Does silver used in interconnects "sound" different than copper?

[DonH56]

50 ohms is used for many RF systems (radios, radar, etc.) and is a compromise between power handling (best at around 30 ohms) and attenuation (least around 75 ohms). That was chosen many years ago. 75 ohms is used for most video systems and many digital systems (AES). It is also a nice match to a typical dipole antenna; a simple 4:1 balun (matching transformer) gets you from the 300-ohm antenna impedance to 75-ohm cables and such. Some other systems use varied impedances; there is an older 93-ohm networking standard, PCIe uses 85-ohm differential, HDMI and SAS/SATA use 100-ohm differential, etc. Early telcom used 600-ohm lines.

AFAIK, 50 ohms and 75 ohms are standard in the USA for RF and audio/video applications.

 

[Mnyb]

More OT.

75Ohm RG59 can be used in older industrial fieldbuses .

I think in the early days of ethernet there was some coax solution before everything went optical or twisted pair ? is that the 93 ohm thing

 

[mhardy6647]

Early telcom used 600-ohm lines.

Yup. The "line level" signal standard, to the best of my knowledge, still traces back to the 600 ohm telephone line.
A random (i.e., googled) reference
https://www.fmsystems-inc.com/the-600-ohm-audio-standard-where-did-it-go/

 

[David Harper]

Just to be clear: I'm using 16ga. oxygen free stranded copper speaker wire about 6 feet long. Can anyone think of a reason why any other wire would be an improvement? I'm not being sarcastic or anything like that at all. It's a honest question.

 

[mansr]

Just to be clear: I'm using 16ga. oxygen free stranded copper speaker wire about 6 feet long. Can anyone think of a reason why any other wire would be an improvement? I'm not being sarcastic or anything like that at all. It's a honest question.

I can think of as many reasons as you wish, but none of them will have anything to do with reality.

 

[Helicopter]

Just to be clear: I'm using 16ga. oxygen free stranded copper speaker wire about 6 feet long. Can anyone think of a reason why any other wire would be an improvement? I'm not being sarcastic or anything like that at all. It's a honest question.

Nope. Nothing will improve audible performance. A bigger wire diameter or shorter wire could give a tiny and certainly insignificant measurable improvement.

 

[sq225917]

Cutting the old ends of and soldering plugs on might give a better connection, if they're green. But really, that's it.

 

[egellings]

Those Polk Audio cables of yore, besides having the capacitance problem, also tended to short out where the two conductors separated from the braid, since wear & bending is high there and the enamel coating would rub through and allow a short to happen. "If the left fist (hi-C) doesn't get you then the right one (short) will!" Poor amp just can't win.

 

[Mozphet]

Hi, I'm new here.

I might be in the minority here, but I don't think science can account for and explain everything the human mind is capable of experiencing in regards to audio. Not yet anyway. I'm also extremely open for new experiences and I'm not a critically (scientifically, I should say) minded person by nature.

Here's what I've found pertaining solely to IEM cables with both Dynamic Driver and Balanced Armature IEMs:

Pure Silver sounds ethereal, bright tilted, quick, transparent. The bass becomes imbedded in the highs.

Silver is like a highway for the treble alone and the bass is always playing catch-up which imparts a sense of weightlessness. Perception of detail and information is increased.


Pure Copper sounds tangible, warm tilted, unhurried, opaque. The highs are imbedded in the bass.

Copper offers, as far as I am concerned, a far more balanced representation of the music being replayed. There's an actual visceral physicality to the notes which is crucial to convincing and lifelike reproduction of sound in my opinion. There's also a satisfying slam and an overall roundness to the sound that's missing in silver.

Here's a hot take: It may be that because Copper is less conductive than Silver, it lowers the timing discrepancy between low and high frequencies (givens that high frequencies transmit faster). Bass is perceived to "stay" for longer, allowing for it to properly decay, because the highs have to "wait" for the bass to finish.


So, the foundations of the sound are polar opposites.

It's very, very interesting. I'm happy that I prefer copper so far, it's cheaper. Haven't tried Palladium, Gold or Rhodium though.

 

[BDWoody]

Hi, I'm new here.

Welcome!

Happy April 1!

 

[Mozphet]

Welcome!

Happy April 1!

Is that supposed to be a clever disregard of my post, or am I reading into it too much?

