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Denon AVR-X3700H AVR Review
- Thread starter amirm
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My experience was quite different. When I compared the AVR-X3400H with my Cambridge audio preamp that has better spec than the P6, and incidentally, the A21 power amp too, I didn't find even subtle difference in pure direct mode using external DACs (tried a few, including two that measured quite well on ASR) to the AVR's analog input. The AVR-X3700H measured better than the X3500H so I fully expect it to perform even better, audibly or not. The P6's specs do not look impressive, unless it has a feature or two that you need, you may be better off with some of the DAC/headphone amps that measured near the top of the chart. I think the HT bypass feature is overrated, I had it before and never felt the need to use, but obviously ymmv..
That doesn't sound right. The A21 is only rated 250 W 8 ohm, 400 W 4 ohms. The X3700H has more than enough output voltage for the A21 to reach its rated output.
Here is what Amir had mentioned in the review of the x3700h:
As you see, peak performance with the amplifiers off is around 1.1 volts with SINAD of 101 dB which is excellent for an AVR. With the amps on, you are OK up to 1.4 volt output before it nose dives. So when selecting an external amplifier for channels beyond fronts, make sure it can output its maximum power at or below 1.4 volts (usually specified as "sensitivity").
By my back-of-the-envelope calculations, one needs in excess of 1.58 volts to get rated power from the A21. [sqrt(250*8)/28.28]. Even in case of all amps switched off, the 3700h preamp module SINAD goes down quite a bit at the necessary preamp output voltage levels. And for headroom, one needs much more. In fact, as per the ASR measurements, the more expensive Denon models can perform a bit better in terms of distortion in the 1.5V - 2V range but not as good as good separate preamps.
Additionally, using a preamp like the P6, I can run A21 in class A (as opposed to class AB) mode upto a higher wattage level than if I were to use the 3700h.
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Don't forget you can disconnect the front left and right channel if you are using the 3700 for two channel stereo.
The A21 is only class A (sort of) up to about 8 W at the most so the 3700 will have way more than enough output for that if that's what you are concerned about.
Also, you are aiming for 101 dB SINAD? I don't recall seeing any (may be I missed one or two?) preamp ASR measured could to that, DAC, headphone amps, yes but not full blow preamps like the P6. May be it could do it but I doubt it very much. Hopefully someone will send one in.
I just turned on my 3700h and it has a firmware update ready to install. I installed the update but could not find any release notes. Do you know if denon posts the release notes of firmware updates
Thanks
Don't forget you can disconnect the front left and right channel if you are using the 3700 for two channel stereo.
The A21 is only class A (sort of) up to about 8 W at the most so the 3700 will have way more than enough output for that if that's what you are concerned about.
Also, you are aiming for 101 dB SINAD? I don't recall seeing any (may be I missed one or two?) preamp ASR measured could to that, DAC, headphone amps, yes but not full blow preamps like the P6. May be it could do it but I doubt it very much. Hopefully someone will send one in.
Another issue (perhaps, naturally so) I have with the x3700h is that I cannot use Audyssey in preamp mode. Only way to do so is to switch on internal amps (thus worsening SQ even if I’m using A21 and no internal amplification).
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I set up Audyssey in preamp mode with an Anthem MCA 50 5 channel amp.
Am I missing something?
Did I not actually set it up?
I've been wondering why everytime I turned on my x3700h, the volume went to minimum.
It's fixed in this update which is the fix I care most.
That's another thing that does not sound right at all! If true that is a serous issue that Denon has to fix. Are you sure you have done everything right. If there isn't anything you can do to fix this, you should try a factory reset and see what happens. By the way, I think I have done enough comparison tests to confidently say in a blind test, the Denon in preamp mode (or even in non preamp mode if you don't need more than 200 W peak at all times) will do as good as the P5, P6 and many other preamps. On the medical drug side, Placebo effects are so effective in some people that it is one of the issue that vaccine trials have to deal with (https://www.statnews.com/2020/10/13/placebo-response-a-hidden-risk-to-covid-19-trials/) I know it is a different thing, but I find it interesting to read about..
I am not saying the night and day difference you heard isn't real to you, not at all, but just want to share my own similar experience in early days that resulted in unnecessary spending on my fair share of preamps (among other audio gear), still own 3, all had been well reviewed (subjective ones only), though none have published measurements that I know of); and years later I am just as happy to use my AVR most of the time because of the convenience.
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I asked this question over at AVSForum (because nobody had replied to me here).
This is jdsmoothie's response: "If you change the AMP ASSIGN setting after running Audyssey, then Audyssey is usually disabled until Audyssey is run again under the new AMP ASSIGN configuration. More than likely that person failed to run Audyssey again after selecting the Pre-Amplifier mode. You can confirm Audyssey is active simply by pressing the INFO button on the remote."
I have only used my 3700 in preamp-only mode from day one, and set up Audyssey in preamp-only mode with no issues.
Today I found some kind of bug. Not sure it is the already reported down mix bug.
I have my htpc connected to 3700h with HDMI and sound is setup for 7.1 output. When there is no sound from the pc the denon input shows multichannel input 7.1. When I play a stereo stream from the pc. And use the surround multi in +Dsur.
The the sound of the center channel is very distorted. When i choose multi channel stereo the sound of the center channel is also fine. But when I setup my sound card in the pc for seteo only so no 7.1 output. The I can choose dolby audio dolby surround the sound of the center channel is fine.
Any suggestion.
I have my htpc connected to 3700h with HDMI and sound is setup for 7.1 output. When there is no sound from the pc the denon input shows multichannel input 7.1. When I play a stereo stream from the pc. And use the surround multi in +Dsur.
The the sound of the center channel is very distorted. When i choose multi channel stereo the sound of the center channel is also fine. But when I setup my sound card in the pc for seteo only so no 7.1 output. The I can choose dolby audio dolby surround the sound of the center channel is fine.
Any suggestion.
I found the support page of denon and registered my complain.
Thanks. I shall try that. Am optimistic!
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Good luck!
Did not work. Perhaps, because I’m sending the data from iOS’s Audyssey MultiEQ app?
Basically, before sending the data, I verify that ‘Preset 2’ is in Pre-amp mode. After sending the data to preset 2, it is no-longer in pre-amp mode. And, when I change preset 2 back to pre-amp mode, I cannot use the Audyssey correction anymore.
Tried resetting the receiver twice but to no avail.
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Ask your question over on AVSForum 2020 Denon AVR thread.
You guys seem knowledgeable can i aks a question in regards to the denon x3700. Im looking to buy it and use it as a prepro and have a 11x monoprice power amp due to the denons great reviews. However i am concerned with the hard clipping at 1.4v and with the monoprice 11x power amp rated at 1.6v if i understand that would be a problem. Im new to this science stuff and starting to understand quite a lot of the measurements however im struggling to understand if this mismatch between the denon and power amp is really a problem or its only a problem if listening very very loud or is it not a problem when not use the interal amp at all as i plan to do or even that its a problem that is always presnt due to different volt that will always affect the sound. Thank you and hope you have time to help me
