All About UFO's

[WillBrink]

There are believers and disbelievers. I listen to what they say and evaluate it.

Sean Kirkpatrick has been proven to have publicly provided false information. E.g., he claimed to have not met Brandon Fugal. Then, Brandon Fugal released a photograph of a meeting in DC he was invited to lead, and staring right at the camera was Sean Kirkpatrick. Considering that Sean Kirkpatrick not long after was tasked to lead AARO, it is difficult for me to believe he just forgot...

For every video of a skeptic that is posted, someone else can post a video of someone who claims to know the phenomena is real. The number of videos on either side of the subject are countless. It is interesting to learn the different perspectives, but at this point to faithfully believe one side or the other just shows one's own biases.

Multiple times. He claimed to have tried to contact Grusch to obtain more info, Grusch said that's BS, he was not contacted at all, said Kirkpatrick lied. And on it goes. We all have our biases, I personally don't think Kirkpatrick nor the Org he lead is anything but a modern day equivalent of Project Blue Book. No one trusts the AARO and for good reasons. If any real efforts to expose what the government knows about UFO's takes place, it surely will not come from those who spent 80 years or so suppressing it, at least not willingly.

 

[terryforsythe]

Multiple times. He claimed to have tried to contact Grusch to obtain more info, Grusch said that's BS, he was not contacted at all, said Kirkpatrick lied. And on it goes. We all have our biases, I personally don't think Kirkpatrick nor the Org he lead is anything but a modern day equivalent of Project Blue Book. No one trusts the AARO and for good reasons. If any real efforts to expose what the goverment knows about UFO's takes place, it surely will not come from the DOD, at least not willingly.

From the analyses I have seen, the reports generated by AARO under Kirkpatrick's lead cherry picked cases which could be easily dismissed, but completely ignored the more compelling cases. Many, many people have voiced great distrust in Kirkpatrick.

Even going back to Blue Book, there were numerous cases in the Condon report that could not be explained, but Condon completely ignored those when generating the report's summary and conclusion. The news media read the summary and conclusion and just spread the news that there is nothing to see, never having read the sections of the report Condon completely ignored.

 

[WillBrink]

From the analyses I have seen, the reports generated by AARO under Kirkpatrick's lead cherry picked cases which could be easily dismissed, but completely ignored the more compelling cases. Many, many people have voiced great distrust in Kirkpatrick.

Even going back to Blue Book, there were numerous cases in the Condon report that could not be explained, but Condon completely ignored those when generating the report's summary and conclusion. The news media read the summary and conclusion and just spread the news that there is nothing to see, never having read the sections of the report Condon completely ignored.

And yet the highly respected scientist they hired (1) to debunk the UFO thing, ended up a believer after the evidence he saw. You'd think that would be a tip off to the denial types.

(1) https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/all-about-ufos.45477/page-69#post-2034894

 

[GaryH]

Sean Kirkpatrick has been proven to have publicly provided false information. E.g., he claimed to have not met Brandon Fugal. Then, Brandon Fugal released a photograph of a meeting in DC he was invited to lead, and staring right at the camera was Sean Kirkpatrick. Considering that not long after Sean Kirkpatrick was tasked to lead AARO, it is difficult for me to believe he just forgot...

Why? People forget things, names and faces of people they've once been in a room with all the time. And no, Kirkpatrick was not "invited to lead" that meeting. Here are the facts (from around 12 minutes in):

Part 1 of his interview is here.

He claimed to have tried to contact Grusch to obtain more info, Grusch said that's BS, he was not contacted at all, said Kirkpatrick lied. And on it goes.

No it doesn't go on, because we now know from Freedom of Information Act requested documents that was just more utter bullshit from Grusch:

FOIA Documents Reveal AARO’s Authorized and Repeated Attempts to Engage with David Grusch - The Black Vault

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GNITLBj0hM The All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office (AARO), tasked to investigate Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena (UAP), made numerous attempts to interview UFO whistleblower David Grusch regarding his claims of U.S. Government engagement with extraterrestrial...

www.theblackvault.com

 

[terryforsythe]

nd no, Kirkpatrick was not "invited to lead" that meeting.

That's not what I said. Brandon Fugal lead the meeting. In the picture is Fugal standing up giving the presentation, and Kirkpatrick is staring right at the camera. It was a 2 1/2 hour meeting where Kirkpatrick sat directly across from Fugal, according to Fugal.

