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ELAC UBR62 Speaker Review

jae

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What are the main intended differences between this and the DBR62?
 

Livnmuskoka

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What are the main intended differences between this and the DBR62?

The UBR62's are clearer and more detailed than the DBR62's while remaining mostly neutral in my room.
I had 3 DBR62's for LCR, calibrated along with a powerful 12" sealed subwoofer from an Anthem MRX520 receiver.
Initial thoughts on the UBR62's are better clarity and detail, but this is only trying to focus on 900hz and up because I haven't recalibrated the system yet, I'm still waiting for the UCR52 centre speaker to arrive.
For the meantime I'm still using the calibrated single DBR62 as centre.
I'm now also using a Rotel RB1582mk2 power amp for the stereo speakers.
From what I hear right now, I'd guess it'll be about 10% better overall sound after recalibrating from what I had.
Is a 10% improvement worth the $4k additional price of the 3 Uni-Fi Reference speakers and Rotel power amp? For me yes, for most others probably not.
So right now I have about $7,500 CDN invested in this 3.1 system.
I've heard many high end systems over the last 20 years to know that to get another 10% step up from that would cost an additional $15k + for a trio of Kef Reference 1's or better.
And then to get the final 5 or 10% improvement beyond that could be another $5k + to have a perfectly treated room before doing the Anthem room correction.
So for me, this is where I stop for now. I'm too invested in other things to pay $15k + for speakers and full on treatments won't happen in our main livingroom, neither of us want that.
Hope this helps.
 
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Beershaun

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Well, my ears aren't as well calibrated as Livin' la vida mus koka to give you percentages and dollar figures but the main difference from my understanding is the coaxial driver. It is supposed to provide better vertical and horizontal dispersion. Which means the sound is more consistent and linear in a wider cone horizontally and vertically so you don't have to sit in one spot to hear the best sound and you or many people can move around the room and enjoy the music. But read the measurements to see if it's delivering on that promise or not.
 

tpsjo

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Hi, people. The UBR62 just have got to me. Exactly 5 days ago. I also have a lot of loudspeakers.
They are very well constructed, designed. Top finish (the oak side walls, the baffle, the front fabric panels). The drivers and their metal frames are gorgeous, if I may say. The banana terminals are hard metal, not painted plastic.
The box itself is hard made, no bass resonance. The front bass port is giving pure and exact bass. Very pleasant, if you put your ear in front of it. I like to verify the drivers very close, to hear if they are giving what I expect. And then, I go to my listening spot (3-4m far) and confront.
The mids are very sober.
What i don't like is that he saxophone and the clarinet are low expressed. It's like they are covered with a pod lid. The sound is not bright, transparent.
My room is a 4x5m one. I have diy absorbant material panels at about 9.6m² from total of 20m² hanged from the ceiling.
All my other loudspeakers are well bright and transparent.
UBR62 sound like they have a dip once at about 7-8khz. And twice, they should have a little bit grow at 17-20khz. Instead, the treble are the most lower from all the FR. They are under the medium SPL of the speaker.
Don't get me wrong: I can clearly see/hear that they are very well done and designed. But, in my opinion, the crossover is wrong designed in the upper spectrum.
Comparing with other speakers (Dali Sensor 3 for example), with UBR62 I have to increase @16-18khz, at about +2/3db, in order to get that crisp.
UBR are very precise and detailed. Good bass either, for a 6.5" driver bookshelf.
I am thinking to return them because of the lack of brightness and transparency.
My conclusion is:
They look better than they sound.
I am unhappy because I hoped to sound better. I know, it is a subjective opinion. But I had other speakers to compare. And much cheaper than the UBR62. Twice or more less. Not so precise and clear sound, but more transparent and crisp than the UBR62.
PS: 98% of my listening time is in flat mode (direct source). I am listening .flac and 320kbps compressed. All sourced from CD or studio masters.
 

