No pinout I can find either on Amazon or google search. So no guarantee they meet Hypex recommended pinout either.
-
Welcome to ASR. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!
Buckeye Amps: New US based Hypex multichannel amplifier builder, line-up announcement!
- Thread starter Buckeye Amps
- Start date
This has been gone over so many times here. Monoprice pinout has never, to my knowledge, ever had a wiring diagram that met the Hypex recommended RCA->XLR pinout:
Monoprice pinout you previously posted:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ilder-line-up-announcement.16835/post-1947872
My followup to following posts:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ilder-line-up-announcement.16835/post-1949706
The Monoprice premier cable diagram is wired exactly per what Hypex says can/may create problems. Of course given the poor history of QC reported here on this cable, maybe the "bad" cables not meeting the diagram are the ones that actually are okay.
Instead of "cry wolf" again, I suggest you read the Hypex article more carefully so you won't be repeating the same..
First of all, I am not sure if you got their pin 1 issue related to the XLR to XLR cable, if so, then it is easy, just focus on RCA to XLR cable that is the current topic.
Hint: read the fine print part that states: The RC network can usually be shorted...... Monoprice's cables are relatively cheap, so it is understandable, even expected that they are not going to bother with using the RC network, that naturally would be better but if found needed, just return it within the Amazon return window and/or solder such a network yourself, or go buy one that include the network.
To say "what Hypex says can/may create problems." is largely false, though of course anything is possible so "can/may" is fine as a cautionary, but your tone and emoji would indicate otherwise.
I hope this the last time we have to contradict each other unnecessary as we may be both right to begin with, again it is the "tone" that I am reacting to, lol.., and still, with due respect..
On page 5:
Last edited:
Instead of "cry wolf" again, I suggest you read the Hypex article more carefully so you won't be repeating the same..
First of all, I am not sure if you got their pin 1 issue related to the XLR to XLR cable, if so, then it is easy, just focus on RCA to XLR cable that is the current topic.
Hint: read the fine print part that states: The RC network can usually be shorted...... Monoprice's cables are relatively cheap, so it is understandable, even expected that they are not going to bother with using the RC network, that naturally would be better but if found needed, just return it within the Amazon return window and/or solder such a network yourself, or go buy one that include the network.
To say "what Hypex says can/may create problems." is largely false, though of course anything is possible so "can/may" is fine as a cautionary, but your tone and emoji would indicate otherwise.
I hope this the last time we have to contradict each other unnecessary as we may be both right to begin with, again it is the "tone" that I am reacting to, lol.., and still, with due respect..
On page 5:
View attachment 394048
Thanks for the hint. I did read it (and have posted/referenced the same pdf here). So getting back to pin 1 topic (not pin 2):
AES XLR pinout:
Pin 1 = signal ground
Pin 2 = positive signal
Pin 3 = negative signal
Case = NO CONNECTION
Monoprice cable = ties pin 1 to to both signal ground and chassis ground
Hypex cable = follows AES convention and does not tie pin 1 to chassis ground
From the Hypex pin 1 problem PDF:
"Ground loop currents only cause hum when they are actually allowed into audio circuitry through pin 1"
"This astoundingly simple solution has been widely publicized and is enshrined in a standard called AES48, It has been wildly successful. It has been almost universally adopted and pin 1 problems are largely over"
Not the first time I could be daft. Where am I wrong now?
Again, you seems to be referring to standard XLR cables, that is XLR at both ends. As the Hypex article cited:
You can see that the original talks about the "pin 1" issue had to do with the "connection between the audio circuit and pin1"
Here we are talking about RCA to XLR, so AEW48, while related and somewhat applicable in principle, is not totally relevant.
The diagram in the Hypex article we should refer to is the one I posted earlier but below again just for clarity:
And, again, please interpret it not literally/and or exactly, but electricall/practically based on electrical circuit theory:
In any case, the Monoprice diagram shows pin 1 connected to the RCA cable's shield wire, not the signal as I mentioned earlier. It also show a jumper connecting pin 1 to the XLR connector shell. From circuitry stand point, I did not feel it is doing much if anything so I left it alone, but I would admit that in the beginning I thought of cutting if off. I decided to try it as is first because it is "electrically" correct in principle. I have been tried those cables in 3 applications, one with my Purifi amp, the other with the Hypex amp, tried with both a Denon AVR and a Topping desktop DAC, and in fact a 3rd and 4th one with Oppo's Sonica and HA-1 DACs. None has any noise issues!!