 

[terryforsythe]

Another take on Kirkpatrick (since you guys love videos):

 

[terryforsythe]

Here is a video interviewing Danny Sheehan regarding Kirkpatrick:

 

[GaryH]

That's not what I said.

That's what Fugal said though. He said Kirkpatrick was "one of the individuals leading the discussion". That is false, as confirmed by Hal Puthoff, another attendee at the meeting. And that's just one of several falsehoods espoused by Fugal about that meeting as exposed in that video I linked, mistruths and lies which are par for the course for him and his other Skinwalker Ranch nutcase/grifter paranormal pals.

 

[terryforsythe]

Look, the DOD is and has been perpetrating a deep misinformation campaign related to the UFO/UAP subject for decades and decades. It appears to me that Kirkpatrick was pulled into that campaign.

The question is what are they hiding. It could be they are promulgating UAP misinformation to create confusion. Is that to cover up certain special access programs unrelated to UAPs? Is it to cover up special access programs that do pertain to UAPs? I don't know the answer. But the DOD has been spending a lot of money and hidden those expenditures from Congress, which is illegal. The DOD continually fails its financial audits year after year, and the American taxpayers just bury their heads in the sand. At least now Congress is finally starting to look into what is going on.

 

[Chester]

There are believers and disbelievers. I listen to what they say and evaluate it.

There is a clear difference though, that’s the point. People like Steven Greenstreet and Mick West lay out their working and explain how they came to their conclusions. You can assess it and make an informed opinion on the topic.

All we ever get from the prominent believers is “Trust me, it’s definitely 100% true. I can’t tell you any specifics right now but what I’ve seen or been told is huge.”

Think about it logically, if all they really wanted was to expose this thing to the world, they just need 1 genuine and obvious piece of evidence (which they would easily have if this was all based in reality) and distribute it to the worlds media. That would be it done, they would have shown the world without doubt that aliens exist and they are or have been here. There would be nothing any government or group could do about it.

But it’s all bullshit, because they don’t have anything and don’t really want that. They want money and some of them attention/fame.

I follow both sides as I’m always open to someone coming through with something more compelling, but it just never comes.

 

[solderdude]

Its just like the 'every component has a tonal character' crowd.
They won't/can't prove it and have their own cult and are happy in that belief (that's all it is, a religion) and find 'evidence' everywhere.
That is totally human behavior.

Sure ... there are some designs that actually do change the sound and is admissible in court (measurable) which sets the stage for the audiophool believers to believe everything matters.
Just like there appear to be some (yet)Unexplained Aerial Phenomenon observed and the more you get into it the more you run into believers with theories.
The same is true for audio... there you can also find (electronics) experts making the claims and the more you read about it the more one gets sucked into the 'religion' they have.

Due to human nature, wanting to explain/believe what they (or others) observe it is easy to think they are right and 'onto' something.
Just like with audio ... the smoking gun (bias removed) will never be found and the mystery with all the money grabbing will persist.

That's my take on it. IF there is a technically superior alien race interested in observing the evolution of man, for whatever reason, then they are technically so advanced we look like people living in the stone age to them.
Questions like who they are (if they really visit here), where they come from and why they are here and how they do that will remain unanswered.

All we humans have the continuing soap between the two sides with lies and truths mixed on both sides. The reality probably lies somewhere in the middle... opinions ...

 

[terryforsythe]

All we ever get from the prominent believers is “Trust me, it’s definitely 100% true. I can’t tell you any specifics right now but what I’ve seen or been told is huge.”

That statement is partially true. In the Congressional hearing, I agree that David Grusch held back a lot of information supposedly due to security classifications, but David Fravor and Ryan Graves both didn't seem, at least to me, to be holding anything back.

Think about it logically, if all they really wanted was to expose this thing to the world, they just need 1 genuine and obvious piece of evidence (which they would easily have if this was all based in reality) and distribute it to the worlds media. That would be it done, they would have shown the world without doubt that aliens exist and they are or have been here. There would be nothing any government or group could do about it.