Livnmuskoka

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Hi, people. The UBR62 just have got to me. Exactly 5 days ago. I also have a lot of loudspeakers.
They are very well constructed, designed. Top finish (the oak side walls, the baffle, the front fabric panels). The drivers and their metal frames are gorgeous, if I may say. The banana terminals are hard metal, not painted plastic.
The box itself is hard made, no bass resonance. The front bass port is giving pure and exact bass. Very pleasant, if you put your ear in front of it. I like to verify the drivers very close, to hear if they are giving what I expect. And then, I go to my listening spot (3-4m far) and confront.
The mids are very sober.
What i don't like is that he saxophone and the clarinet are low expressed. It's like they are covered with a pod lid. The sound is not bright, transparent.
My room is a 4x5m one. I have diy absorbant material panels at about 9.6m² from total of 20m² hanged from the ceiling.
All my other loudspeakers are well bright and transparent.
UBR62 sound like they have a dip once at about 7-8khz. And twice, they should have a little bit grow at 17-20khz. Instead, the treble are the most lower from all the FR. They are under the medium SPL of the speaker.
Don't get me wrong: I can clearly see/hear that they are very well done and designed. But, in my opinion, the crossover is wrong designed in the upper spectrum.
Comparing with other speakers (Dali Sensor 3 for example), with UBR62 I have to increase @16-18khz, at about +2/3db, in order to get that crisp.
UBR are very precise and detailed. Good bass either, for a 6.5" driver bookshelf.
I am thinking to return them because of the lack of brightness and transparency.
My conclusion is:
They look better than they sound.
I am unhappy because I hoped to sound better. I know, it is a subjective opinion. But I had other speakers to compare. And much cheaper than the UBR62. Twice or more less. Not so precise and clear sound, but more transparent and crisp than the UBR62.
PS: 98% of my listening time is in flat mode (direct source). I am listening .flac and 320kbps compressed. All sourced from CD or studio masters.
Did you try temporarily removing your absorbent panels for a listening test? They might be what is lowering your high frequencies. I have a bright room now. And speakers that did sound very nice in other rooms, like Paradigm Prestige 15B's, were way too bright in here and I had to turn the treble down to -7 to tolerate them. The UBR62's are just borderline bright in here and sound is near perfection. Especially with Anthem room correction adjusting for the room up to about 900hz.
 

tpsjo

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The absorbant panels were needed because the room has no carpet on the floor and the walls are almost empty, so the room, without them, has a hall echo. All the speakers, that I have, sounds better after the panels were installed.
All the speakers sounded bad before the panels instalation, due to the echo in the room.
If we look at the Erin measured curve we can see that the FR decrease from low (85db) to high (81db and less), with a deep dip at 7-8khz (10db).
The sound signature of the UBR62 I am talking about is the same, either in the room (3-4meters away), or in the near field of them. So it is not a room treatment issue.
I am very permissive/tolerant with the sound. I can easily adapt. But, in the UBR62 situation, I can not. It is too obvious.
PS: and 83db real SPL ...
 
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Livnmuskoka

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The absorbant panels were needed because the room has no carpet on the floor and the walls are almost empty, so the room, without them, has a hall echo. All the speakers that I have sounds better after the panels were installed.
All the speakers sounded bad before the panels instalation, due to the echo in the room.
If we look at the Erin measured curve we can see that the FR is down from low to high, with a deep dip at 7-8khz.
The sound signature of the UBR62 I am talking about is the same, either in the room (3-4meters away), or in the near field of them. So it is not a room treatment issue.
I am very permissive/tolerant with the sound. I can easily adapt. But, in the UBR62 situation, I can not. It is too obvious.
PS: and 83db real SPL ...
Ok, I'm not sure then. In my room there is a 2db to 4db dip in the most fatiguing 1khz to 4khz range, which my sensitive ears need.
But then go back up to mostly flat until around 16khz. Some people may find that flat is bright, but my ears are good with it, and hear it as more detail with no fatigue. There was also about a 5db peak in my room around 500hz, which Anthem room correction smoothed out for me.
Before the UBR62's I had DBR62's, and the DBR-62's measured better in my room up to 900hz. But that doesn't matter to me because ARC fixes it anyway. I also like how I can stop the correction at 900hz instead of going up to 5khz. The lower the better I think.
If you want the best measuring, excellent value speakers, and without room correction, I'd try the DBR-62's. They are really good for the price, but if you have the right room or EQ, the UBR62's do give a little extra clarity and detail.
That's why I hardly ever recommend speakers to anybody. The person's room, ears, and taste are usually so different that personal reviews are irrelevant.
In a different room with different speakers around 7 years ago, all I did was switch my system to a different side wall of the same room and sound went from full and mostly neutral to thin, bright, and crappy.
It can be a long and expensive process to getting the right speakers, even with posted frequency response graphs.
 
