Denon AVR-X4700 AVR Review (Updated)

[peng]

No i did not say this. i was just incorrectly thinking that the fact it could disable its L+R amps would make it better at pre out.

It does, but it depends on the output you need to drive the amp. At below 1.4 V, it makes no difference.
"clipping" is the term Amir used, but that's his own definition. Most would not consider it clipping until distortions reach at least 0.1%, that is -60 dB.

 

[connta]

Did you get the serial number method directly from Denon? If it is from a poster, unless he included the link to the source, then it may not be reliable.
The other way is to go by the manufacturing year. According to D+M/Sound United, the DAC chip was substituted in the spring of 2021.

Denon Replaces AKM AK4458 DAC IC in X4700H and X6700H

Per the Denon website (Google translation from Japanese) in Japan in the product information for at least the X4700H and X6700H AVR's: "The D / A converter IC has been changed since the spring of 2021." The previous DAC IC in the two products is the 8-channel AK4458. This is a rather...

www.audiosciencereview.com

I have the unit setup, i bought it, im reading the SN myself it is DBCT06228345 and that is BELOW 70001 so should be old stock but i bought it new like 10 days ago, doesnt look refurb either. There is absolutely no date reference anywhere on the box or the unit itself, neither manufacture nor import. It looks brand new down to last detail. I suspect it is TI but for all i know it might be a weird case of "lost inventory" from 2 years ago, it happened before.

 

[peng]

I have the unit setup, i bought it, im reading the SN myself it is DBCT06228345 and that is BELOW 70001 so should be old stock but i bought it new like 10 days ago, doesnt look refurb either. There is absolutely no date reference anywhere on the box or the unit itself, neither manufacture nor import. It looks brand new down to last detail. I suspect it is TI but for all i know it might be a weird case of "lost inventory" from 2 years ago, it happened before.

It looks like you are missing one number and if so, then the "8" would be the fifth digit from the right, and the manufacturing date might be June 2022; and that would mean it has the TI chip.

Reference post:

Denon Replaces AKM AK4458 DAC IC in X4700H and X6700H

Interestingly here where I live the Denon 8500HA is significantly more expensive (by 1k) than the 8500H plus its 8k board. I wonder, are the DACs in the 8500H (not HA) guaranteed to be the AKMs? If then, it's an even better deal getting the older model. If you look at the photos on the...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[connta]

Son of a gun, ye, there are two "3" instead of one, so 83345 and that confirms it as a TI version (as suspected). Might be down to DAC but old Onkyo with AKM DAC just sounds better out of the box untouched.

Some of other "not so great" things in this upgrade are built in EQ and Denon HDMI settings, both are horrendous. 1/1 octave EQ filter on a 1500$ 2020. device (1300 paid but still)?! Onkyo (600$, 8 yrs ago) has 1/3 octave that is right on the money, like i set it up 1 dB cut and measurement in REW is cut exactly 1 dB centered on the 1/3 octave. Denon built in EQ is less precise to begin with and it doesnt reproduce 1:1 what you set and what you measure like Onkyo did. I guess you have to go Audissey app route to get a decent EQ. Also, Denon ALWAYS hijacks primary monitor setting whenever it is turned on even tho i dont use video outputs at all (comp->separate hdmi to tv and AVR, no passthru) but whenever i turn on AVR it hijacks the primary monitor setting, its crazy. Onkyo certainly didnt do this, same TV, GPU, cables, etc. Also, auto stand by is finicky, one time it triggers, sometime it doesnt, cant figure out whats that about.

All in all, price was decent (1300) but i'm hardly "blown away" by anything on this thing, overall it is better but not worth double the price... if i paid upwards of 1500, i'd be pissed.

 

[mmshah]

Recently picked up a x4700h, but am having trouble with getting 4k 120hz from my Xbox to work. My unit has the 8k enhanced setting so I'm pretty sure it's got the updated hdmi chip with no need for adapter, xbox settings say 4k 120 hz is supported but trying to change from 60 hz to 120hz results in a black screen. All cables support 4k 120 hz when plugged in directly from Xbox to tv. Do I need to check the serial number to see if I have a unit with an old hdmi chip?

Nvm, just checked the serial 10/20 date of manufacture so have the buggy hdmi chip, but good dacs I guess?

Thanks

 

[connta]

Pretty much, TBH just use eARC, send sound to TV then let TV pass it thru to AVR, since only sound goes to AVR you shouldnt have any problems. Since XBox is all digitaly encoded formats you should be getting full surround.

 

[mmshah]

Pretty much, TBH just use eARC, send sound to TV then let TV pass it thru to AVR, since only sound goes to AVR you shouldnt have any problems. Since XBox is all digitaly encoded formats you should be getting full surround.

Yup, that's how I've set it up now. I can't find the link on denon's site for the 8k hdmi adapter (SPK618) anymore. There faq for it just links to page that doesn't exist, are they not available anymore? Messaged denon will see what they say.

 

[ban25]

Yup, that's how I've set it up now. I can't find the link on denon's site for the 8k hdmi adapter (SPK618) anymore. There faq for it just links to page that doesn't exist, are they not available anymore? Messaged denon will see what they say.

