Selah Integrity DIY Speaker Kit Review

[Robbo99999]

These are two of them:

View attachment 80726

The subsonic bass in the second one arrives in the later part of the track. Be very careful! It can severely stress the speaker at higher volumes or damage it.

In the Espejo one, is that the large drum that comes in at 2:45? Doesn't seem too bad listening on my HD600 with Oratory EQ.

EDIT: that drum is at quite a high level though when looked at in Orban Loudness Meter, deceptively so because it doesn't sound loud when listening to it....because our hearing sensitivity is low at the bottom of our hearing range....so I can see how it could deceptively stress a speaker when not sounding loud to us. That drum is reproduced well in both my HD600 and NAD HP50, the latter which can go down below 20Hz, there's not much difference between the sound of the drum from the two headphones re that drum.....the HP50 is flat down to 20Hz and the EQ'd HD600 is flat down to 40Hz and 1dB under at 30Hz.....so given that the drum sound is not much different between the two headphones I'd say that most of the content is 30Hz+. (unless there's a lot of content under 20Hz that I know I can't hear).

 

[Milesian]

I like the idea of plush shipping for my speakers. I presume they are carefully packed and seated in a comforable first class seat, with a glass of champagne and canapes, served by the ever hospitable and attentive purser, @Thomas savage?

I believe regular shipping is available, economy class seating and no refreshments.

 

[PierreV]

so given that the drum sound is not much different between the two headphones I'd say that most of the content is 30Hz+. (unless there's a lot of content under 20Hz that I know I can't hear).

I had a quick listen and a casual measurement shows a flattened peak between 21Hz and 23Hz, not that unexpected for a movie soundtrack. But yes, there's generally a lot of energy in the 15 - 50 Hz zone.

 

[Robbo99999]

I had a quick listen and a casual measurement shows a flattened peak between 21Hz and 23Hz, not that unexpected for a movie soundtrack. But yes, there's generally a lot of energy in the 15 - 50 Hz zone.

View attachment 80756

Cool, is that yellow line a capture from the moment in time when the drum is struck? Given that I didn't hear much difference between HD600 & HP50 on that drum then my hearing sensitivity is probably pretty darn low around 20-30Hz zone....although I know I can just about detect a 19Hz test tone on my HP50 at normal music listening volume level, but I am aware my ears are a lot less sensitive around there - I think given all the other content in the other frequency areas that is happening at the same time I think that masks my low hearing sensitivity between 20-30Hz, so I think that's why I didn't really notice a difference between HP50 & HD600 on the drum strike. Yeah, so I guess this track would be deceptively tough on speakers then given the significant content at the drum strike between 15-30Hz, combined with the fact it can't really be noticed how much energy is in that area when listening as proven by my HP50 & HD600 sounding very similar during that drum strike (because theoretically I should be hearing more in the HP50 given the lower bass extension).

EDIT: I suppose most of the relevance of the 15-30Hz zone is gonna be what is felt rather than heard.... and through speakers & subwoofers rather than headphones, because although you can hear in some of that range it's very quiet to our ears, so probably more bodily impact rather than hearing it with our ears.

 

[PierreV]

Cool, is that yellow line a capture from the moment in time when the drum is struck? Given that I didn't hear much difference between HD600 & HP50 on that drum then my hearing sensitivity is probably pretty darn low around 20-30Hz zone....although I know I can just about detect a 19Hz test tone on my HP50 at normal music listening volume level, but I am aware my ears are a lot less sensitive around there - I think given all the other content in the other frequency areas that is happening at the same time I think that masks my low hearing sensitivity between 20-30Hz, so I think that's why I didn't really notice a difference between HP50 & HD600 on the drum strike. Yeah, so I guess this track would be deceptively tough on speakers then given the significant content at the drum strike between 15-30Hz, combined with the fact it can't really be noticed how much energy is in that area when listening as proven by my HP50 & HD600 sounding very similar during that drum strike (because theoretically I should be hearing more in the HP50 given the lower bass extension).

