Genelec 8050B Review (Studio Monitor)

[AudioSceptic]

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Genelec 8050B powered studio monitor (speaker). It was kindly purchased by a member used and drop shipped to me. It costs US $1895 each when new.

I was horrified when I noticed the speaker was simply put in a plastic bag, dumped into a much larger box with a bit of padding. As a result speaker was moving around in there, bashing the sides of the box. I opened the box and there was not a scratch on the speaker and it operated as if new! This is one robust enclosure and speaker:

View attachment 113629

Lots of controls on the back. I left all of them off for both measurement and listening tests:
View attachment 113630

Input sensitivity seems high. I had to turn down the volume to measure and listen to the speaker.

I like the iso pads on it. It provides built-in isolation although deep bass still gets through.

The rounded shape of the speaker made it hard to align on my measurement stand. So angles are a bit approximate.

Measurements that you are about to see were performed using the Klippel Near-field Scanner (NFS). This is a robotic measurement system that analyzes the speaker all around and is able (using advanced mathematics and dual scan) to subtract room reflections (so where I measure it doesn't matter). It also measures the speaker at close distance ("near-field") which sharply reduces the impact of room noise. Both of these factors enable testing in ordinary rooms yet results that can be more accurate than an anechoic chamber. In a nutshell, the measurements show the actual sound coming out of the speaker independent of the room.

I performed over 1000 measurement which resulted in error rate of around 1%.

Speaker was kept warm indoors prior to measurements. Measurement temperature was 59 degrees.

Reference axis was as recommended in the manual: the upper rim of the woofer.

Measurements are compliant with latest speaker research into what can predict the speaker preference and is standardized in CEA/CTA-2034 ANSI specifications. Likewise listening tests are performed per research that shows mono listening is much more revealing of differences between speakers than stereo or multichannel.

Genelec 8050B Measurements
Acoustic measurements can be grouped in a way that can be perceptually analyzed to determine how good a speaker is and how it can be used in a room. This so called spinorama shows us just about everything we need to know about the speaker with respect to tonality and some flaws:

View attachment 113631

On-axis response is pretty good although not ruler flat indicating DSP is not used for minor correction. Directivity (comparison of on and off-axis) is quite good although rather flat as studio monitors typically are.

The usual port resonances are there but in a more controlled manner:
View attachment 113634

Early window shows a vertical dip around 2 kHz:
View attachment 113633

Predicted-in room response for far field listening shows the same one dip as deviation from excellence:
View attachment 113635

During my sweeps for distortion at 96 dBSPL, I could hear severe low frequency distortion and indicator coming on as well:

View attachment 113636

That one high frequency peak is interesting. Wonder what the cause of that is?

Definitely usable at 96 dBSPL though if you cut off low frequencies:

View attachment 113637

As noted, directivity is excellent:

View attachment 113639

View attachment 113640

View attachment 113641

Finally we have CSD/waterfall which shows the resonances we have already seen elsewhere:
View attachment 113642

Genelec 8050B Listening Tests
Just turn on this speaker, play the first track and in five seconds you know the tonality is right. Track after track in my reference list sounds beautiful even though I have curated them using my Revel Salon 2 speakers -- power of speakers being optimized to same ideals/targets! Bass was strong and deep which was satisfying.

Right when I wanted to quit and give the 8050B my highest honors, bass came and sadly at high volumes, it becomes ugly. The woofer makes this "brrrrrr" sound, first faintly and then strongly as you push it. I suspect it is some kind of limiting due to amplifier running out of juice as clipping indicator also comes on. Granted, I am listening to one speaker and you would use two but still, a speaker at this price range should be able to play cleaner in bass. I worry that the amplification (as usual) is holding it back.

I dialed in a 35 Hz steep high-pass filter and this got rid of most of the problem at a a slight loss in low frequency response. For a dynamic system, you need subwoofers with this speaker.

Conclusions
Hopefully this review is without (much) surprise. We expect Genelec to deliver on build quality, on and off-axis response. The larger woofer helps produce satisfying and good level of bass. For someone like me who likes to push speakers and systems , it is not able to deliver loudness without limitation and rather ugly distortion. Your application may differ though.

I am going to recommend Genelec 8050B for low to medium listening levels for both high-fi and studio applications.

------------
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Appreciate any donations using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/

Genelecs always seem to have these odd-looking feet. Are they soft and squidgy to isolate them from the bench/shelf? Are they easily detached for wall mounting?

Also, how big is the bass-mid driver? That would help a lot in judging the overall size.