However, since you seem insistent on the somewhat "academic" point that the Monoprice cable is not "exactly" wired as shown in the Hypex article, to help you in terms of peace of mind, I just (literally just..) Googled AES48 but it would take time to purchase it so let me just quote someone's, trusting that he/she got it directly from the standard:
Here you can see the "right" way, that basically (also not exactly in literal sense but practically) the same way the Monoprice diagram shows. That is, no jumper between pin 1 and the shell but electrically/practically the same. It is notable that the connection to the shell, that of course is also connected to chassis, is shown as "optional". That pretty confirm what I thought.
If you look at the "WRONG" part of the diagram, it is clear, as it is also mentioned in the Hypex article.
We are in agreement on that, but again, be careful with the fine print, that is "...into audio circuitry....", that is not the case with the Monoprice diagram.
No, I never thought or said that you were wrong as such, but I was not sure about your following posts such as:
and then you follow up with another post (thanks for at least including the emoji though):
The Monoprice premier cable diagram is wired exactly per what Hypex says can/may create problems. Of course given the poor history of QC reported here on this cable, maybe the "bad" cables not meeting the diagram are the ones that actually are okay
So I had to wonder, how come we seem to have been saying the same, or very similar things, even quoted the same Hypex article, could be doing such back and forth??
Your first post I quoted above is certainly not wrong, just unclear about the highlighted part in the first quote above. Where did you see pin 1 connected to the sleeve via pin3, that's not what the Monoprice diagram shows or you were referring to a different diagram?
As to the second quote above, I still wouldn't say that was wrong, but perhaps sensed some sarcasm, and that's no problem for me.
Still, just in case, as Dylan use the term QC, that's more likely the case. I have taken the Monoprice's XLR connector apart and can confirm it is wired as shown in their wiring diagram, and again, I have never experience any noise issues even with my highly sensitive hearing to hum/hiss noises.
I hope we have beaten this horse dead enough lol..
Last edited:
Monoprice does not "lift" the pin 1 connection to the shield as AES recommends. Hypex uses (shows) a simple RC network to "lift" the shield and help break a ground loop involving pin 1 (chassis) ground, which is the accepted approach (though more costly) for a generic connection between (AES or unknown) components. Shorting pin 1 to shield effectively connects RCA signal ground to XLR chassis ground, again not encouraged. May or may not work depending upon how the XLR input's circuit is configured.
As mentioned in one of my previous posts, Hypex diagram does show pin1 connected to shield via the RC, but also stated it can usually be shorted. As you said, "depending on the input circuit."
AES48 shows connection to chassis, so effective to the shield when the cable is connected.
I think the RC network is only needed in some cases but not in most cases, as you again, it would depend on the input circuit..
Ulimately ground loop current needs a loop that carries high enough current to cause audible noise. I don't see that being a issue for people using that cable to connect a buckeyeamp with a Denon or Marantz AVP or AVP, and I have been using them that way without issues.
Dylan mentioned cases of issues, that I think he is right about it probably is QC related issue On ASR, I don't recall posts about ground loop hum experienced by those using the Monoprice cable for connecting their avrs to buckeyeamps.
Hopefully Dylan can tell us more (such as connecting what device's unbalanced outputs to his amps?) about the use cases where people had experienced ground loop issues, or just other kind of issues.
Since Hypex cited Rane, I Googled them for info and found they recommended something very similar to Monoprice's, pin1 connected to shield:
Sound System Interconnection
RaneNote 110 explains the cause and prevention of ground loops and how to interface balanced and unbalanced gear with proper connections and wiring.
www.ranecommercial.com
The Ghantaudio cable (Ghantaudio seems to specialized in Hypex related stuff) and presumable follows their recommendations.