Genuinely asking. If yes, that's pretty funny.

 

[BillH]

If your post was serious, you have some serious reading to do on this site.
Nothing you report is based on science.

 

[Mozphet]

If your post was serious, you have some serious reading to do on this site.
Nothing you report is based on science.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but yall seem to be saying that because science can't explain why I perceive a difference in cables, the difference or experience that I report is nothing more than a delusion or placebo and therefore "not real" and should be disregarded.

I mean, I don't even think I can begin to explain why that perspective is utterly backwards.

It's like saying pain wasn't a real sensation until human beings discovered and could explain scientifically how pain signals travel along the nerves in the nervous system and why pain is necessary for our survival by notifying us of danger that may prove to be fatal.

 

[Raindog123]

I don't even think I can begin to explain why that perspective is utterly backwards

No matter how hard you try... An energetic subjectivist-newcomer on April 1st here on ASR might mean only one thing - Christmas came early this year!

And what do you feel about the sound of Ice-cold superconducting cables?

 

[Beave]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but yall seem to be saying that because science can't explain why I perceive a difference in cables, the difference or experience that I report is nothing more than a delusion or placebo and therefore "not real" and should be disregarded.

I mean, I don't even think I can begin to explain why that perspective is utterly backwards.

It's like saying pain wasn't a real sensation until human beings discovered and could explain scientifically how pain signals travel along the nerves in the nervous system and why pain is necessary for our survival by notifying us of danger that may prove to be fatal.

Sighted comparisons, no doubt. Right?

 

[Mozphet]

No matter how hard you try... An energetic subjectivist-newcomer on April 1st here on ASR might mean only one thing - Christmas came early this year!

And what do you feel about the sound of Ice-cold superconducting cables?

Haha I see. Your guys are a certain... breed no doubt I'm viewed in a similar light by you.

I don't have an opinion on cryotreatment of any kind. I guess I would have to compare 2 identical cables, one that's been treated and one that hasn't been treated, to make a fair assessment. It sounds cool though.

Edit: Silver already achieves a transparency high enough to make it sound undesirable to me personally (if not downright unpleasant at times) so a cryotreated superconductor would probably sound extremely artificial and hyper sharp if the logic follows. Do I think there would be a difference to be perceived between, say a copper cable and a superconductor such as that? Yes.

 

[Mozphet]

Sighted comparisons, no doubt. Right?

Sorry, my English fails me. What do you mean by that?

 

[Chrispy]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but yall seem to be saying that because science can't explain why I perceive a difference in cables, the difference or experience that I report is nothing more than a delusion or placebo and therefore "not real" and should be disregarded.

I mean, I don't even think I can begin to explain why that perspective is utterly backwards.

It's like saying pain wasn't a real sensation until human beings discovered and could explain scientifically how pain signals travel along the nerves in the nervous system and why pain is necessary for our survival by notifying us of danger that may prove to be fatal.

LOL more about y'all saying your approach is nothing more than a delusion or placebo. You are not a scientific instrument capable of accurate measurements is one way to think about it....even if you think you are.

 

[JSmith]

Silver is like a highway for the treble alone and the bass is always playing catch-up which imparts a sense of weightlessness. Perception of detail and information is increased.

This is why I sleep on a bed of silver, the weightlessness really helps my back and the perception factor means my dreams are much more vivid and positive.

Bass is perceived to "stay" for longer, allowing for it to properly decay, because the highs have to "wait" for the bass to finish.

This is done by dac filters, not cables.



JSmith

 

[KSTR]

@Mozphet , my answer in post #100 should be worth a read for you as well.
If "cable material sound" were real it would be really easy to expose it in measurements (detect the differences between silver and copper) but that did not happen yet. Mind you, perceived changes in a non-blinded test do not equal common hearing facts which require proper scientific method, they are just your personal facts of perception which are influenced by many more and stronger factors than a real change in the signal.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but yall seem to be saying that because science can't explain why I perceive a difference in cables, the difference or experience that I report is nothing more than a delusion or placebo and therefore "not real" and should be disregarded.

No, that's definitely not what "we" are saying. Science can explain why you perceive a difference in cables... but it's not the science of physics/electronics, it is the science of perception and what influences it. And those influences are strong and completely out of your control, you simply cannot unbias and unprime yourself (please read up on topics like biasing and priming to get a grip on this).