 

[Absolute]

2nd harmonic around 13kHz is result of the very pronounced break up of the tweeter at 26,5 kHz:

View attachment 113649

Source https://www.soundandrecording.de/equipment/studiomonitor-genelec-8050a-im-test/ where also more measurements can be found of the mechanically very similar predecessor 8050A.

Interesting that harmonics go both ways like this. That means driver quality is likely far more important than we'd like to think. Unless it's beryllium it's shit. My new slogan!

 

[edbosscom]

Genelecs always seem to have these odd-looking feet. Are they soft and squidgy to isolate them from the bench/shelf? Are they easily detached for wall mounting?

Also, how big is the bass-mid driver? That would help a lot in judging the overall size.

They are hard rubber/plastic and act vibration-decoupling indeed. You can remove them, it's just two bolts at the back. The 8050's have an 8 inch driver.

 

[TimVG]

I'd really like to see an old 1032 being reviewed.

They can be quite cheap second hand, and they may also be loud.
I don’t expect the same level of perfection for this older design, though.
But still...

No way I'd send one of mines from Europe, though.

I made some measurements as I really liked them. Better than my Revels in my room.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...1032a-measurements-including-spinorama.17491/

 

[MZKM]

Looks like the actual reference axis is lower still than the rim between tweeter and woofer. Likely at half the CTC distance which is about -10°.
At least it looks that way from @MZKM 's graphs in post #2

Yeah, it looks like the mic was a hair too high and a hair or two too much to the right.

 

[FeddyLost]

I don't see any real issue if people will use them as intended: 2-way nearfields with extended bass.
There are speakers better, for example KH310 is just a little more expensive, but in principle if 8050 still produced, there's some target audience.

 

[YSC]

I don't see any real issue if people will use them as intended: 2-way nearfields with extended bass.
There are speakers better, for example KH310 is just a little more expensive, but in principle if 8050 still produced, there's some target audience.

I would guess it's the ppl who feel it's good enough and full analogue is a plus for someone who do DSP on their own or preferring the full analogue thing

 

[TNT]

No, it is a rather compact package and as I noted, doesn't get extremely loud anyway.

Are you using laser or microphone for distorsion evaluation?

When will we see your description of your measurement setup and usage - it would be interesting!

//

 

[Spocko]

Yeah, I do actually agree with you, especially if you're subjected to US pricing. If my objective was 2-channel I think I would have actually gone even more expensive and got the D&D 8C But 5 channels at that price is out of my reach, and one also can't simply be rotated for use as a center channel. I bought Genelec primarily because I thought it was the best quality option for a multi-channel setup -- not stereo.

You are paying a definite premium for the brand, the history of reliability(long-term support!) and build quality. And that's totally fine -- they've earned the right to charge more for those things. If you're looking for the best (high-end) price/performance Genelec's not quite there.

Yes, not many people realize the speakers are made in Finland - not exactly cheap labor. Imagine if the JBL 708Ps were made in the USA instead of Mexico.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Yes, not many people realize the speakers are made in Finland - not exactly cheap labor. Imagine if the JBL 708Ps were made in the USA instead of Mexico.

I don't mind them moving production to China and paying half price.

 

[YSC]

I don't mind them moving production to China and paying half price.

personally I do like their current pricing and made in Finland... racing everything to cheap labor sometimes cost more harm than good

 

[Pearljam5000]

personally I do like their current pricing and made in Finland... racing everything to cheap labor sometimes cost more harm than good

Yes
On the hand lowering the price by 10%-20% would make them accessible to more people and they won't lose money because they will have more sales.
If the 8351B would cost like the kh310 I would have bought yesterday, unfortunately it's too expensive and I'll have to save for a few years

 

[TimVG]

Yes, not many people realize the speakers are made in Finland - not exactly cheap labor. Imagine if the JBL 708Ps were made in the USA instead of Mexico.

Exactly. Genelec also puts sustainability high on their priority list and offer extremely good after sales support. This company has been around for a while and knows what it's doing. There's also a reason Genelecs rarely fail in the field.

I don't mind them moving production to China and paying half price.

That may your opinion, but I'm more comfortable paying the premium, and owning a product from a manufacturer that will likely be able and willing to service it in 20 years. Good luck on that with made in China products.

 

[Spocko]

I don't mind them moving production to China and paying half price.

Ironically, I bet just moving production to the USA would lower the price by 20% - with current state subsidies and tax incentives (not to mention shipping), our labor costs in Texas or Alabama would be lower than Finland I believe.

 

[respice finem]

That's right, but as a buyer in Europe, I would prefer to have production or at least service in Europe just in case. Waiting for weeks or months for a repair is not pleasant, and naturally, active speakers can fail more often than passives. Price isn't everything. For buyers in the USA it would be favourable of course to have production/service in the USA. Then again, with today's increasing "environmental awareness", a production site on every continent would be perhaps optimal.