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tpsjo

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I understant. I am talking about what drivers from the UBR62 gives/sounds, in the near field.
I am also a DIY enthusiast, made some 8 designs of crossover for some loudspeakers. And what was the measure that was the sound. I am talking near field. I am using DATS and OmniMic. They are damn precise and real.
I tought that UBR62 will have some damn crisp, transparent, that gives emotion. Because that's what sound has to be: emotion/feeling. If it just sound correct, or at least good, but do not produce emotion, it is in vain.
The tweeter of the UBR62 is shy. It doesn't shine. It is not bright. And to be clearly, the driver is NOT the problem. The driver is excellent. It's getting high in the frequency. The crossover is. It keeps the tweeter back a few db from the overall sound line.
Compared only with a cheap and dirty sound from Heco Victa series... the last one sounds more bright and produce emotion. I know I am comparing two different classes of loudspeakers, but I am doing this on purpose.
The sound that gets out of the UBR is like the sound that gets through a Dolby C NR filter, from an old cassette deck. It's like compressed, poor. It is detailed, but drained somehow. That dip in the 7-8khz region is making it sound also more poor.
I wanted this loudspeakers to sound good. I wanted so badly. Waited three months at pre-order.
 

Livnmuskoka

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I understant. I am talking about what drivers from the UBR62 gives/sounds, in the near field.
I am also a DIY enthusiast, made some 8 designs of crossover for some loudspeakers. And what was the measure that was the sound. I am talking near field. I am using DATS and OmniMic. They are damn precise and real.
I tought that UBR62 will have some damn crisp, transparent, that gives emotion. Because that's what sound has to be: emotion/feeling. If it just sound correct, or at least good, but do not produce emotion, it is in vain.
The tweeter of the UBR62 is shy. It doesn't shine. It is not bright. And to be clearly, the driver is NOT the problem. The driver is excellent. It's getting high in the frequency. The crossover is. It keeps the tweeter back a few db from the overall sound line.
Compared only with a cheap and dirty sound from Heco Victa series... the last one sounds more bright and produce emotion. I know I am comparing two different classes of loudspeakers, but I am doing this on purpose.
The sound that gets out of the UBR is like the sound that gets through a Dolby C NR filter, from an old cassette deck. It's like compressed, poor. It is detailed, but drained somehow. That dip in the 7-8khz region is making it sound also more poor.
I wanted this loudspeakers to sound good. I wanted so badly. Waited three months at pre-order.
Sorry they didn't work out for you, but to me and in my room they sound exactly like what you were looking for.
As I said in a previous post, and after hearing tons of speakers again just over the past 8 years of getting back into the hobby, the next step up for me that would make much of an improvement would be Kef Reference 1's at more than 5x the price.
Good luck in your search, it can be a long one.
I'm very happy now with my set up and knowing what my next step would be, but one that I don't want to make right now.
 

gmoney

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I just got these and previously had DBR62's. The 2 biggest differences for me are bass response and imaging. These don't measure like they dig that much deeper but there is way more bass response with these in my room compared to the DBR62. As for the imaging, IMO it's the most immediately noticeable difference to me. I can track an object moving from left to right in a more granular fashion + the width/sweet spot is huge. They pretty effortlessly disappear.

I much prefer these to the DBR62.
 

wric01

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I agreed the tweeter is holding back, got details and non fatigue going for it but missing some air. Let's get started with modding the crossover with better quality caps. In the mean time i just add a pair of
Airmotiv B1+ Pair Bookshelf Loudspeakers upside down to the chain.
Best Seller
Airmotiv B1+ Pair Bookshelf Loudspeakers

Airmotiv B1+ Pair
These AMT tweeters fill in the void and it works for me otherwise a super tweeter will do.
 