A05 --- Choseal 4N-OFC RCA(M) to XLR(M) Cable
RCA(Male) to XLR(Male) interconnect cable (1pc) --- Choseal 4N-OFC (99.99%), high quality RFI and EMI protection
www.ghentaudio.com
Again, pin1 connected to shield:
Last edited:
OP
- Joined
- May 28, 2020
- Messages
- 2,200
- Likes
- 8,751
- Thread Starter
- #2,288
I don't have specifics. Just reported issues. Especially during a period of time in 2023. As of late, they seem to be working fine for customers but I also have a customer recently who ordered (8) and one introduced hum.
Hence why I just point people to Cables Matter and Worlds Best...no reported hum yet with either of those brands.
Thanks, so it does not seem to be the majority case overall. By the way, you must be, or at least used to be, a frequent buyer of Ghentaudio, can you sell their cables? Surely you have many customers buying your amps for their AVRs that have RCA outputs only.
A05 --- Choseal 4N-OFC RCA(M) to XLR(M) Cable
RCA(Male) to XLR(Male) interconnect cable (1pc) --- Choseal 4N-OFC (99.99%), high quality RFI and EMI protection
www.ghentaudio.com
$11 for 2 meters, that's competitive with Amazon but there will be shipping costs and return won't be as easy:
Connection, like the Monoprice, is same as that recommended in that Hypex article except no RC network that should be expected for such low cost items. The only minor difference is,, Monoprice has that redundant pin1 also connected to the XLR connector shell. I prefer GhentAudio's as it visually would look the same as shown in Hypex's, not that it matters but it saves arguments from those who want to be "exactly" as shown by Hypex lol..
The price is cheap, if it truly is, as claimed, "star quad" so may be less noise prone than Monoprice's:
- RCA(Male) to XLR(Male) interconnect cable, Single(1pc)
- XLR Pinout: Pin1(GND)---Pin2(+)---Pin3(-)
- 100% handmade craftwork by experienced engineers
- Cable: Canare L-4E6S Star Quad, 95% coverage braided shield, exceptional RFI and EMI protection
- Connector: Yongsheng Gold-plated RCA, ROXTONE Gold-plated 3Pin XLR
- Solder: Lead free, Rosin Core with 3% Silver, 0.5% Copper and Tin
Last edited:
It is not necessarily only high current in the ground that causes audible issues since there are other coupling mechanisms, gain, impedances, etc. are at play. But as you said this topic has been debated endlessly, I do not see my contributions making any difference, and is somewhat off-topic for the thread.
I always appreciate your contributions to any such technically oriented posts that involved some EE theories in more depth than the daily ones. It is sort of still on topic because it has been asked many times on such threads which RCA to XLR cables to use with amplifiers such as buckeyeamps, that typically only comes with XLR (imo a good thing, why make people for for things they may not need at all and if they do, it is easy for them to buy it separately).
I realize there are other causes for audible issues but in this endless debate, we, at least as far as I realize, is focus on whether the Monoprice cable is wired to that Hypex article' recommendations.
Again, your posts are always appreciated, but for the benefit of those still interested in such RCA to XLR cables, and Hypex's recommendations, I would like to summarize my own observations (or contribution by linking the relevant articles, diagrams etc.)
, based on the diagrams (all been posted) that Monoprice cable does follow the recommendations contained in one of the following Hypex datasheet in at least practical sense (not "exact" sense, mainly because it has that unnecessary jumper to chassis). Anyway, with due respect, I would not want to bother you further so will post my summary in a separate post.Thanks again for chiming in!
@rvsixer , @Buckeye Amps : I suddenly remember there are more useful/clearer info in, strangely, the product sheet of one of their DIY series amps, I had posted that before too but might have been on another thread.
If you have downloaded that datasheet (for the NC400), it is on page 17. Really no difference that the "pin1 legacy..: article that has already been posted but in this one, they actually covered the what I referred to as the "practical" part, that is, when shield such as Monoprice's is present.
Here you can see that they clearly shows pin1 connected to the shield, and the chassis, and no RC network. With this, and thanks to Hypex, I have done my part in responding to your original post on the Monoprice premier RCA-XLR cable and the Hypex pin 1 connection related articles.
So, like DonH56, I also have nothing more to contribute but if I missed any important aspects on this, would still be interested to know what I missed, or wrong about it.
