Monolith 10 vs. Hsu VTF-2 MK5 vs. Rythmik LV12F

[matpad]

I've looked at 3 subwoofer review sites (data-bass.com, audioholics.com and wirecutter.com), then I combined their data and created an equivalent room size rating (based on audioholics.com room rank).

Here's the results from the mentioned subwoofers so far:

PORTED:
- Hsu VTF-2 MK5. Ported. (from your list). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Large" rooms.
- Rythmik LV12F. Ported. (from your list). No CEA2010 data available that I could find.
- Monoprice 10" Ported Monolith (from your list). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Large" rooms.
- SVS PB-1000. Ported. (from a member above). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Large" rooms.

SEALED:
- Monoprice 10" Sealed Monolith (from your list). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Medium" rooms.
- SVS SB-1000. Sealed. (from a member above). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Medium" rooms.
- RSL Speedwoofer 10s. Sealed (from a member above). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Medium" rooms.
- Rythmik L12. Sealed. (from a member above) No CEA2010 data available that I could find.

Not mentioned:
We have data on Rythmik F12 (also sealed but for $980, aka +75% cost than Rythmik L12). CEA2010 data from wirecutter. Result? This sub will work "Medium" rooms.

So while I don't have the data on 2 subwoofers from the list of mentioned, you can speculate to their performance if needed.

As you can see, even sealed subwoofers above will work for your room size.

I do think a sealed subwoofer is your best choice b/c of 2 reasons:
1. given the size of your listening area
2. the fact that this is an apartment (not a house), so playing the lowest frequencies (that ported subs can hit) isn't the best choice, given you have neighbors to worry about.

Looking at the sealed options above, if I had to pick right now, I wouldnt choose Monoprice or SVS, I would pick either RSL Speedwoofer 10s (for it's known performance and really good price of $400usd) or Rythmik L12 (for it's reliability in the "servo design" as CDMC mentioned, for a slightly costlier sub of $559usd, but still within your budget).

Otherwise, if you still don't mind the larger ported subs and you want to have more "headroom", then you have the info to decide.

Cheers!

I am also in the process of buying my first sub but have a little bit different criteria:
- living in a small house, floor plan in L shape as well but with bigger size of the room - about 4,032 cubic feet (this is already considered a large room, right?)
- want to use it for both music and movies
- want to save space as much as possible
- budget about 600 USD
- white color option would be great haha
I was looking at Rythmik L12... it looks like 1 might not be enough though, what do you think?
Or is there anything else you would recommend? Thank you!

 

[sweetchaos]

I am also in the process of buying my first sub but have a little bit different criteria:
- living in a small house, floor plan in L shape as well but with bigger size of the room - about 4,032 cubic feet (this is already considered a large room, right?)
- want to use it for both music and movies
- want to save space as much as possible
- budget about 600 USD
- white color option would be great haha
I was looking at Rythmik L12... it looks like 1 might not be enough though, what do you think?
Or is there anything else you would recommend? Thank you!

Yes, it's a large room, so by choosing a "Medium" type of subwoofer, you're in a sense limited by output of the sub.

Rythmik L12
- $629, on budget (white)
- available in white
- F12 (higher model) is capable of playing down to 16hz (from CEA2010A data), so interpolate from that
RSL Speedwoofer 10s
- $400, under budget
- available in white
- is capable of playing down to 20hz (from CEA2010A data)
SVS SB-1000
- $600, on budget (white)
- available in white
- is capable of playing down to 16hz (from CEA2010A data)

You really can't go wrong with either of the 3, IMO.
But at the same time, if you just increase your budget by $200 (or by 50% over your current $600), then you can buy 2 of RSL Speedwoofer 10s, and your setup will be complete.
Of course, the alternative is to spend $600 more or (or by 100% over your current $600 budget) to get 2 or Rythmik L12 or SVS SB-1000's to get an equivalent setup.
It really depends on whether you want that "endgame" type of setup (capable of playing lower frequencies), or a "budget" type of setup.
If endgame, go with Rythmik or SVS. If budget, go with RSL.

Dual subwoofer is always the solution to even out the frequency response from seat to seat, and to get rid of any nulls in the frequency response.

