Subwoofer Comparison

[Curvature]

Speaking of subwoofers (if it's the right section) I'll take this opportunity to ask some questions.

I have to replace my very old B&W ASW10 (S1).

Always reading positive reviews or tried SVS SB 2000 a disappointment, an annoying sound like "plastic" long bass that didn't follow the music... in practice it was always annoying as if it dirty the music, probably with home theater use it is better as it has a notable impact and SPL but on music we are not there, I tried every possible adjustment.

To orient myself on something more musical I looked at Rel Serie HT 1005 or Velodyne Deep Blue 10, have you had the chance to listen to them?

I could also play it safe and get the new B&W ASW10 S3 since I was very happy with the old model, but you know when you feel like changing it's a problem!

Thanks in advance.

You need a way to integrate the subwoofer. This means setting an HPF and LPF for the crossover, measuring the acoustic response at your listening position, and then adjusting using EQ.

This can also be done automatically through software like Dirac, if your input/output device is capable.

Just buying a sub and connecting it means leaving the results to chance. Integration is, like it or not, the same kind of thinking and work it takes to make a tweeter correctly play with a woofer. You are inadvertently taking on the speaker designer's role.

The results depends less on the sub itself, which is, compared to speakers, a fairly simple device, than your knowledge. Don't expect another sub to solve the problems you are experiencing.

 

[Romario]

Does one choose a sub with a balanced input if used further up the room away from the pre amp? It's not that common in multiple sub outs on an avr or amp, is it? Our hearing is not that sensitive in that FR region is the thought I came up with but I'm not sure.

 

[Alexx]

Ok thanks.

But the subwoofer only offers manual controls, I placed it in the same place as the one I had before and, among other things, it sounded very good (it was B&W ASW10) strictly speaking I should have obtained similar results and not disastrous....probably I had too high expectations for SVS SB2000 and I was disappointed.

I have some experience, I know that with Dirac or similar, you get better results, but even manually in all these years I have always managed to have satisfactory results, on this occasion it was a total disaster.

With this I mean that if I take a 200 euro subwoofer and a 1000 euro one, there are always differences that not even Dirac can resolve, certainly if you get acceptable results manually Dirac improves, but if it sounds bad, with a long and muddy and confused bass evidently there will be a brand that will be better on which then with the various Diracs you can optimize 100%

Do you agree?
Thank you very much see you soon.

 

[Curvature]

Does one choose a sub with a balanced input if used further up the room away from the pre amp? It's not that common in multiple sub outs on an avr or amp, is it? Our hearing is not that sensitive in that FR region is the thought I came up with but I'm not sure.

Balanced terminals were designed to prevent ground loops. They are standard in studio gear. This benefit is lost, though, if you use balanced to unbalanced adaptors.

Wires only start attenuating the signal and causing high frequency loss at distances long distances of hundreds of meters.

Multiple sub outs are common in the more expensive AVPs or integrated amps. The most expensive have channel mapping software that lets you arbitrarily assign what a given channel does.

It depends what you mean by sensitive. Subs need to generate a lot of SPL before the ear responds, but once the necessary threshold is exceeded, comparatively smaller SPL changes produce changes in perceived loudness than in the rest of the audible spectrum. Because of bass wavelengths and room acoustics, bass tones tend to ring for a long time, so the ear takes longer, comparatively, to register a tone than it does for the higher frequencies. Subs also cover a fairly narrow frequency range, and the ear is somewhat less sensitive to frequency-to-frequency variation within that range.

 

[Curvature]

Ok thanks.

But the subwoofer only offers manual controls, I placed it in the same place as the one I had before and, among other things, it sounded very good (it was B&W ASW10) strictly speaking I should have obtained similar results and not disastrous....probably I had too high expectations for SVS SB2000 and I was disappointed.

I have some experience, I know that with Dirac or similar, you get better results, but even manually in all these years I have always managed to have satisfactory results, on this occasion it was a total disaster.

With this I mean that if I take a 200 euro subwoofer and a 1000 euro one, there are always differences that not even Dirac can resolve, certainly if you get acceptable results manually Dirac improves, but if it sounds bad, with a long and muddy and confused bass evidently there will be a brand that will be better on which then with the various Diracs you can optimize 100%

Do you agree?
Thank you very much see you soon.

I'm sorry to say, in the manner of gamers, that this is a skill issue and your previous results were chance.

It's actually very common to hear problems when buying a sub for the first time or buying a bigger sub. Many people conclude that subs introduce problems, or aren't suitable for music, or that small subs are better. None of that is true.

The room is the dominant factor in bass frequency response. You can actually calculate that response fairly accurately just by knowing the room dimensions alone. All the sub does is activate what's already there. Bigger, more capable subs like the SVS simply reveal what smaller subs hid because of their weak output.

I'm not advocating for you to spend a lot of money on new gear. But to get what you want in bass, it will take a measuring mic, a capable AVP or something like it that can do PEQ and HPF and LPF (although many subs have LPFs installed), and some knowledge.

There are manual methods where you play individual bass tones or pink noise and mess around with placement. These take forever and the results are inconsistent.

 

[Alexx]

Ok thank you very much.

 

[staticV3]

Does one choose a sub with a balanced input if used further up the room away from the pre amp? It's not that common in multiple sub outs on an avr or amp, is it?

No, but XLR inputs on an Amp or subwoofer can still work their magic, even when fed from an RCA output. With the right cable.

 

[starfly]

Question - I just ordered a minidsp Flex (the minidsp 2x4HD I had ordered initially would output highly distorted sound when using the analog input, so probably a defective unit).

I was only able to find the balanced version for a reasonable cost (damn tariffs!). I plan to use it in a 2.2 setup. My poweramp that drives my speakers has balanced inputs, and my audio source also has balanced outputs, so that'll be fine. But my subs only have unbalanced inputs, and I know that balanced outputs on the Flex should typically output 4vrms instead of 2vrms. Will that cause any issues with the subs?

 

[staticV3]

But my subs only have unbalanced inputs, and I know that balanced outputs on the Flex should typically output 4vrms instead of 2vrms. Will that cause any issues with the subs?

No. Adapting to RCA inputs will cut the Flex' output voltage in half.