If you have downloaded that datasheet (for the NC400), it is on page 17. Really no difference that the "pin1 legacy..: article that has already been posted but in this one, they actually covered the what I referred to as the "practical" part, that is, when shield such as Monoprice's is present.
Here you can see that they clearly shows pin1 connected to the shield, and the chassis, and no RC network. With this, and thanks to Hypex, I have done my part in responding to your original post on the Monoprice premier RCA-XLR cable and the Hypex pin 1 connection related articles.
So, like DonH56, I also have nothing more to contribute but if I missed any important aspects on this, would still be interested to know what I missed, or wrong about it.
If you're located in Canada, Digiflex makes some good cables that (for me) hit the sweet spot between Monoprice and BJC.
https://digiflexcables.com/products/nxmr as an example
https://digiflexcables.com/products/nxmr as an example
OP
- Joined
- May 28, 2020
- Messages
- 2,200
- Likes
- 8,751
- Thread Starter
- #2,294
Hey, Iowa Hawkeye colors...
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2022
- Messages
- 715
- Likes
- 842
Dylan,
Thank you and your supplier for again extending the optional colors to the smallest enclosures available. Every day I enjoy looking at my Buckeye Amp NC502MP in its enclosure with (now discontinued) anodized finishes of 'clear aluminum' over 'bronze'. I consider the cost of creating a 'one-off' to be nominal and worth the wait time.
Consider reviving a gallery on your website of enclosures ordered with optional powder coat colors.
Attachments
Dennis_FL
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Ohio State puts away Notre Dame to claim CFP championship - Jan 20, 2025
A simple post from Japan:
I could just find by Google search what is "CFP championship".
And, also I could just confirm the corporate address of Buckeye Amps.
I could just find by Google search what is "CFP championship".
And, also I could just confirm the corporate address of Buckeye Amps.
Last edited:
After ordering my Buckeye amp recently, I was about to order the Monoprice XLR->RCA cables and just mod them into the RCA->XLR Hypex recommended configuration (which is of course posted throughout this thread if curious ).
But after seeing some Monoprice Premium cable review photos of what's inside (poor build quality, signal wires possibly not actual twisted pair, etc.), I again started scouring the interwebs for a proper cable. Every single Amazon cable I found that actually had a wiring diagram, was wired incorrectly most of them tying pins 1 & 3 together at the XLR...as was the case with well know manufacturers that have been listed in this thread.
Finally found what appears to be an excellent, properly twisted pair wired, high component quality, custom made cable at a somewhat okay price (low enough for me not to bother with my usual DIY tendencies anyway):
https://benchmarkmedia.com/collections/cables/products/benchmark-rca-to-xlrm-adapter-cable
It exactly matches the Hypex recommended pinout, and I also verified with their staff before ordering that the XLR case is indeed floating.
Will update here after both amp and cables arrive. Might be interesting to have a Hypex recommended vs. non-Hypex "standard" cable config ASR test, to see if there are any differences at the amps output .
).But after seeing some Monoprice Premium cable review photos of what's inside (poor build quality, signal wires possibly not actual twisted pair, etc.), I again started scouring the interwebs for a proper cable. Every single Amazon cable I found that actually had a wiring diagram, was wired incorrectly most of them tying pins 1 & 3 together at the XLR...as was the case with well know manufacturers that have been listed in this thread.
Finally found what appears to be an excellent, properly twisted pair wired, high component quality, custom made cable at a somewhat okay price (low enough for me not to bother with my usual DIY tendencies anyway):
https://benchmarkmedia.com/collections/cables/products/benchmark-rca-to-xlrm-adapter-cable
It exactly matches the Hypex recommended pinout, and I also verified with their staff before ordering that the XLR case is indeed floating.
Will update here after both amp and cables arrive. Might be interesting to have a Hypex recommended vs. non-Hypex "standard" cable config ASR test, to see if there are any differences at the amps output
.
Last edited:
OP
- Joined
- May 28, 2020
- Messages
- 2,200
- Likes
- 8,751
- Thread Starter
- #2,300
Maybe it is time we start offering our own RCA to XLR cables.....what say the masses?
Similar threads