EDIT:
Regarding the Monoprice Monolith 10 THX (Sealed 10") for $500.
See Erin's recent review here. It's capable of playing down to 16hz (from CEA2010A data), which confirms Brent's CEA2010A data.
But it's not available in white colour (only black)...so might be a deal-breaker for you.
Erin noted that it has "no audible resonance/port chuffing", which is sign of a good subwoofer design.

 

[matpad]

Yes, it's a large room, so by choosing a "Medium" type of subwoofer, you're in a sense limited by output of the sub.

Rythmik L12
- $629, on budget (white)
- available in white
- F12 (higher model) is capable of playing down to 16hz (from CEA2010A data), so interpolate from that
RSL Speedwoofer 10s
- $400, under budget
- available in white
- is capable of playing down to 20hz (from CEA2010A data)
SVS SB-1000
- $600, on budget (white)
- available in white
- is capable of playing down to 16hz (from CEA2010A data)

You really can't go wrong with either of the 3, IMO.
But at the same time, if you just increase your budget by $200 (or by 50% over your current $600), then you can buy 2 of RSL Speedwoofer 10s, and your setup will be complete.
Of course, the alternative is to spend $600 more or (or by 100% over your current $600 budget) to get 2 or Rythmik L12 or SVS SB-1000's to get an equivalent setup.
It really depends on whether you want that "endgame" type of setup (capable of playing lower frequencies), or a "budget" type of setup.
If endgame, go with Rythmik or SVS. If budget, go with RSL.

Dual subwoofer is always the solution to even out the frequency response from seat to seat, and to get rid of any nulls in the frequency response.

EDIT:
Regarding the Monoprice Monolith 10 THX (Sealed 10") for $500.
See Erin's recent review here. It's capable of playing down to 16hz (from CEA2010A data), which confirms Brent's CEA2010A data.
But it's not available in white colour (only black)...so might be a deal-breaker for you.
Erin noted that it has "no audible resonance/port chuffing", which is sign of a good subwoofer design.

Thank you for all the info.
I saw that Erin's review earlier today but it looks like Monolith is currently out of stock with no info on when they will replenish again... so will need to pick from the other 3 I guess.

I am more thinking to go with more expensive sub but start with one and later on buy a second one...
So in your opinion there is no significant difference between Rythmik and SVS brand?
SVS seems to be very mainstream so I wanted to go with Rythmik, I was also thinking that Direct Servo Technology might bring better performance but correct me if I am wrong. Unfortunately F12 is out of budget, its over 1000 bucks.
On the other hand for SVS its ability to play down to 16 hz sounds like an advantage over that L12, right?

What would you go with if you were to start with only 1?

 

[sweetchaos]

So in your opinion there is no significant difference between Rythmik and SVS brand?

Whether Rythmik's servo technology is worth the money (as opposed to going with a sub without the servo technology), well...I've asked Erin that same question and his answer was:

To be honest, that's something I would like to provide more details on as well. Unfortunately, without a way to A/B "with servo" and "without servo" I can't definitively provide any two cents on the matter. Other than what I did in the video, which is to compare "as is" and assume the engineers implemented the servo technology that resulted in a way that is better than without it. (even though it's not great anyway)

Meaning, Rythmik's servo technology can't be evaluated on it's own. Once Erin (*hopefully*) tests Rythmik, and another subwoofer of similar price, you can compare the two CEA2010A/B data and have this thought:

Hmm, Rythmik looks like it's getting a higher output per given frequency than competitor X for the same money. But I still don't know whether this is due to Rythmik's servo technology or simply better overall engineering by Rythmik, when compared to the competitors. Oh well, it is what it is.

Know what I mean?

On the other hand for SVS its ability to play down to 16 hz sounds like an advantage over that L12, right?

Well, my guess is L12 will also play down to 16hz, and is slightly better than SVS SB-1000 in terms of output (slightly higher db per given frequency).

What would you go with if you were to start with only 1?

Rythmik, simply based on recommendations of other forum members in several other threads.
Disclaimer: I personally have HSU sub, and never experienced a Rythmik sub.

 

[JRiggs]

I have 2 of the Monolith THX 10" ported subs and can confirm Erin's test data. They play low, extremely clean and no audible noise (audible resonance/port chuffing) whatsoever. Sound outstanding for movies and music alike. Highly recommend.

