and loaded up my copy of blade runner 2049, and the sub came to life. The bass was great, was loud and exiting, what I was looking for.

The conclusion here is the subs good and Netflix audio is bad.

That's great to hear. We were kind of running out of things that could have been wrong.

What do you use to play netflix? Computer? Do other streaming services sound OK? I'm wondering if it's the input or box or something. When I watched Dune 2, there was plenty of bass, but I don't remember which service I used.

 

[Tavus]

That's great to hear. We were kind of running out of things that could have been wrong.

What do you use to play netflix? Computer? Do other streaming services sound OK? I'm wondering if it's the input or box or something. When I watched Dune 2, there was plenty of bass, but I don't remember which service I used.

It was on an apple TV with dolby 5.1 turned on. There was bass but it wasn't good, like it felt flat. Blu-rays bass superior in everyway.

 

[ExPerfectionist]

That's great to hear. We were kind of running out of things that could have been wrong.

What do you use to play netflix? Computer? Do other streaming services sound OK? I'm wondering if it's the input or box or something. When I watched Dune 2, there was plenty of bass, but I don't remember which service I used.

Exactly. I stream directly to my TV, but I have the audio return over HDMI to get Dolby, Atmos, or whatever the sound format is on the service. The TV may also have some sort of dynamic range compression before passing to the receiver.

But yes I wouldn't be surprised if some of the streaming audio soundtracks aren't the full dynamic range versions like Blu-ray.

 

[ExPerfectionist]

It was on an apple TV with dolby 5.1 turned on. There was bass but it wasn't good, like it felt flat. Blu-rays bass superior in everyway.

Over HDMI, audio return? What does your receiver display as the sound format it's receiving?