I fully agree. The problem is that it is the military that has the sensors capable of detecting the supposed UAPs, and they keep most of the data classified. The only time they release radar and image data is when it serves their propaganda. During the Irag and Afghanistan wars, the military had no qualms about releasing all kinds of radar and image data, but when it comes to UAPs it usually is classified.

Maybe these objects are those of foreign adversaries, and the DOD does not want to reveal how much we know about them. At this point all we can do is speculate. But, if this is the case, why do they let those objects repeatedly enter our air space and spy on our military resources?

 

[solderdude]

At this point all we can do is speculate.

This ... people have been speculating forever and will continue to do so in the future.

Same thing with audio, chemtrails, sasquatch, chupacabra, monster of Loch Ness, paranormal, alternative healing, God(s) and whatnot.

 

[antcollinet]

This ... people have been speculating forever and will continue to do so in the future.

Same thing with audio, chemtrails, sasquatch, chupacabra, monster of Loch Ness, paranormal, alternative healing, God(s) and whatnot.

I found I lacked the energy for engaging with this bullshit. Thanks for doing it so I don't feel the need.

 

[WillBrink]

Not it doesn't go on,

It does whether you like or not.

because we now know from Freedom of Information Act requested documents that was just more utter bullshit from Grusch:

FOIA Documents Reveal AARO’s Authorized and Repeated Attempts to Engage with David Grusch - The Black Vault

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GNITLBj0hM The All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office (AARO), tasked to investigate Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena (UAP), made numerous attempts to interview UFO whistleblower David Grusch regarding his claims of U.S. Government engagement with extraterrestrial...

www.theblackvault.com

I got the information third party, not read anything that came direct from Grusch on the matter. So either sources I saw were wrong, or taken out of context, or Grusch is simply wrong. It's another example of ongoing conflicting between people, which, wait for it, will continue on, until additional evidence/research happens, and or, additional disclosure takes place.

 

[WillBrink]

This ... people have been speculating forever and will continue to do so in the future.

There's a strong push for more evidence, either developed or revealed, and should result in less speculation. Enough to satisfy the most skeptical? We don't know, but that it's become an openly discussed topic among scientists, congress, defense officials, etc in our life time is promising. I'm tired as hell of speculating.

Same thing with audio, chemtrails, sasquatch, chupacabra, monster of Loch Ness, paranormal, alternative healing, God(s) and whatnot.

Not the same, each requires examination based on evidence, or lack there of. Placing them all in the same pile makes little sense to dismiss the topic of this thread. I can't blame some of throwing up their hands and lumping them together in frustration, but I don't think it's remotely a fair equivalent.

 

[dkinric]

Some good resource sites around this topic:

UFO Timeline

Overview of the UFO Phenomenon

ufotimeline.com

UFO Panel – The UFO Phenomenon

A collection of real UFO evidence. Quotes, famous cases, video and image sightings, press conferences, media reports, documentaries, documents and more.

ufopanel.com

 

[terryforsythe]

Either NHI is visiting Earth, or it is not. It is that simple.

What is not simple to explain is why so many people, most very highly respected, coming out of very high positions in government assert the former is the truth, while physical evidence to support their positions wholly is lacking in the public domain.

Regardless of what is the truth, the DOD has made great effort and has spent tens, if not hundreds, of millions of taxpayer dollars, without proper Congressional oversight, only to create confusion and deception. Congress needs to get to the bottom of this.

 

[WillBrink]

Either NHI is visiting Earth, or it is not. It is that simple.

What is not simple to explain is why so many people, most very highly respected, coming out of very high positions in government assert the former is the truth, while physical evidence to support their positions wholly is lacking in the public domain.

Regardless of what is the truth, the DOD has made great effort and has spent tens, if not hundreds, of millions of taxpayer dollars, without proper Congressional oversight, only to create confusion and deception. Congress needs to get to the bottom of this.

Agreed on all fronts. You opened a bunch of possible topics of discussion tangential to the larger picture, all sub topics of their own. Seen that vid by Eric W? He went from total skeptic to something else. He's using the same decision tree you are, and I am: Either NHI is visiting us, or they are not, but the "weirdness" as he calls it, is real. Now what?

 

[Randy Bessinger]

This ... people have been speculating forever and will continue to do so in the future.

Same thing with audio, chemtrails, sasquatch, chupacabra, monster of Loch Ness, paranormal, alternative healing, God(s) and whatnot.

Thank you!