A $15k music streamer reviewed on stereophile

[PatentLawyer]

Do we have any measurements yet. If someone says it sounds good what's so hard to believe about that.
If it does measure well and everyone is convinced that this is the only criteria that matters the price won't make any difference 'objectively speaking'. If it measures either well or poorly and sounds like shit, it's a piece of shit.
You guys are just being single-minded ass-holes not making any valid arguments and always deliberately understating
any opinion based on the only thing that matters in this business, LISTENING to music. Leave the guy alone.

As hard as it is to believe, I haven’t been called an asshole yet today, so thanks for that!

 

[voodooless]

You guys are just being single-minded ass-holes not making any valid arguments and always deliberately understating any opinion based on the only thing that matters in this business, LISTENING to music.

So asking for proof makes us evil ass-holes?

Leave the guy alone.

Why? He did not have to post here. If you post that kind of subjective views without any substantiation, you will be challenged on those. I can agree on the tone of conversation… but right back at ya!

 

[Larry B. Larabee]

As hard as it is to believe, I haven’t been called an asshole yet today, so thanks for that!

Sure PL, this forum is a laugh riot and I try to do my best to keep the faithful hopping.
Being a patent lawyer you must be tired of hyperbole so you drop by here for the same reason I do, I guess.

 

[ahofer]

You guys are just being single-minded ass-holes not making any valid arguments and always deliberately understating
any opinion based on the only thing that matters in this business, LISTENING to music. Leave the guy alone.

1. No that is NOT the only thing that matters, because we believe what is audible is measurable. Don't pretend you don't know that's what most of us believe here, it's EVERYWHERE in this forum.
2. Thanks for bringing out the A-Hole comment in your "leave him alone" cry, that's self-defeating
3. He came here looking for a fight, dripping with insults. Joined today and went right to the troll. This is the reaction he wanted (and, I think, you want). He was probably hoping for less substance, though.

 

[PatentLawyer]

Sure PL, this forum is a laugh riot and I try to do my best to keep the faithful hopping.
Being a patent lawyer you must be tired of hyperbole so you drop by here for the same reason I do, I guess.

I’m a trial lawyer; hyperbole pays my bills.

 

[Larry B. Larabee]

So asking for proof makes us evil ass-holes?

Why? He did not have to post here. If you post that kind of subjective views without any substantiation, you will be challenged on those. I can agree on the tone of conversation… but right back at ya!

If he is so wrong why bother. It's already obvious to everyone. Substantiation? WTF?

 

[Madjalapeno]

If he is so wrong why bother. It's already obvious to everyone. Substantiation? WTF?

Because not calling out idiots gets us to where we are today.

 

[Killingbeans]

Do we have any measurements yet. If someone says it sounds good what's so hard to believe about that.
If it does measure well and everyone is convinced that this is the only criteria that matters the price won't make any difference 'objectively speaking'. If it measures either well or poorly and sounds like shit, it's a piece of shit.

But... it's a streamer? Why would it measure poorly or sound like shit?

Unless the software is designed around some cockamania philosophy. But then we're just talking about the operating system. The stupendously expensive hunk of hardware itself is still pointless?

You guys are just being single-minded ass-holes not making any valid arguments and always deliberately understating
any opinion based on the only thing that matters in this business, LISTENING to music. Leave the guy alone.

Ass-holes, yes. This thread comes to mind:

Has civility on ASR declined recently?

I have noticed an increase in combative and insulting posts on ASR over the last couple of months--mostly, but not always, by new members. The posters definitely have not seemed to heed the message at the top of every forum page to Come here to have fun, be ready to be teased and not take online...

www.audiosciencereview.com

But like has already been pointed out, if you make your very first post on a forum: "You are all WRONG and you suck! And here's my anecdotal evidence to prove it. Take THAT!" you really ought to expect some backlash. And if you're a troll, you're probably counting on it.

The business should be about listening to music, but IMO it's not. It's mostly about making the end user believe that your specific product offers some unique advantage that is guaranteed to heighten your experience. Whether it's true or not doesn't play a huge role. The placebo effect nearly always gives you a get-out-of-jail-free card.

And you know what they say about opinions...

And, sure. It's okay to throw an opinion at people if you do the appropriate disclaimer. But if you present it as fact, don't come crying when people make it painfully clear that it's not so.

 

[_thelaughingman]

Guidelines to engage in meaningful conversations on ASR
- Engage in a topic from the perspective of wanting to learn something new about the hobby of being an audiophile.
- Contribute to the topic/thread with good knowledge that has some semblance of support in objective measurements or proven science.
- Disengage from making statements or claims that are steeped in subjective opinion. ie: a transparent dac at $5k is better sounding than a dac at $150. Etc

Lets try this instead folks.