 

[raistlin65]

I am more thinking to go with more expensive sub but start with one and later on buy a second one...
So in your opinion there is no significant difference between Rythmik and SVS brand?
SVS seems to be very mainstream so I wanted to go with Rythmik, I was also thinking that Direct Servo Technology might bring better performance but correct me if I am wrong. Unfortunately F12 is out of budget, its over 1000 bucks.
On the other hand for SVS its ability to play down to 16 hz sounds like an advantage over that L12, right?

Yes. Going with one good sub and adding one later is the better way to go.

Over at AVS forum over the years, when people have compared Rythmik and similar SVS models, Rythmik was always found to have better sound quality. In fact, in subwoofer shootouts when members got together and tested a range of subwoofers, Rythmik always beat out everything in the same class.

The SB-1000 does not have usable output at 16hz. I have one.

Best look at frequency reponse charts and how much roll off a sub has. If you're after good response down to below 20 HZ, you should to be looking at a ported subwoofer such as the Rythmik LV12F or HSU VTF-2. The three subs you're considering are best thought of as performers down to the mid 20hz range.

And your square footage is +4,000 cubic feet? You really should be looking at a VTF-2 or LV12F unless you're ready to pay a lot more for a higher output sealed sub.

 

[kevindd992002]

So now between the RSL Speedwoofer 10S and the Monoprice Monolith 10 THX (Sealed 10"), which one would be a best fit for my "medium" room given that I'll probably go dual subs in the future?

 

[raistlin65]

So now between the RSL Speedwoofer 10S and the Monoprice Monolith 10 THX (Sealed 10"), which one would be a best fit for my "medium" room given that I'll probably go dual subs in the future?

Since you are not in the US, I would go with the Speedwoofer. Monoprice has at times been plagued with quality control and reliability issues with their subs. On the other hand, I can't recall ever hearing of RSL subwoofer issues.

That being said, SVS usually announces sales the week of Black Friday. For the past few years, they have done a limited production run of the SB12-NSD for $400, which is considered a better sub than the Speedwoofer. Here is an in-depth review

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofer-reviews/sb12-nsd-subwoofer/svs-sb12-nsd-introduction

Of course you might have trouble sourcing a second one when you are ready.

Or they might put the SB-1000 on sale. They also often have an outlet sale with discounts on customer returns. You'd want to subscribe to their mailing list as those tend to sell out very quickly. Sometimes same day.

 

[kevindd992002]

Since you are not in the US, I would go with the Speedwoofer. Monoprice has at times been plagued with quality control and reliability issues with their subs. On the other hand, I can't recall ever hearing of RSL subwoofer issues.

That being said, SVS usually announces sales the week of Black Friday. For the past few years, they have done a limited production run of the SB12-NSD for $400, which is considered a better sub than the Speedwoofer. Here is an in-depth review

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofer-reviews/sb12-nsd-subwoofer/svs-sb12-nsd-introduction

Of course you might have trouble sourcing a second one when you are ready.

Or they might put the SB-1000 on sale. They also often have an outlet sale with discounts on customer returns. You'd want to subscribe to their mailing list as those tend to sell out very quickly. Sometimes same day.

Thanks for the sound advice. How do the SB12-NSD compare to the SB-1000 though?

 

[raistlin65]

Thanks for the sound advice. How do the SB12-NSD compare to the SB-1000 though?

The SB12 is the predecessor of the SB-2000. So closer to that.

 

[kevindd992002]

The SB12 is the predecessor of the SB-2000. So closer to that.

I see. What price point would an SB-1000 be a good buy? I checked Slickdeals and they've been at $400 last May:

https://slickdeals.net/e/14077775-svs-sb-1000-gloss-399-99?src=SiteSearch

 

[raistlin65]

I see. What price point would an SB-1000 be a good buy? I checked Slickdeals and they've been at $400 last May:

https://slickdeals.net/e/14077775-svs-sb-1000-gloss-399-99?src=SiteSearch

I tend to think the SB-1000 and Speedwoofer 10S would be fairly comparable subs if one could compare them in person. And any perceived difference would be more likely due to the room influence, something that's unpredictable. They seem like a coin toss.

But, had the Speedwoofer 10S been available when I got the SB-1000, I would have gotten it instead of paying $100 more.