 

[Frank Dernie]

If I was in the USA I would be checking out JBL or Revel.
In the UK I would consider KEF, Genelec, Neumann, Dutch & Dutch, Kii.
There are several good makes so why not buy local?

 

[djigibao]

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Genelec 8050B powered studio monitor (speaker). It was kindly purchased by a member used and drop shipped to me. It costs US $1895 each when new.

I was horrified when I noticed the speaker was simply put in a plastic bag, dumped into a much larger box with a bit of padding. As a result speaker was moving around in there, bashing the sides of the box. I opened the box and there was not a scratch on the speaker and it operated as if new! This is one robust enclosure and speaker:

View attachment 113629

Lots of controls on the back. I left all of them off for both measurement and listening tests:
View attachment 113630

Input sensitivity seems high. I had to turn down the volume to measure and listen to the speaker.

I like the iso pads on it. It provides built-in isolation although deep bass still gets through.

The rounded shape of the speaker made it hard to align on my measurement stand. So angles are a bit approximate.

Measurements that you are about to see were performed using the Klippel Near-field Scanner (NFS). This is a robotic measurement system that analyzes the speaker all around and is able (using advanced mathematics and dual scan) to subtract room reflections (so where I measure it doesn't matter). It also measures the speaker at close distance ("near-field") which sharply reduces the impact of room noise. Both of these factors enable testing in ordinary rooms yet results that can be more accurate than an anechoic chamber. In a nutshell, the measurements show the actual sound coming out of the speaker independent of the room.

I performed over 1000 measurement which resulted in error rate of around 1%.

Speaker was kept warm indoors prior to measurements. Measurement temperature was 59 degrees.

Reference axis was as recommended in the manual: the upper rim of the woofer.

Measurements are compliant with latest speaker research into what can predict the speaker preference and is standardized in CEA/CTA-2034 ANSI specifications. Likewise listening tests are performed per research that shows mono listening is much more revealing of differences between speakers than stereo or multichannel.

Genelec 8050B Measurements
Acoustic measurements can be grouped in a way that can be perceptually analyzed to determine how good a speaker is and how it can be used in a room. This so called spinorama shows us just about everything we need to know about the speaker with respect to tonality and some flaws:

View attachment 113631

On-axis response is pretty good although not ruler flat indicating DSP is not used for minor correction. Directivity (comparison of on and off-axis) is quite good although rather flat as studio monitors typically are.

The usual port resonances are there but in a more controlled manner:
View attachment 113634

Early window shows a vertical dip around 2 kHz:
View attachment 113633

Predicted-in room response for far field listening shows the same one dip as deviation from excellence:
View attachment 113635

During my sweeps for distortion at 96 dBSPL, I could hear severe low frequency distortion and indicator coming on as well:

View attachment 113636

That one high frequency peak is interesting. Wonder what the cause of that is?

Definitely usable at 96 dBSPL though if you cut off low frequencies:

View attachment 113637

As noted, directivity is excellent:

View attachment 113639

View attachment 113640

View attachment 113641

Finally we have CSD/waterfall which shows the resonances we have already seen elsewhere:
View attachment 113642

Genelec 8050B Listening Tests
Just turn on this speaker, play the first track and in five seconds you know the tonality is right. Track after track in my reference list sounds beautiful even though I have curated them using my Revel Salon 2 speakers -- power of speakers being optimized to same ideals/targets! Bass was strong and deep which was satisfying.

Right when I wanted to quit and give the 8050B my highest honors, bass came and sadly at high volumes, it becomes ugly. The woofer makes this "brrrrrr" sound, first faintly and then strongly as you push it. I suspect it is some kind of limiting due to amplifier running out of juice as clipping indicator also comes on. Granted, I am listening to one speaker and you would use two but still, a speaker at this price range should be able to play cleaner in bass. I worry that the amplification (as usual) is holding it back.

I dialed in a 35 Hz steep high-pass filter and this got rid of most of the problem at a a slight loss in low frequency response. For a dynamic system, you need subwoofers with this speaker.

Conclusions
Hopefully this review is without (much) surprise. We expect Genelec to deliver on build quality, on and off-axis response. The larger woofer helps produce satisfying and good level of bass. For someone like me who likes to push speakers and systems , it is not able to deliver loudness without limitation and rather ugly distortion. Your application may differ though.

I am going to recommend Genelec 8050B for low to medium listening levels for both high-fi and studio applications.