You might be able to buy one of these, but no guarantee that it works...

AVS-3 - 3 In/1 Out HDMI Switcher - Switcher for up to three 8K devices connected to select 8K AV Receivers. | Denon - US

The AVS-3 - 3 In/1 Out HDMI Switcher Switcher for up to three 8K devices connected to select 8K AV Receivers. from Denon provides high quality audio for your hi-fi needs. Explore more AV Receivers at Denon - US.

www.denon.com

 

[connta]

Personal advice, sure, try to get the adapter if they still give out some, might need it in the future but for XBox i'd say leave it as it is, youll have way less problems with only audio transmitting over a repeater. HDMI 2.1 is still finicky, certainly more so on 2020. devices, cables are sheite QC too, i got some cables that just refuse to do 2.1 speeds on Samsung TV's, work fine on LG, etc.

 

[mmshah]

Update: Denon is still sending the HDMI adapters out, but you need to contact support to get them if you have an affected unit.

 

[Macfox]

Can anyone confirm whether the adapter with the latest firmware updates finally fixed 4K + VRR? I've seen many reports of people still having issues when connecting for example an Xbox and outputting combinations of 4K, VRR and/or HDR after the adapter was released. I'm wondering whether this is finally fixed with later updates, or if the problem is so severe it can't be fixed. I don't have a 4K TV yet, but am planning on buying one next year. Would really like to know whether I can expect functional 4K + VRR and preferably HDR. 4K/120 would be icing on the cake for the few games that actually support it.

 

[ban25]

Can anyone confirm whether the adapter with the latest firmware updates finally fixed 4K + VRR? I've seen many reports of people still having issues when connecting for example an Xbox and outputting combinations of 4K, VRR and/or HDR after the adapter was released. I'm wondering whether this is finally fixed with later updates, or if the problem is so severe it can't be fixed. I don't have a 4K TV yet, but am planning on buying one next year. Would really like to know whether I can expect functional 4K + VRR and preferably HDR. 4K/120 would be icing on the cake for the few games that actually support it.

The V2 X3700H has no problem with 4K120 and VRR on it's single HDMI 2.1 input. From what I have read, the original AKM X3700H never functioned properly with the XBX in 4K120/VRR/Dolby Vision.

 

[Macfox]

The V2 X3700H has no problem with 4K120 and VRR on it's single HDMI 2.1 input. From what I have read, the original AKM X3700H never functioned properly with the XBX in 4K120/VRR/Dolby Vision.

I have the AKM X4700H. So you're saying that, even with the latest updates and using the adapter, it still won't work reliably? That's a bummer...
Can anyone actually using an AKM x700H confirm? I'm primarily interested in 4K/60 + VRR + HDR.

 

[mmshah]

I have an akm x4700h and Xbox x, will check and update once my adapter arrives.

 

[Macfox]

I have an akm x4700h and Xbox x, will check and update once my adapter arrives.

Great, thanks in advance! Fingers crossed it works...

 

[mmshah]

Setup the SPK618 HDMI adapter today, Xbox Series X to adapter to Denon x4700h to LG OLED working fine at 4k @ 120 hz with VRR enabled. Just have the VRR setting enabled haven't actually played a game that uses VRR yet thou.

 

[marktrumpet]

It seems pretty established in this thread that in Pure Direct with an analog input, no digitizing is done

I'm curious what it's doing when adding in a sub, but still in Pure Direct. If you set up 2 channel settings with large speakers, LFE+Main, the sub is active even in Pure Direct mode. I'm guessing that it is sending the main speakers an untouched "pure" full-range signal, and then sending a the same signal to the sub, but low-passed (via some ADC -> DAC mechanism) at the crossover frequency set in the 2 channel settings.

Anyone know?

 

[KMO]

It's possible it's going ADC->DAC for the sub.

Could also have an analogue LPF used pretty much just for this scenario. Some Denons certainly have had that - don't know if they still do it. Fixed-frequency only, mind. You could check to see if the crossover frequency setting has any effect. If it doesn't, it's an analogue path.

 

[Music1969]

I'm curious what it's doing when adding in a sub, but still in Pure Direct. If you set up 2 channel settings with large speakers, LFE+Main, the sub is active even in Pure Direct mode. I'm guessing that it is sending the main speakers an untouched "pure" full-range signal, and then sending a the same signal to the sub, but low-passed (via some ADC -> DAC mechanism) at the crossover frequency set in the 2 channel settings.

@peng would know

 

[peng]

@peng would know

Thank you, but I can can't say much more than what I did in the other thread:

Direct, Pure Direct & Stereo with Audyssey by-pass

If you have a mike and the REW App you can measure the difference.

www.audiosciencereview.com

Actually, I would add that I think the OP's speculation seems reasonable, that's probably how it is done, as I doubt the newer D+M AVRs would include analog circuity to do bass management specifically for direct/pure direct mode. We likely can only know the specifics if and when D, or M starts selling service manuals again, that practice seems to have stopped since around 2018/19?? Or if people who have direct contacts to their engineering, such as Amir and Gene, the rest of us cannot get pass their first line customer support team, who typically don't have the knowledge of (or access) to such level of technical information.