Of course, some people could be limited in space and need the smaller size of the SB-1000.

 

[kevindd992002]

I tend to think the SB-1000 and Speedwoofer 10S would be fairly comparable subs if one could compare them in person. And any perceived difference would be more likely due to the room influence, something that's unpredictable. They seem like a coin toss.

But, had the Speedwoofer 10S been available when I got the SB-1000, I would have gotten it instead of paying $100 more.

Of course, some people could be limited in space and need the smaller size of the SB-1000.

I see.

I'm seeing the SB-2000 to be $499.99 right now. Is that better than both SB-1000 and Speedwoofer 10S for the $100 price difference?

 

[raistlin65]

I see.

I'm seeing the SB-2000 to be $499.99 right now. Is that better than both SB-1000 and Speedwoofer 10S for the $100 price difference?

Yes. It's considered a better sub.

Whether or not the price difference is worthwhile to you is a personal opportunity cost evaluation.

 

[kevindd992002]

@sweetchaos

Do you have anything against the SVS SB-2000 given its BF price of $499.99? Will you still pick the RSL Speedwoofer 10S over it? I was fixed on the RSL until I wasn't

 

[kevindd992002]

Yes. It's considered a better sub.

Whether or not the price difference is worthwhile to you is a personal opportunity cost evaluation.

If the SB-2000 is already available at this good price, what's your comment on waiting for the older SB12 NSD? Or is it pointless in doing that since it's an older model?

 

[raistlin65]

If the SB-2000 is already available at this good price, what's your comment on waiting for the older SB12 NSD? Or is it pointless in doing that since it's an older model?

Might not be any more SB12. They just posted their BF specials with the SB-2000 for $500 and PB-2000 for $600. And those are older production run model now that the Pro versions are out. So why do an even older production run model, too?

 

[kevindd992002]

Ok, so I pulled the trigger on 1 SB-2000 and 1 PB-2000. I will use one or the other for now and will sell the other one for a profit when I get them both here in the Philippines. At least I still have a choice which to use between the two. So with 2014 cu.ft. of space and with consideration to my neighbors (as I live in a condo), am I still better off with the sealed SB-2000 for movies? I will use the sub for music too but it's more for movies. And I'll eventually do dual subs of the same kind.

 

[raistlin65]

Ok, so I pulled the trigger on 1 SB-2000 and 1 PB-2000. I will use one or the other for now and will sell the other one for a profit when I get them both here in the Philippines. At least I still have a choice which to use between the two. So with 2014 cu.ft. of space and with consideration to my neighbors (as I live in a condo), am I still better off with the sealed SB-2000 for movies? I will use the sub for music too but it's more for movies. And I'll eventually do dual subs of the same kind.

SB-2000 will work well in a small room. Depending on the room, you might also benefit from room gain to boost the lower frequencies.

But of course, the more lower frequencies you have, the more bass is likely to bother your neighbors. If I was in an apartment and was worried about my neighbors, I think a sub that rolled off at 30hz would be what I would want.

 

[sweetchaos]

@sweetchaos

Do you have anything against the SVS SB-2000 given its BF price of $499.99? Will you still pick the RSL Speedwoofer 10S over it? I was fixed on the RSL until I wasn't

RSL Speedwoofer 10s is basically 1 to 1 with SB-2000 in terms of performance, so you won't feel a difference if you had both.
But PB-2000 can play 11.7dB louder at 20hz (from Wirecutter CEA2010A data) than SB-2000.
PB-2000 is also rated for 'Large' rooms.

Ok, so I pulled the trigger on 1 SB-2000 and 1 PB-2000. I will use one or the other for now and will sell the other one for a profit when I get them both here in the Philippines. At least I still have a choice which to use between the two. So with 2014 cu.ft. of space and with consideration to my neighbors (as I live in a condo), am I still better off with the sealed SB-2000 for movies? I will use the sub for music too but it's more for movies. And I'll eventually do dual subs of the same kind.

Great choice. Now you can feel the difference between the sealed vs ported and decide which is better for your setup.

Next, I would look at de-coupling the sub from the floor, since a lot of energy is transferred directly from the sub to the floor (and to your neighbors).
Lots of information online, here's a thread to get started.