Beershaun

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I agreed the tweeter is holding back, got details and non fatigue going for it but missing some air. Let's get started with modding the crossover with better quality caps. In the mean time i just add a pair of
Airmotiv B1+ Pair Bookshelf Loudspeakers upside down to the chain.
Best Seller
Airmotiv B1+ Pair Bookshelf Loudspeakers

Airmotiv B1+ Pair
These AMT tweeters fill in the void and it works for me otherwise a super tweeter will do.
What is happening right now with this Post? Did it accidentally end up in this thread instead of whathifi?
 

NightFlight

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Living with the DBR62 and UBR62 right now. Regarding the sweet spot of the UBR62's... it's not as wide as you'd think. There is an ultra linear sweet spot within it. I triangulated the toe-in using a laser measure, starting just against outside my shoulders. From the listening position I lean forward until I hear it lock in. Then I would toe out about an inch successively until that sweet spot is available sitting upright comfortably. For me this was about 6" outward from the starting point with 8' listening distance.
 

NightFlight

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I agreed the tweeter is holding back, got details and non fatigue going for it but missing some air. Let's get started with modding the crossover with better quality caps.

Did you get anywhere with this? I've thought about replacing the resistors with mills to start. Lot of room to strap on some 1% bypass caps. I'm definitely a fan of the MiFlex KPCU series. Youtube audio tests say I don't hear much above 16khz, so I'm not overly concerned about 16-18khz. I can hear it, but I have to stop/start the test to be certain its there.
 

wric01

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Did you get anywhere with this? I've thought about replacing the resistors with mills to start. Lot of room to strap on some 1% bypass caps. I'm definitely a fan of the MiFlex KPCU series. Youtube audio tests say I don't hear much above 16khz, so I'm not overly concerned about 16-18khz. I can hear it, but I have to stop/start the test to be certain its there.
Nah i have yet to tear it apart, my first goals are to replace the satin connectors with copper ones and solidcore wires. It's robbing all the details with stock nickel binding posts.
 

Everett T

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Nah i have yet to tear it apart, my first goals are to replace the satin connectors with copper ones and solidcore wires. It's robbing all the details with stock nickel binding posts.
I highly doubt that the manufacturer robbed you of those things. It serves them no purpose and costs them nothing.

Feel free to change what you like, but I'm sure it won't make any difference, none measurable.
 

wric01

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My golden ear here detects difference with solid core, silver solder and binding posts. To each their own , capacitors and resistors isn't my forte thus i leave that to others to explore.
 

Everett T

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My golden ear here detects difference with solid core, silver solder and binding posts. To each their own , capacitors and resistors isn't my forte thus i leave that to others to explore.
No worries, just pointing out. These binding post are rarely replaced though...
Screenshot_20211126-185753_Chrome.jpg
 

NightFlight

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Not all things must be audible or measurable to cumulatively add up into audibility. This might be hearsay on this forum, but I don't think measurements are the last word, nor does it capture subjective experience. I do believe measurements keep us sane and on track, but beyond that its all just brain and ears.

I don't use fancy cables or connectors, so I'll just lob off a couple inches and strip the ends to replace the jumper bars. If the binding posts are really an issue, just drill the backplate and solder right to the crossover input. LOL

Aside from being funny, I have seen speakers done with outboard crossovers and the cabling cemented into place. Makes working on them so much easier.
 

Shazb0t

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Not all things must be audible or measurable to cumulatively add up into audibility. This might be hearsay on this forum, but I don't think measurements are the last word, nor does it capture subjective experience. I do believe measurements keep us sane and on track, but beyond that its all just brain and ears.

I don't use fancy cables or connectors, so I'll just lob off a couple inches and strip the ends to replace the jumper bars. If the binding posts are really an issue, just drill the backplate and solder right to the crossover input. LOL

Aside from being funny, I have seen speakers done with outboard crossovers and the cabling cemented into place. Makes working on them so much easier.
Show me you can pass a blind test swapping the binding posts. Let's be honest, you know you can't.
 
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