------------
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

Appreciate any donations using: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/

Is there somewhere a playlist of your "reference list"?

 

[richard12511]

What's strange is that the M106 has exactly the same amount and profile of 4th and 5th at 96 dB, but didn't get any such remark.

I think there are a few things going on here. In order of importance(at least imo):

1. For protection, Genelec speakers limit themselves intentionally before reaching the max volumes they can actually play. In terms of reliability and long term satisfaction, Genelec is doing the right thing. But, for short term review style listening tests, Genelec would do better to turn off that protection circuitry. Long term reliability isn't a criteria here. Besides, Amir's an experienced listener who knows when he's pushing a speaker beyond its limits. I'd really bet that Genelec speakers would do better by giving Amir full control(the way Revel does) of the dynamics. The M106 does have way more distortion, but it will at least actually let you play. 8050 cuts you off before you ever reach those levels of distortion. We're super insensitive to bass distortion anyway, so it makes sense that a speaker which prioritizes spl is more preferred than a speaker that prioritizes low distortion and safety.

2. Genelec speakers artificially(electronically) extend the range at which they can play, whereas Revel's extension is more dictated by the physical limits of their drivers and enclosures. For low-normal to quiet listening, Genelec does the right thing, but for loud listening, it limits dynamics. This has come up several times in reviews, and Amir seems to prefer speakers that just avoid playing low frequencies that their physical characteristics can't truly handle.

This is especially problematic for this speaker when combined with #1, as instead of just increasing distortion for super low notes, or not playing them, the 8050 actually stops you from increasing the volume all together. An improvement to Genelec's protection approach(at least for ASR reviews) would be to do what speakers like the Devialet Phantom, KEF KC62, and Google Nest Audio do. Instead of limiting volume when you can't play the deep bass any louder, change the frequency response. For professional use(they're primary market), it makes sense why Genelec does it the way it does. For professional use, you wouldn't want the frequency response to be silently changing in the background. Much better to know when you've reached the limits of the speaker, and turn it down. It hurts them here, though, since they're being judged by a home use(enjoyment) criteria.

3. Comparing objective(measured) performance vs panther rating of speakers like (8341, KH310, 8050, 708p, M106) has made it clear to me that there is a small Revel/JBL bias at play. I think this is unavoidable, and I don't blame Amir at all for this. The bias would still exist even under double blind conditions. It has nothing to do with him selling Harman products. With the 8351b as my reference, I would have a similar, but opposite Genelec bias if I were in his position. Actually, my bias would be worse, due to less experience.

The reason for this bias is that we can't avoid comparing speakers to our reference. There is no objective "truth" that our brain can latch on to. It must compare against what it has heard before. The Salon2 is Amir's reference, and the best speaker he's ever heard. There is no objective truth(say perfectly flat, perfect beam-width, no distortion) for his brain to use as a guide. Objectively, Genelec speakers may measure "better"(flatter, more consistent beam, lower distortion), but that may actually be working against them here. The Salon2 isn't as flat as an 8341 or 8351, nor is it as consistent off axis, nor is its distortion as low, so improvements in those areas aren't strictly a good thing when the Salon2 is the standard. Having heard/owned(/ing) Revel, JBL, Genelec speakers, there is definitely a slight house sound to each, and Revel/JBL speakers definitely sound closer to Salon2s than Genelec speakers do. It makes sense why they are subjectively judged as better.

4. Wide dispersion is most advantageous in mono. This isn't controversial, and Floyd Toole himself has even said this. As the number of channels increases, wider dispersion becomes less and less advantageous. Personally, I've also found this to be true when blind testing my JTR speakers against my Revel M105 and Infinity Beta speakers.

5. In the US, the 8050b is almost twice the price of the M106. That needs to be a big factor, and 8050b must be held to a much higher standard because of it. Amir(imo) has gotten much better at taking value into account as a criteria as he's gotten more reviews under his belt, which makes sense. I think Amir has done a great job here of taking the high price tag into account.



Point #3 is likely to arouse some controversy, but I want to stress that I don't blame Amir for it. I think it's a human thing, and it will be a problem for any reviewer. Even ignoring point 3, there are imo good reasons(1, 2, 4, 5) that the M106 deserves a higher overall(panther) score than the 8050.

 

[Rottmannash]

This is essentially a speaker from 2005, then. Kinda makes it even more impressive... and past time IMO for Genelec to give it a real update with class D amps and at least 250W on the woofer!

This doesn't have Class D amps inside?

 

[Frank Dernie]

This doesn't have Class D amps inside?

No, I think the older non-DSP Genelecs are all class AB.
The 8050B certainly is spec is 150W bass 120W tweeter.