 

[Larry B. Larabee]

Amir usually listens to what he tests to try to establish some correlation between the measurements and what he hears.
All I'm saying is that some of you seem to be awfully excitable.

 

[Robin L]

As hard as it is to believe, I haven’t been called an asshole yet today, so thanks for that!

But you're a lawyer!

Reminds me of a famous scene in "Lady From Shanghai".

Arthur Bannister:
"That's the first time anyone thought enough of you to call you a shark. If you were a good lawyer, you'd be flattered."

 

[BDWoody]

. If someone says it sounds good what's so hard to believe about that.

There is no reason or evidence to believe it does. What's so hard to get about an evidence based forum asking for some?

Someone wants to come here and make unlikely claims, especially with a bunch of insults thrown in, they often get what they are asking for. This isn't going to be a 'safe space' for people telling us we don't know what we're talking about, while relying on their golden ears as evidence.

SBAF (among many others) has extra capacity for that.

Amir usually listens to what he tests to try to establish some correlation between the measurements and what he hears.

Can you show me a DAC listening test he's done as part of a review? Not a headphone amp, that has practicality....a DAC, or normal amplifier, or network switch, or cable...
Any?

Speakers, headphone amps, and headphones get a listen.

 

[Madjalapeno]

Speakers, headphone amps, and headphones get a listen.

Be right back, going to listen to some USB cables. Might try some Cat-5 later when they're out of the freezer.

 

[_thelaughingman]

Be right back, going to listen to some USB cables. Might try some Cat-5 later when they're out of the freezer.

Make sure you also put a USB isolator in that chain to cut down the noise

 

[Madjalapeno]

Make sure you also put a USB isolator in that chain to cut down the noise

I need to find my Ikea doorstop first. Makes my DAC sound so much more, erm, fast.

 

[Robin L]

Can you show me a DAC listening test he's done as part of a review? Not a headphone amp, that has practicality....a DAC, or normal amplifier, or network switch, or cable...
Any?

Speakers, headphone amps, and headphones get a listen.

He recently reviewed a Topping Amp that had stellar measured performance and he also gave a rather subjective critique of its "sound". Not that I'm knocking him, or you, or God, or Rod Stewart, but he's written up a few subjective responses to amplifiers.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Having owned a lot of very used vintage gear, I know it is possible to design a particular quality of sound into an amplifier. Myself, I'd rather have clean. But a Fisher 500C is not going to sound like a Topping PA 5.

 

[_thelaughingman]

I need to find my Ikea doorstop first. Makes my DAC sound so much more, erm, fast.

Oh and don’t forget to put a heavy weight on top of the dac to cut down ultrasonic vibrations that may distort the sound. Okay I’m done egging you on.

 

[Killingbeans]

Amir usually listens to what he tests to try to establish some correlation between the measurements and what he hears.

Speakers and headphones, yes. Headphone amps too, just to see if they have enough power. Other electronics.. not so much. There's not really sufficient variation to warrant consistent listening tests.

All I'm saying is that some of you seem to be awfully excitable.

Yes. It's a hobby with a lot of emotions involved. As an Electronics Technician I mostly get ticked off by claims about audio signals defying the laws of physics. The bit about "science doesn't know how to measure everything yet!" speaks strongly to peoples emotions, and lets reasonable thinking take a back seat. It doesn't really make me angry... just painfully aware of the limitations of being human.

 

[Larry B. Larabee]

There is no reason or evidence to believe it does. What's so hard to get about an evidence based forum asking for some?

Someone wants to come here and make unlikely claims, especially with a bunch of insults thrown in, they often get what they are asking for. This isn't going to be a 'safe space' for people telling us we don't know what we're talking about, while relying on their golden ears as evidence.

SBAF (among many others) has extra capacity for that.



Can you show me a DAC listening test he's done as part of a review? Not a headphone amp, that has practicality....a DAC, or normal amplifier, or network switch, or cable...
Any?

Speakers, headphone amps, and headphones get a listen.

Good point, I never noticed it was only those items. How is it that a listening session is needed for some components and not others? I should read Amir's manifesto before asking the same questions of you when you've heard them hundreds of times. Just the link would help.
Thanks,
L

 

[Madjalapeno]

Okay I’m done egging you on.

Yeah. We should talk about something boring, like politics. [I would like to emphasize, this is sarcasm.]