It's a live spectrum with peak hold. "Drum" peak should be at the red line. It is just a quick and dirty handheld measurement from my desk, bass being taken care of by dual subwoofers ( SVS SB-16 Ultras ). I wrote drum between quotes because the whole thing seems to be a synthetic atmospheric room-filling modulated rumble with some drum-like peaks. Very much a movie soundtrack intended to trigger gut reactions in the audience imho: it feels very different from orchestral percussions (where the big hitters are usually in the back anyway) and from those few legendary large bone-shaking pipe organs.

Even audiophile reference percussion and bass heavy tracks such as Udu (Planet Drum, Mickey Hart) have most of their energy 20 Hz or so higher than this.

And I guess, that energy, even if it is not reproduced audibly by smaller speakers, has to go somewhere if delivered (heat in the coils? woofer breaking up?). That's probably the reason for Amir's warning.

 

[Thomas savage]

I like the idea of plush shipping for my speakers. I presume they are carefully packed and seated in a comforable first class seat, with a glass of champagne and canapes, served by the ever hospitable and attentive purser, @Thomas savage?

Ha ha i spotted that and assumed it must work a bit like glamping..

 

[daftcombo]

I had a quick listen and a casual measurement shows a flattened peak between 21Hz and 23Hz, not that unexpected for a movie soundtrack. But yes, there's generally a lot of energy in the 15 - 50 Hz zone.

View attachment 80756

It is indeed not very common to have so much energy between 20 Hz and 30 Hz on music. Looks dangerous.

 

[Robbo99999]

It's a live spectrum with peak hold. "Drum" peak should be at the red line. It is just a quick and dirty handheld measurement from my desk, bass being taken care of by dual subwoofers ( SVS SB-16 Ultras ). I wrote drum between quotes because the whole thing seems to be a synthetic atmospheric room-filling modulated rumble with some drum-like peaks. Very much a movie soundtrack intended to trigger gut reactions in the audience imho: it feels very different from orchestral percussions (where the big hitters are usually in the back anyway) and from those few legendary large bone-shaking pipe organs.

Even audiophile reference percussion and bass heavy tracks such as Udu (Planet Drum, Mickey Hart) have most of their energy 20 Hz or so higher than this.

And I guess, that energy, even if it is not reproduced audibly by smaller speakers, has to go somewhere if delivered (heat in the coils? woofer breaking up?). That's probably the reason for Amir's warning.

Yeah, I was gonna say that there felt like there could be some artificial low end rumble put in amoungst that drum....it's probably a synthetically created drum anyway I guess. But yeah, a lot of low end bass in that track at those points, very deceptive in terms of stressing speakers!

EDIT: and in reference to my previous post, thinking about it, there's probably not much benefit for headphones reaching down to 20Hz and below vs say 30Hz....because this would be felt more than heard (which can't really be achieved in headphones re body sensations). Possible that headphones are only really relevant down to the 30Hz?? For sure that's a different story for speakers & subs though, let them go down to 10Hz I guess! (Albeit you want your 30Hz headphone to be clean rather than distortion-filled at that point, so perhaps the argument that a headphone can go down flat to 10Hz means it's more likely to produce a clean 30Hz vs a headphone that has less bass extension....just an idea?).

 

[617]

Great tribute to Jeff, who was the absolute nicest guy you can imagine in the DIY world. The design reflects his ethic; good system design with a mix of high end and budget parts in an easy to build format.

Jeff's most notable skill, besides answering questions from idiots like me, was elegant crossover design. His passive networks had minimal components and produced fantastic results.

 

[Stephen]

Well to test speakers 'Bass' I use two titles:
The first minute of "Poème en or" by Rodolphe Burger and
at 31 second exactly: "North Star" by Tale of us.
Would be curious of your opinion. Thanks!

