Do Audiophile Network Switches Make a Difference (video)?

[MetalDaze]

Listening at a low level I haven't heard it at all TBH, only after reading your post and listening at higher volume. Remotely reminds me of the "fossil" DNL back in the 70s:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noise_reduction#DNL

I'm watching in my main entertainment space on floor standing speakers, so that probably exacerbates the nuance. I noticed it immediately and thought for a second my fiber internet was stumbling.

Yeah the only experience with NR I have is Dolby B & C on my cassette decks. Mostly used for nostalgia and fun.

 

[respice finem]

Because, even with regulation it has to be enforced and it is such a small marketplace.
There are all sorts of things that are illegal and the police won't spend a moment looking into them.

And, it's rather hard to regulate subjective perception... The usual claim (by the smarter voodoists out there) is like "we designed our audiophile {insert BS product here} to achieve {insert unsubstantiated pile of subjective "lyric" here}..." There is no parameter to be regulated, as long as there is no physically/technically verifiable claim. Therefore, probably it should be mandatory to insert either an individual set of parameters for each unit, or at least a minimum set for the type sold. Say, if a manufacturer says his product reduces jitter - OK but state by how much, minimum. Not a chance they would do that.

 

[The Capstan]

That‘s interesting, well done Amir!
I think every person with reasonable knowledge would have been suprised in getting different results!

Now, step 2, I encourage you to perform a similar test with music streamers based on linux base, such as:
- Daphile*
- Volumio
- Picore
- gentoo
- Ropieee
- moode
etc...
do you think an objective test of this type using same USB DAC at the output will be possible?

That’s because when I catch conversations like ” solution A is more musical than B”, that reminds me the outcome of your latest test...
Thoughts?

thanks
Alessandro

* hardware configuration may play a role for X86 based solutions to be considered Vs Rpi based streamers.

 

[amarsicola]

And what about a streamer contest: I'm dreaming of a similar debunking analysis on streamers such as a 1200$ SOtM sMS-200ultra compared to a 40$ Raspberry Pi4...

 

[Krusty09]

Nice work on the video . I can see it now, 2 million views and the cash rolling in and all of your bills being paid off and a new lambo in the driveway. With all kidding aside for people who don't understand the reviews when in the written format this I think may help them better understand some of the things they read down the road. It's almost or is like Online school free of charge and I think our community will be a place for it.

Keep up the great work . This site Rocks.

 

[respice finem]

@ #64: AFAIR the RasPi has "bit perfect" output, so probably "nothing to see here", at least on the digital side of things (except the others can't do it).

 

[LoyK]

Nice video, really liking these!

These guys try to compare some switches:

Can you hear a difference? I like this kind of approach.
You could also record the DAC output and compare/analyse the recorded files. Would that be interesting or a flawed test?

 

[Koeitje]

Nice video, really liking these!

These guys try to compare some switches:

Can you hear a difference? I like this kind of approach.
You could also record the DAC output and compare/analyse the recorded files. Would that be interesting or a flawed test?

Lets ignore the fact that its a Youtube video for now, but why can we see what we are listening to? Useless.

 

[amirm]

Another great video. I subscribed and am ready to watch & learn more.

I just wanted to ask, does anyone else listening notice that the first 0.25 to 0.5 seconds of each sentence or word is cut off when @amirm pauses between his thoughts or speech? Is this from the settings on the microphone being used?

I am using a noise gate which is doing that. I will optimize it more. Without it, it picks up background noise.

 

[magicscreen]

That‘s interesting, well done Amir!
I think every person with reasonable knowledge would have been suprised in getting different results!

Now, step 2, I encourage you to perform a similar test with music streamers based on (supposedly common) linux MPD, such as:
- Daphile*
- Volumio
- Picore
- gentoo
- Ropieee
- moode
etc...
do you think an objective test of this type using same USB DAC at the output will be possible?

That’s because when I catch conversations like ” solution A is more musical than B”, that reminds me the outcome of your latest test...
Thoughts?

thanks
Alessandro

* hardware configuration may play a role for X86 based solutions to be considered Vs Rpi based streamers.

That is a difficult test because usually every "so called bitperfect" player has different output levels. Easy to think it sounds different because of that.
By the way it is wonderful, only 0 and 1 bits and somehow the volume is different, isn't it? *irony*

 

[amirm]

Loved watching it. Great job, Thank you. I find YouTube video's just under 10min are the most effective.

My goal was a shorter video but that is where I landed and was not going to spend time editing.

 

[Dmitri]

Loved watching it. Great job, Thank you. I find YouTube video's just under 10min are the most effective.

I don’t disagree with the premise, but that happens often at the cost of understanding. I got hooked almost immediately, and stayed hooked because of the clarity of explanation. For me...that was the secret sauce that kept me engaged. I might have lasted through a ten minute video, but I doubt I would have been as well informed. If people are serious about the subject, I believe they’ll stick around. I’m thinking that there’s a difference between those who would follow Amir on YouTube and those who spend their time watching the latest “Karen” incident or Donnie Dubious racing his BMX bike off a high dive.
My take anyway. A thoroughly subjective opinion based on emotionally based and intellectualized data conferred from a singular incident by a representative example of one.

...I know how much you guys love that....; )

 

[mash]

Great job Amir! Love this, pulls together a lot of good info from various reviews and discussions.

You could make a hundred of these and they would all be valuable. My vote for some great ones:

1. Audiophile power supplies in different applications....streamer, dac, roon core
2. Cables...usb, digital, audio rca/balanced, speaker
3. Streamer shoot out....std PC vs RPi vs specialized boxes like Micro Rendu / Sotm

A lot of informaiton of these topics is available in the older reviews/discussions but it can be hard finding it when you are doing research. Having a set of real world audio myth debunking videos is a HUGE service to the community.

 

[respice finem]

I am using a noise gate which is doing that. I will optimize it more. Without it, it picks up background noise.

For me it's not annoying as it is, just noticeable, especially now I know it's there
I think the easiest way "out" would be to a) lower the mic sensitivity if possible, b) sit as close as possible to the mic. Then (due to more direct sound) the noise gate probably wouldn't be required any more.

 

[617]

@amirm you have a good presence on video.

 

[respice finem]

That is a difficult test because usually every "so called bitperfect" player has different output levels. Easy to think it sounds different because of that.
By the way it is wonderful, only 0 and 1 bits and somehow the volume is different, isn't it? *irony*

The digital output is altered, even if only by appending zeroes, by digital volume control - not in quality, but in level. The other case is analog volume control/attenuation, as well as any kind of analog "preamplification" etc. Anyway, a comparison that is not precisely at the same output level would be "apples and oranges". Basically the same error many people make when "comparing" speakers or headphones, one pair 3dB more sensitive than the other, the louder one will be "better".

 

[LoyK]

Lets ignore the fact that its a Youtube video for now, but why can we see what we are listening to? Useless.

You can download lossless files here and just listen to their recordings. Another idea would be to minimize the window, close your eyes or deactivate the monitor ;-)

 

[eddantes]

Excellent video @amirm ! Can you be my dad? (Although we might be contempraries ) That was so kind and patient an explanation. Kudos!

 

[Asinus]

There are snake-oil free, audio-grade network switches that are kind of expensive but sort of justify the price increase.

eAVB switches need special HW to handle the gPTP packages which actually could help with jitter, but you need your whole system aware of and run on AVB, not just by using the fancy network switch.

It is mostly inconsequential for consumers and rare even on pro installations.

 

[3125b]

... but what's the point of a fix if there is no problem in the first place?