 

[fordiebianco]

Well to test speakers 'Bass' I use two titles:
The first minute of "Poème en or" by Rodolphe Burger and
at 31 second exactly: "North Star" by Tale of us.

Two tracks here as well: ‘Snowbound’ by Donald Fagen from the DVD-Audio of ‘Kamakiriad’

The intro of ‘thinking’ by the Submotion Orchestra.

 

[Rick Sykora]

Thanks again Amir and nice job Rick!

Am quite busy with outdoor projects and the S2000s are underway. As had not built a Bagby design, ordered a Mandolin kit. Once this speaker gets back, will repurpose the box for the other X-LS Encore and get it to Amir.

Jeff was a nice guy and we met at Chrysler before I knew he was into audio. Was hoping I might get a chance to visit with him again, but this speaker and the Mandolin effort will be my small part of celebrating his legacy.

 

[Rick Sykora]

Ha ha i spotted that and assumed it must work a bit like glamping..

I do make some nice shipping boxes, but not sure would call them plush.

 

[Rick Sykora]

The kit does not come with a knock-down cabinet.
I am putting it as $700 for the price in my spreadsheets.

$625 + shipping (and applicable tax) for the base kit.

$645 + shipping/tax for the “full” kit which comes with screws, terminals, damping material, etc.

Optional upgrades max out at ~$265, which includes pre-assembled crossovers.

Photo on website (chamfered edges not in required plans):

$700 is reasonable estimate for the basic cabinet. Would not consider it a monkey coffin (as someone else posted), it is surprisingly compact as am sure @amirm will attest. I forgot to mention, he was the inspiration for the wider binding post spacing. Plan to do in the future whenever space allows.

The chiseled one you posted is a special by Rick’s cabinet designer. He has a fancy CNC and can do fancy cabinet work, but it was not part of the original design.

 

[Severian]

Nice looking kit; sort of a budget Philharmonitor BMR.

 

[nick-v]

I had a pair of Rick's Selah Vigore (SB Satori mid, Scanspeak Beryllium tweeter, SB 8" woofer, ClarityCap CSA caps) and I thought they were great almost full-range large 3-way monitors. They're also low sensitivity so I was using them with a Krell KAV-250a, they made a good match.

 

[mrmoizy]

Mr. Bagby is a legend in the DIY speaker community, probably goes without saying to many on here. I know he's been sick the last few years, so sad to hear he passed. He's done so much, many that even attempt their own designs likely stand on the shoulders of his previous work in some way or another. Thanks for sharing this build on here.

 

[Robbo99999]

Well to test speakers 'Bass' I use two titles:
The first minute of "Poème en or" by Rodolphe Burger and
at 31 second exactly: "North Star" by Tale of us.
Would be curious of your opinion. Thanks!

Those two tracks don't seem as heavy on the low bass as that track tested by Amir. I listened to those YouTube vids you linked and according to Orban Loudness Meter the Rodolfe Burger one is about 4 or 5 dBFS short in the bass (my interpretation) of the Amir one. The other track you linked is about 8dBFS short in the bass. So even though both tracks sound like there's some impressive bass, the point is that the Amir linked video contains very low bass in large amounts that doesn't actually sound loud but is actually being played at a very high level (because our hearing is so poor in the 15-30Hz zone), so Amir's video probably would challenge speakers more. But, I suppose it's arguable why choose a test track where the bass is virtually inaudible because it's too low for our hearing, and your tracks you've chosen are probably more applicable to everyday listening because I think the bass is a bit further up the frequency range in your examples.....so it's probably more applicable to real world bass.

 

[Tatteredmidnight]

Seems like a rather nasty thing to do as an artist or mixing engineer. Given the prevalence of streaming services and devices, many without the option to apply a subsonic filter or per channel crossover, including this sort of artifact almost feels malicious.

 

[chych7]

Would rounding over the edges of the baffle help tame some of the dips/peaks in the response?